My Alt is on the Drivers side... where whatever is being driven off the middle belt in your 3 belt setup lives I reckon.
I also believe you have to be wary of the DOR of between the triple belt and serpy belt setups... water pump in particular
Printable View
My Alt is on the Drivers side... where whatever is being driven off the middle belt in your 3 belt setup lives I reckon.
I also believe you have to be wary of the DOR of between the triple belt and serpy belt setups... water pump in particular
Cheers ET! Our PS pumps live up there on these jiggers.
DOR I believe it was one of your very early posts years back that kindly educated me on the serpy/V belt issue with water pumps etc...
I’ll ring AB and Rossco again now to confirm the GQ alt DOR just in case :-(
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
AB has just kindly confirmed again for me that his standard GQ alt’s rotation is “Clockwise” when standing in front of his beast. The plot may be thickening though as a picture also received shows his GQ alt with a cooling fan/blade between pulleys and alternator. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...018/01/141.jpg The ‘stretched’ pimped up 170amp jobbie I’ve installed on the Chev does not :-( http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...018/01/142.jpg
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
@Winnie
Above pic of my alternator chop too, sorry I forgot to send you that!
the external fan alternator in the pic, needs to rotate in an anti-clockwise direction
@AB mate above, can you pretty please confirm 100% for me again, sorry mate :-(
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
MB, most Alts don't have the "fan" on the belt pulley these days.
None of my vehicles do incl my 6.5 IE the Fords and my Trol Alts all look exactly like yours.
IE all internal fans as Poindexter mentions
You sure... IIRC those Alt setups actually draw air thru the Alt and throw it out (clockwise)... not draw ambient and force it into the Alt (counterclockwise)Quote:
Originally Posted by poindexter
Same principle as Rad Fans on Vehicles, Outboard Internal Water Pump and Inboard External Water Pump impellors on boats.
Thank you ET mate! Remembering now also that the original Mitsubishi on there that died was fanless too. What am I doing wrong here :-( ?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
All alternators have fans, older style are external, later style are internal.
From my days at Bosch, I thought the air flow runs front to back. I could be wrong, it was quite some years ago.
Easy way to check is see an ,80s engine running.
Cheers Ralph mate! Any idea why this jobbie is cooking and dropping off when it does? It will come back to life tomorrow morning I believe:-(
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
OooooKaaaay...Quote:
Originally Posted by MB
My ALT lives where your PS pump lives
My A/C lives where your Alt lives
My P/S pump lives down below my A/C (maybe where your A/C lives?)
All driven off the Serpy
My Endless Air Comp lives between and outboard of the A/C and the P/S pump and is driven by that dinky 2nd belt off the A/C
My Serpy belt tensioner lives between the Alt and the Water Pump
2 things, air flow or pulley speed.
Alternators generally need to spin at a certain speed to generate current, if it is too slow, you may be overloading it.
6.5 don't rev that high, so maybe it's revs?
Have a look at the Alternators stateside and see what pulleys they run on their 6.5s.
100% spins clockwise on a TDQuote:
Originally Posted by poindexter
Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
I can now see tiny little fan blades inside its front cover, seriously small blades though, much like a few 2cm x 1cm paddles and say 10 of them at best.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
ROFL, I thought it twas the other way, just as likely I'm wrong :-)Quote:
Originally Posted by poindexter
Yep... sure will be... as prev posted by PD all Alts have fans BUT might will pay to make sure your DOR is correct as stated by the Manuf otherwise the Alt will overheat internal or external fan regardlessQuote:
Originally Posted by MB
Agree... ALTs are normally geared up as much as 2 on Pettys to 3 times on Diesels relative to engine RPM.Quote:
Originally Posted by poindexter
If the RPM of the Alt is low or the DOR wrong they will get hotter than they should.
Dunno if that is your prob but def where I would start looking
AB’s a little busy, just kindly had @matfew also confirm his GQ alt is clockwise from front viewing.
It was an older Ebay purchase advertised as for GQ so unsure of how I can check by myself its DOR design now :-( ?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Is your Alt rotating clockwise like a GQ? If so you would think the Alt is set correctly if it was supposed to be for a standard QQuote:
Originally Posted by MB
Otherwise, if you can eyeball the internal blades set to pull air from the rings, over the stator and expel at the front when rotated the way your setup.
It should be OK as the only way to reverse the DOR is like with a Serpy IE where you can run a belt 'under' a driven pulley (gives CCW DOR) as as opposed to 'over' (gives CW DOR)
For sure thanks mate, the 6.5NA’s Alts rotate clockwise from front view same as the boys GQ’s. Just checked the internal tiny fans and yes they appear to be set for expelling air forward.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Right... IMHO the next thing to check is the driven pulley dia (as suggested by poindexter)Quote:
Originally Posted by MB
The 6.5s are slower revving again than the TD42's.
FWIW I'll go check mine
Cheers ET, I did make sure of that too before I purchased and the new pulleys OD was say only a few mm’s smaller than the BD I guess original Mitsubishi one on there when bought complete already.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Mark, from what I have read the alternator will run hot at anytime. The issue is how the heat affects the rectifier /diodes in the rectifier. I am thinking our under bonnet temps exceed the operating temps of the alternator electronics and hence they crap out - heat equals resistance. Not having a big arse fan to cool the alternator will not be helping. I run a 3" marine blower to cool my alternators when it gets hot. At the end of the day you want your electronic controls as cool as possible - remember the diode expansion module i told you about?
If you send the current across 18 diodes instead of 6 they are individually doing less 'unit work' hence they heat up less from the electrical load. this does not have anything to do with the actual under bonnet load from the temps, but it gives your alternator more capability to generate at max current if the individual units are cooler - does this make sense?
A poofteenth under 80mm OD checked here thanks mate. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...018/01/143.jpg V belts obviously slightly smaller ID measurement.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Hmmmm, I don’t believe I checked that part thanks mate! From memory TD42s are around 750rpm idle and my Chev’s happy at 500-550rpm twactor styling. I never push it too much past say 3,000rpm flogging it :-)Quote:
Originally Posted by the evil twin
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Mine is 60mm at the flange, approx 55mm at the drive face as the flanges are approx 2mm high.
Sooo... FWIW... my ALT will be spinning much faster the yours.
Is your pulley the same dia pulley it was supplied with for a TD42 or did you reduce it for the 6.5?
The other variable would be the dia of the crank pulley which is what determines belt speed but IMHO as there are other accessories all driven by the belt like A/C, P/S etc you would think the belt speed should be similar between 3 belt and serpy
Thank you Phil mate, it kind of does although you know too well I am an electrical nuffy! Keen here to just make 100% sure first that the mechanics of it all are all correct brother:-)Quote:
Originally Posted by PeeBee
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Cheers mate, huge Alt pulley size difference there :-(Quote:
Originally Posted by the evil twin
Yep, it is the same pulley supplied and near identical size to the failed Mitsubishi that was already on there. Going to go check the crank pulley size now :-) @PeeBee mate, your NA Mitsubishi Alt from factory failed pretty quick too maybe?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Ok, crank pulley OD on the 6.5NA V belt jobbie here is 195mm ish. So.... 195mm to 80mm at 1:1 drive = ? @ PeeBee please mate :-) ! http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...018/01/145.jpg
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
GQ TD42 ute same size mate...Quote:
Originally Posted by MB
the ZD30s have a cutout in the radiator shroud to allow air to flow to the Alt for cooling, maybe look at doing something similar.
Mark, my 100amp alternator failed after 1500klm. It overheated to the extent the insulation on the windings charred and blew out the back. I am betting your alternator has been beefed up to generate the 170amps peak and the rectifiers have been left the same, as they can only be so big to fit inside the alternator. To that end the recifiers are doing more unit work at 170amp rating than they are at say 90. Regards the 60amp draw, I would say this is well above the duty factor for that alternator, probably above most alternators to be honest. I am going to fit the external diode pack as previously discussed to get past the heat resistance issue.
If in doubt, seek professional help!!!
Cheers blokes, for sure PD I do have a fancy bonnet close to ready for this although it really shouldn’t be needed for this experience underway :-(
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
2.43 to 1.
Hmmm... if thats the size for the TD then thats a tad slow to me for a Chev
It varies a bit from manf to manuf but below from Prestolite is common to most
A pulley with the desired ratio will drive the alternator fast enough at engine idle to charge the electrical system slightly, yet will not drive the alternator too fast (over speed) at the upper end of the engine speed range. In general, pulley ratios of about 2:1 to 3:1 provide good charging system performance and assure longer service life of the alternator bearings.
For passenger cars, approximateley a 2:1 pulley ratio is typical. This pulley ratio provides about 5 to 10 amperes output at idle while limiting alternator RPM at the upper end of the engine speed range. The top speed of the 5" frame alternator should not exceed approximately 8000 maximum continuous RPM.
For heavy-duty diesel engines, a 3:1 pulley ratio can be used since these engines are governed so as not to exceed 2100 RPM. The top speed of the 6 1/2" frame alternators should be limited to approximately 5000 to 6000 maximum continuous RPM.
Hmmm... I always thought that "cutout" is for airflow from the A/C thermoelectric fan.Quote:
Originally Posted by poindexter
If it was solid the shroud/engine fan would partially block the flow esp in traffic
As a point of interest I'd be a tad suprised if you get max output from that Alt with only one drive belt as well.
Anything over about 110/120 will usually have two belts.
That Alt of yours will pull something towards 2 horsepower at max output
which is why poly vee belts are better ie serpentine.
I can pull 200amps out of my aux alt. on 1 'a' section vee belt, but for longevity you don't want to do this. I tong tested this with a DC meter so know it is possible.