Printable View
Hi all I recently put an aftermarket turbo on my 96 Gq 4.2 EFI its dual fuel (Petrol,Gas) and upon getting it dyno tuned it couldn't handle anymore than 4 pound boost which is pretty low it also pings from about 3000rpm on fuel and slightly on gas! so I was wondering if anyone else has turbo'd this motor before and if so have you managed more boost than this and did it ping?
cheers Mick
You may need to take some timing out of it, or try an octane booster.
Ideally you want to lower the compression
yeh mate I've try'd both octane booster helps but not completely and timing is set too advanced 8 degress I've tried both retarding it and advancing it either way and it either gets worse or dosent perform right.
Standard ecu? Standard injectors?
yeh mate both are standard. Have thought that but injectors and ecu should be sufficient enough for 4 pound boost surely!
It probably should but you want to run 2 fuels so it will always be hard to find the sweet spot.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mick Patroln
did you just bolt turbo on and do nothing else. or have you had petrol pressure upped and gas converter needs doing to.
Do you have an intercooler? Do you have a boost referenced fuel pressure regulator?
Your detonation could be caused by intake air temps too high and/or insufficient fuel under boost.
I had a new gas convertor fitted which is adjustable for tuning other than that mate just dyno tuned once turbo kit was fitted.
hi John its not intercooled as of yet in the process of doing that. and I havnt touched anything fuel pressure wise! I have been thinking its simply tuning or fuel and air mixtures but i'm unsure on how or wat to do.
There's nothing you can tune with a stock ECU that can change fuel mixtures. You'll need an engine management system for that. I believe Nistune are a popular choice for the 4.2 EFI.
A good fuel pressure regulator is a must. A 1 to 1 ratio boost reference will increase the fuel pressure by 1 psi for each psi of boost. This will compensate for the injectors trying to open against the increased manifold pressure.
It's common practice to also raise the base fuel pressure but this will cause rich idle if the ECU can't adjust sufficiently.
It can also make the standard fuel pump work harder.
ok yeh ive heard of nistune sounds like the way to go. I will look into the fuel regulator too then! thanks for your info john.
im runnning a 4psi turbo on my tb42e, to get it runnig you will need the ecu remapped, a nistune board fitted to the stock ecu is the cheapest/easiest way here, you will also more than likely need bigger fuel injectors(mine couldnt keep up at 4000rpm on 4psi) and quite possibly a bigger fuel pump.|you dont need an aftermarket fuel reg the std one is a 1:1 ratio and works fine
An adjustable fuel reg will allow you to increase the fuel pressure and might just be enough to avoid changing the injectors.
This is an extract from some of my research for my own turbo install:
"Can I raise my fuel pressure instead of fitting larger injectors?
Raising fuel pressure will flow more fuel through your injectors, which can be a great option if you are near the limit of your injectors. There is a limit to how much more fuel pressure you can run safely, though, and the extra fuel pressure will also make life harder for your fuel pump. Raising your fuel pressure is only really viable if you are looking for another five to 10 percent injector flow, otherwise you are better to fit larger injectors. "
Hi Mick are you running LPG or Natural Gas?
Lee
hi billy mate so dose yours ping at that boost what have you done to fix this and have you had it dyno'd interested to know wat you made at tyres?Quote:
Originally Posted by billyj
running lpg mate goes a lot harder than on fuel but tunning is a pain .Quote:
Originally Posted by sprdad
are you running the stock dizzy still because you need to have your dizzy retard under boost or at least limit its advance. the stock advance will be too much when boost comes on which will cause pinging. i would think that would more likely be your problem as if it was dyo tuned then you fuel mixtures woulda been checked and set accordingly. i had a 4k corolla that i supercharged. with a stock dizzy it would ping and killed plugs but i took out that dizzy and ran a welded ( fixed ) dizzy to stop the advance and the problem was fixed.
yeh bud the dizzy is stock ive replaced it once already with a second hand one and still pinged as far as rebuilding one goes I carnt find the parts to do it.Quote:
Originally Posted by warner01
Mick, you can't do anything with the dizzy. All timing advance or retard is controlled by the ECU.
You won't be able to adjust fuel or timing under boost until you get an engine management system. Either a Nistune daughterboard or a piggyback system, etc.
ok thanks john are you aware of any other piggyback systems available for this motor i've looked into nistune and have heard it would fix the pinging but decrease performance.Quote:
Originally Posted by jff45
Mick, why not start by getting the intake air temps down by fitting a nice big intercooler. Have a look at my TB45E turbo install thread where I posted a pic of my Ebay $159 IC.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mick Patroln
Then get some more petrol into it either with bigger injectors (I don't know what's available for the TB42E) or simply getting the fuel pressure up.
I have a friend in Panama who has a TB45E turbo and he runs the stock ECU to 6 psi. He has a top mounted IC and a Turbosmart rising rate FPR.
I'm currently running an Xede piggyback on my N/A TB45E and I'll be using that for my turbo as well. I picked it up some time ago on Ebay for $100.
If it doesn't do the job, I'll be going with a Megasquirt 3.
I've heard of others who have run secondhand Haltechs they picked up on Gumtree.
Anyway, that's the 1st time I've heard of a Nistune decreasing performance. Someone might need to change tuners..
I think an ex members Scotty used the wolf ECU when he turboed his 4.2efi, but also recall he ended up ripping his gas system out and going dedicated petrolQuote:
Originally Posted by Mick Patroln
http://www.wolfmotorsport.com.au/plu...rol/nis91.html
If you have a spare year, you can read his members ride thread here: http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...Grey-and-Ugly/
yeh nice rig you got there mate just checked it out will look into completing and fitting an intercooler then and see if that helps.A mechanic who installs nistune told me when I spoke with him last week that it would fix the pinging by levelling out the fuel and air mixtures and that the performance would drop as timing would be taken out of it I ask how it would go puting more boost in to increase performance and he said nistune wouldnt be capable of anymore he suggested halltech for performance increase. all getting to hard haha should just whack a ls2 in it lol.Quote:
Originally Posted by jff45
mine doesnt ping at all. had it dyno tuned with a nistune board, made 100kw at the rears on 33"s with major intake restriction from 3000rpm up and a restrictive 2.5" exhaust, even though it doesnt sound that high the differnce from stock is massive, tons more torque and it makes the power much earlier in the rev range
I'm also planning to keep my 2.5" exhaust with my turbo install..
2.5 will work but 3" would be alot better, at the very least fit a high flow cat and straight through muffler
It's the Redback system I installed when I fitted the pacemaker extractors and it's only done 5k kms so I'm not about to throw it away.
I'm confident it will be sufficient for my needs.
hi billy nice mate can you tell me what you made in horse power at the tyres and what boost you running?Quote:
Originally Posted by billyj
100kw is 134hp
yeh bud did the conversion cheers!
100kw/134hp at the rear wheels on 33" tyres on a lazy 4psi of boost non intercooled, got plenty more in it once i fit a bigger snorkel/airbox/exhaust and intercool it plan is to run 10psi by the end of the year
Nice mate have you got any pictures of set up tried seeing ya profile one but bit small to make? With mine I made 140hp at tyres running 33s with 10inch rims at 4 psi also I had 2.5inch exhaust and snorkel fitted. I now have a 3inch system with stainless high flow cat and muff. shit loads better in performance way it feels, but way out of tune now, I also had tappets done as they where rattly as . all that done it still pings haha was your nistune set up easily done?Quote:
Originally Posted by billyj
pretty sure the nistune board was easy but i had my tuner take care of that and fitting the 660cc injectors,i know my intake is way too small atm and the flex pipe coming off the maf is actually collapsing at revs making things worse, exhaust is an old 2.5" with a std cat and 3/4 collapsed muffler, planning to start the next stage soon once the tax man comes to the partyAttachment 47647Attachment 47648
looks good mate can tell you it goes a lot better with 3inch exhaust high flow cat and muffler so recommend getting that done for sure throws it out of tune a bit though if I can figure out this computer I will post a pic of what mine looks like. if you got the nistune fitted why don't you run higher boost?Quote:
Originally Posted by billyj
[ATTACH=CONFIG]47686
only running low boost as didnt have the time/money to upgrade the intake/exhaust when i fitted the turbo and trying to get any more boost in with the current steup was/is pointless. exhaust is my next upgrade in the next month or so, then ill fit a bigger snorkel with patrol docta zd30 style airbox, probly gonna go with a w2a cooler as well then ill fit the 10psi wastegate actuator thats sitting in the shed and have it retuned