Rear Air Locker - are they worth having over standard LSD?

Hi Guys,

Just a question in regards to air lockers. I have a 93 GQ TD42 which I am about to get an onboard compressor and front locker fitted to. I have heard that the rear LSD fitted to this truck is very reliable and will get you into and out of most places, so I am just wondering considering the cost and the fact I am doing the front anyway.. Is there any real advantage in having an air locked rear over the standard LSD? I heard that once you install the rear locker it is an open diff and you lose the LSD, requiring the locker to be used more where you would normally be ok with the LSD. I have also been told that with the front locker alone it's all you really need and can avoid extra cost of getting a rear locker if they don't offer any real advantage. What are people's thoughts on this?

Cheers,

Scotty

My opinion is that Patrols don't need rear lockers because the LSD is fantastic

In my GU I also got talked out of putting a locker in the rear. But now wish I had both front and rear!! I like the rear lockers for when traveling down steep descents and one rear side comes out of traction with the ground it allows the 4wd to over run and I don't like that at all so IMO I would get both.. The rear LSD in patrols are bloody good but they do start to let you down when your in the more hard core stuff.. Also I would not ever use ARB lockers again (have had ARB lockers for years in other 4wds) not after buying a Elocker.. They are just so much better in every way!!

Lewy

Stick with the LSD IMO. They're nearly like a locker anyway

From my trip away last weekend, my mate in his cruiser was constantly switching his locker on and off. I got everywhere he did, with a standard lsd. I don't know if I'd bother with a rear locker, mainly because of the awesome lsd.

Go the front locker only and put the extra cash towards the Turbo Setup you know you want....... For Sure !

Haha Thanks MudRunnerTD, yes there is a DTS turbo kit install planned as well!

it depends on how hard core you go. an lsd can turn into a poormans rear steer in some situation sometimes that can work in your favour sometimes it wont. on a track i regularly drive there is a section that i wish i had a rear locker because the lsd opens up and drags the front sidways and i get a bead leak every time. there are other tracks i drive where i use this to my advantage

i recommend getting just the front to start with, because unless you are changing ratios you will be up for the same coin if you do it now or later.
just if you fit locker to the rear now you will never know the virtues of the lsd. and you might find that the lsd suits what you want perfectly.

Cheers guys, thanks to you all for your replies. I think I'll just go the front locker for now and put the extra cash towards some other mods.

Thanks,

Scotty

good call TUFFGQ, locker in the rear if your competition orientated

I'm planning on a front E locker for my Q. The second part of the deal is in saving the money from doing the rear, I plan to put some low range reduction gears in the transfer case.
That will give me more control than a rear locker will.
Personally I like the idea of maintaining the LSD in the back end for highway/dirt road driving rather than just having it open all the time....


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I would add to this in saying go the front first, and then assess from there.

The question is do you really need both, or is it just so that you can say you have them...... I am constantly amazed, with some good driving, how far a standard 4WD will get without lockers, even some of the IFS types.

I had lockers years ago, and decided for the last few trucks that I wouldn't bother as most of my driving has been more sedate with a young family in tow.....and I try to avoid mud holes like the plague....
I recently went down one track where we were told that we wouldn't make it unless we have 'diff locks', and all four of us drove straight out without lockers ( we are all fairly experienced though ).

That's a good point....lots of folks with trucks now buy lockers as their first mod and I wonder how helpful that is in developing good driving skills and habits.
In the 18 months I've been driving (as opposed to navi) I've learned plenty about driving various types of tracks and have on a couple of occasions learned the current limits of my skill set!
Lockers would have possibly got me into even greater hot water than I found myself at the time.
From what I've observed, one mans "must use lockers" track is another mans piece o' p......


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Originally Posted by Drewboyaus

That's a good point....lots of folks with trucks now buy lockers as their first mod and I wonder how helpful that is in developing good driving skills and habits.
In the 18 months I've been driving (as opposed to navi) I've learned plenty about driving various types of tracks and have on a couple of occasions learned the current limits of my skill set!
Lockers would have possibly got me into even greater hot water than I found myself at the time.
From what I've observed, one mans "must use lockers" track is another mans piece o' p......

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How true - How true

I am saving to do the front but am aware of many saying how they love it but it does make them lazy in there driving style as they expect the locker to do the hard work and not the nut behind the wheel...

I am even thinking of doing a front locker in mine as well, and I think that I will try the new E-Locker, as it seems to be getting rave reviews

So far I have heard nothing but good things about the E-locker

I honestly don't think I'll ever get a manual locker, not in this car anyway. I have done some serious tracks which others say lockers are a must... All they seem to do is break CVs

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Originally Posted by Winnie

I honestly don't think I'll ever get a manual locker, not in this car anyway. I have done some serious tracks which others say lockers are a must... All they seem to do is break CVs

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Bang on there with that.....short of driving very extreme tracks (and slippery, muddy ruts) with good tyres and a bit of lift the Q will just about go anywhere, anywhere I need it to anyway.
Perhaps it comes down to technique.....
I would expect to have to use less right boot than I need to now with a front locker.



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I have a lockrite in the front of my Maverick & busted a CV axle a couple of weeks ago but I love it, it gets the front over where as before it just wouldnt climb some tricky twisty bits, I am now chasing one for my GU for the front

I love my lockers but was talked into both by toyota drivers (as we all know they have terrible lsd's) Didn't do enough research and got carried away with the hype. Being manual lockers does give me the option which I always choose to try the track first without using them, then switch one on at a time. However i wish I had just got the front and put that money to a lift or turbo etc.

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Originally Posted by Bloodyaussie

I am saving to do the front but am aware of many saying how they love it but it does make them lazy in there driving style as they expect the locker to do the hard work and not the nut behind the wheel...

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Only if you turn it on! With a manually activated front locker off, the vehicle drives exactly the same as it did with the open front diff. So you can still have a good go and actually use the grey matter to help you get through, and then if it's still not enough, CLICK :)

Or, if you are actually feeling lazy, just turn it on, drive through, turn it off... after a long day of playing in the tracks I am often tired enough to do this rather than go for the challenge.

But as Drewboyaus and a few others have commented, the real gift of a locker (or two) is the ability to do everything at a slower pace - good for the vehicle, good for the track.

Anyway, to answer the question - no need for a rear locker in a Patrol unless you are already struggling for traction with a front locker.

Sorry for the question....again....But do GU/GR Patrols not come equipped with rear diff locks?

Mine has a diff lock switch on it,that I assumed, operated a rear diff lock, am I wrong in that thought?

Sorry just noticed the 93 year in the original post.

throw a Pro locker in the front . the rear LSD is one of the best in the business

Fracster,
My best guess is that switch is for the centre diff-lock.
I'm not a GU driver mind, so don't trust me...:-)


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Originally Posted by Drewboyaus

Fracster,
My best guess is that switch is for the centre diff-lock.
I'm not a GU driver mind, so don't trust me...:-)


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no centre diff on any patrol. Some gq ti and gu and all gu8 come with a rear diff lock got to do with abs ebd and other letters that mean computer stuff as the won't work with an led as it applied brakes to each wheel individually it would lock the other wheel or something

Iv had just fronts in a few cars and both in a few, -for what i do i keep going back to F&R in my bashers. iv had about a dozen ARB airlockers. and currently have 3.

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Originally Posted by fracster

Sorry for the question....again....But do GU/GR Patrols not come equipped with rear diff locks?

Mine has a diff lock switch on it,that I assumed, operated a rear diff lock, am I wrong in that thought?

Sorry just noticed the 93 year in the original post.

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We are not as lucky as some of the Nissan Patrol owners from the Northern Hemisphere. We had Diff Locks as standard options for Diesels back in 1988, and now in late 2012, and there were somePetrol top of the range models around 1999 - 2001.... that was it for us.

Any Diff Locks needed to be aftermarket for the rest of us.

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Originally Posted by Jacket_1985

Iv had just fronts in a few cars and both in a few, -for what i do i keep going back to F&R in my bashers. iv had about a dozen ARB airlockers. and currently have 3.

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Yeah, but you actually use them.......

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Originally Posted by happygtu

We are not as lucky as some of the Nissan Patrol owners from the Northern Hemisphere. We had Diff Locks as standard options for Diesels back in 1988, and now in late 2012, and there were somePetrol top of the range models around 1999 - 2001.... that was it for us.

Any Diff Locks needed to be aftermarket for the rest of us.

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Thanks for the clarification mate, i`m getting to know how my Patrol works a bit better now.

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Originally Posted by Drewboyaus

Lockers would have possibly got me into even greater hot water than I found myself at the time.
From what I've observed, one mans "must use lockers" track is another mans piece o' p......

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How true is this comment? Just think of the weekenders who buy their new toy, and first mod is a locker. This would give the inexperienced, like me, a false sense of courage. I want a locker myself but this is one thing I must be very wary of if I had one. Don't think, because I have a locker I can do anything.
Plus if I had one I would be expected to do all the bog holes and monster hill climbs first...And get through them.

Keep the rear LSD.
It would be a pain to drive on road with an open rear end esp. on wet roads.
Lets face it, even the most hard core 4wder does 99% of his km on the road, even if its dirt roads.
I wouldnt bother with the front locker either unless you plan to carry spare CV and tools to replace it when it goes bang. Not sure if you can get hub fuses for GQ but that would be a must if I was to fit a front locker.

in my opinion a front locker allows you to travel slower and more controlled thus reducing the risk of breaking things such as cv's

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Originally Posted by 89gqpatrol4x4

in my opinion a front locker allows you to travel slower and more controlled thus reducing the risk of breaking things such as cv's

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My guess is that part of the problem is folks don't adjust their driving style when the put lockers in.


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Drewboyaus

My guess is that part of the problem is folks don't adjust their driving style when the put lockers in.

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Part of which problem? The referenced comment certainly doesn't reflect a problematic driving style.

Dual lockers are simply awesome, except when they are not. If I had my time again I'd go AirLocker front and standard GU LSD back, I tell people I get sick of flicking the rear locker on to drive stuff an average Korean 4WD would cruise through, but really how upset am I about it... when both Airlockers are activated my GU will drive through some ridiculous terrain.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 89gqpatrol4x4

in my opinion a front locker allows you to travel slower and more controlled thus reducing the risk of breaking things such as cv's

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Couldn't agree more!! For the people that say that all it does is blow CVs are either driving stupidly or have never had the experience in having one.... ;-) Having lockers does not make you a lazy driver!!! But what it does do is save the tracks from being totally destroyed there for better for the environment!!.. Also pus way less wear and tear on your 4wd...

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Originally Posted by Squalo

Part of which problem? The referenced comment certainly doesn't reflect a problematic driving style.

Dual lockers are simply awesome, except when they are not. If I had my time again I'd go AirLocker front and standard GU LSD back, I tell people I get sick of flicking the rear locker on to drive stuff an average Korean 4WD would cruise through, but really how upset am I about it... when both Airlockers are activated my GU will drive through some ridiculous terrain.

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Sorry, my point was that statement is quite correct.....what I omitted was "the problem with broken CV's"......


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A cheap alternative is to shim the LSD to just tighter than factory giving a little less slip.
Ive ordered one. If i put it in i'll leave some feedback