2"lift.....now castor correction needed...3.5deg????

Hi guys, just had the 2"suspension kit (heavy duty tough dog, that goes up nearly 3") from old patrol put into the new one and got a wheel alignment, now the castor is out by 3.5 deg.....wtf....not too sure which way to go now.

The reason I got the kit in the first place (back in 07) is because when we go away on big trips we are loaded up pretty heavily and towing a camper trailer. But as there are no big trips planned for the foreseeable future maybe going back to a softer spring is a better way to go and still keep the airbags in the rear. After talking with tough dog a few years ago they said I needed more weight on the vehicle, but I don't want it that heavy all the time. It still needs to be driven to and from work and around town without bouncing the kidneys out the window, but still be able to handle weight when we do go away.

On this new patrol it has a nissan steel winch bar on the front and a 12500lb tmax winch to go into it (still on floor in shed) and a set of rear drawers with an agm battery mounted in behind the rhs drawer, and I will be mounting another agm battery behind the Lhs drawer.

Cheers

Greg

I dont like Tough Dog for this reason mate, Really hard ride and they say put a load in??

I have Old Man Emu in the GUIV and love it. i went their comp spec stuff in 3" and that is deemed a little softer than normal and i put the airbags in the back.

Well with a big touring load on and a camper trailer on the back i dont need to put air in the air bags!!!!

Junk the Tough Dog, whoever set it up for you last time got it wrong mate, you should not need to wear a kidney belt of run around fully loaded to make your suspension behave. Junk.

Buy new springs and shocks and sell your tough dog kit, you will get good coin for it and will be much happier.

A mate has 3inch tough dog springs and Rancho adjustable shocks. He got castor correction bushes. When the shocks are on 2 (second softest) it rides beautifully. This is in an unloaded gq wagon.

Tap, crackle, pop

i just fitted a tough dog 3' lift a few weeks ago to my gq wagon and unloaded it still rides really well. not super harsh or anything. + flexes like a champ

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MudRunnerTD

I dont like Tough Dog for this reason mate, Really hard ride and they say put a load in??

I have Old Man Emu in the GUIV and love it. i went their comp spec stuff in 3" and that is deemed a little softer than normal and i put the airbags in the back.

Well with a big touring load on and a camper trailer on the back i dont need to put air in the air bags!!!!

Junk the Tough Dog, whoever set it up for you last time got it wrong mate, you should not need to wear a kidney belt of run around fully loaded to make your suspension behave. Junk.

Buy new springs and shocks and sell your tough dog kit, you will get good coin for it and will be much happier.

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MudRunner, thanks mate. We are off camping this weekend with the camper in tow so will see how it goes. Might just price an OME kit anyway, atleast I will know what I will be up for if I need to replace this setup.

Cheers

Greg.

Sorry for the late reply I have been at work and I when I got home I was straight out to the shed to to get it ready for this weekend.

taslucas, johno90, thanks for the replies fellas. Our patrol is quite rough when unladen, wish it wasn't so! but when loaded up it rides really well.

Cheers

Greg

sorry for the late reply as well, I have been out in the shed all night getting ready for this weekend.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gregs

Hi guys, just had the 2"suspension kit (heavy duty tough dog, that goes up nearly 3") from old patrol put into the new one and got a wheel alignment, now the castor is out by 3.5 deg.....wtf....not too sure which way to go now.

The reason I got the kit in the first place (back in 07) is because when we go away on big trips we are loaded up pretty heavily and towing a camper trailer. But as there are no big trips planned for the foreseeable future maybe going back to a softer spring is a better way to go and still keep the airbags in the rear. After talking with tough dog a few years ago they said I needed more weight on the vehicle, but I don't want it that heavy all the time. It still needs to be driven to and from work and around town without bouncing the kidneys out the window, but still be able to handle weight when we do go away.

On this new patrol it has a nissan steel winch bar on the front and a 12500lb tmax winch to go into it (still on floor in shed) and a set of rear drawers with an agm battery mounted in behind the rhs drawer, and I will be mounting another agm battery behind the Lhs drawer.

Cheers

Greg

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Trust me when you are fully loaded up for a big trip you will need those HD coils in the rear. You dont need them in the front though. Once you go over 2" you need castor correction bushes so just put medium duty 2" in the front, about 260 lb/in spring rate

Bordertech, will that spring rate be ok the winch in the front bar as well? I am going to take the agm battery from under the bonnet and put it in the rear drawers where I have mounting brackets already, so I guess this will counteract the winch??.....The funny thing is that the kit came from the old patrol (07 CRD auto wagon) and it had a 2 deg castor kit in it, but this one they are saying that I need a 3.5deg kit.

cheers

Greg

Yes, I've tried higher rate coils in the front and the ride was very harsh, wouldn't flex etc. In my GQ I've got 7yr old T/Dog 225lb/in in the front, no sway bar, and have a winch, steel bar, dual batteries, 4 spottys, TD42 turbo etc and I find it very adequate for the GQ. They 6" though so there's plenty of travel. With lower coils I'd go a bit higher than 225lb as the pressure increases as the coil compresses and lower springs need more lb/in rate so they dont bottom out too easy.
Factory std GU coils are only 205lb/in and people wonder why their front bump stops break!
I've just fitted H/D 2" TD coils and Coil Rite air bags in the rear of a GU coil cab steel tray and the rear went up 3.5" over std without any air in the bags! But that's ok because it will have a load on the back most of the time as it's a farm ute and when touring it will have a slide on camper and also be towing an 18' off road cvan. In the front I put in 240lb/in Ironman coils, has a bull bar and spottys but no winch. Bit firm in the rear with the 45mm TD adjustables on lowest setting but had nothing on the tray when I test drove it. It has a 90lt sub tank on the drivers side and 50lt LPG on the LHS (deiselgas) but unladen it's not much less weight than a wagon.

I also made and welded in a coil brace kit as coil Patrols are renown for the coil hats breaking out of the chassis with a heavy load and/or air bags because of the thin chassis wall the coil hats are welded to and usually the chassis bends in half too when that happens

Thanks for the info Bordertech, greatly appreciated. I will be going to the shop where they refitted this susp setup (to get a safari snorkel fitted) so I will ask them what rate the front coils are and if they are too high I will get some lower rate ones.

Have you had much to do with the bolt in tower brace kit from superior eng?

Cheers

Greg

I had same 3.5 caster with 2" m-h/duty lift.
Its all dependant on individual car measurements.
The 1 deg of caster correction per 1" of lift.
Is a rule of thumb and not law.

Patrol is now booked into local tyre shop to get 3.5 deg bushes put in, so hopefully it will drive better than it does now....

Put the mtz's onto the patrol yesterday and it looks like I might just need an adjustable panhard rod as the drivers side tyre is sticking out a bit. Will wait to see what happens after next weekend first.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gregs

Have you had much to do with the bolt in tower brace kit from superior eng?

Cheers

Greg

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No I make my own. Designed it to weld in from underneath so no need to lift body off on wagons.

Cheers