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One last final check on the old truck currently running the (TD27 88C thermostat) idling away outside tonight with the heater on full tilt and the A/C running with its fan cooling all.
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...019/08/174.jpg
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...019/08/175.jpg
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Idling with A/C fan off now after 10 mins and its playing 89C <> 87C ping pong :-)
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...019/08/176.jpg
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...019/08/177.jpg
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Information Overload:
1st Gear Low Range Test Up/Down Hills
(5kmph @ 2,500rpm each way)
92C up
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...019/08/178.jpg
90C down
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...019/08/179.jpg
Does seem to be running power wise healthy although as before reckon the 82C Aussie manual spec TS might be the perfect happy medium for us down colder south here?
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Trevor Mate @tryan277 [emoji106]Quote:
Originally Posted by tryan277
Thank you kindly, your top efforts here have helped our family greatly in this quest for warmth [emoji106][emoji106]
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To put it in perspective our needs down here :-)
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...019/08/180.jpg
Cold steel rolls feeding Mrs MB’s bank managers!
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Old mate Blue Del warm waiting back in the truck for Dad to sting his fingers on the heater vents finally [emoji106][emoji106]
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...019/08/183.jpg
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[QUOTE=mudski;789623]If its struggling to reach 76c yeah I agree. Putting a higher rated stat in will just mean the water wont circulate until it reaches it spec'd opening temp. But in TD42 land. Who knows. It may help, it may not.
......QUOTE]
@mudski Mate! I’m too struggling now to fully comprehend why our OEM & Aftermarket tropical 76.5 TS’s both experienced cold winter big downhill runs of 40C for you and experienced also once as low as 56C for me.
Having found now the OEM 76.5C was the only one out of all three OEM’s bought without a ‘Jiggle Pin’ installed is this possibly the issue?
I did notice how incredibly heaps of coolant pissed out (only gravity pressure) of the empty pin hole when popping the housing off for swapping and makes me wonder how many litres per minute are flowing through our radiators down cold highway fast hills even when the 76.5C thermostat is fully closed?
How much flow does a ‘Jiggle Air Pin’ actually hinder in its hole, maybe 50%?
Is your 76.5C aftermarket possibly missing a ‘JP’ too mate?
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[QUOTE=MB;789907]I have the Tridon Hi flow stat in and from memory, it doesn't have the pin hole and/ or the pin.Quote:
Originally Posted by mudski
McGoogle a pic of them to double check mate? What’s its code again?
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This one...Quote:
Originally Posted by MB
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/TRIDON-H...kAAOxy0uZR07VS
Upon closer inspection, I think I can see it, in the centre part of the stat....
Certainly does look like it too thanks mate!
If I was a betting man I’d say that’s our cold winter downhill highway issues for sure!
Just looking at the Jiggle Pin here on the OEM 82C & 88C and its tapered to fit very snug under pressure, may only let a very small amount through to our radiators I’d say.
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...019/08/189.jpg
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I think that is there only to relieve some flow pressure in the rad when the stat is shut. I think. Lol.
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Only logical explanation I can see now mate is that a significant amount of coolant does go through that hole witnessed myself and not even under pressure.
All I can say is that the Jiggle Pin on the 88C I’ve just installed must be working as I roll down hills at 86C now instead of 56C before.
That surely has nothing to do with the differing opening temps of either?
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For the greater good @mudski Old Mate!
Can you please drop in a $45 OEM 82C before our winters almost out now.
(21200-05D02)
I’ll be keeping the TD27 88C in for as long as possible to see what may happen as we approach 30+ ambients again, flip flops awaiting in storage:-)
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It will have to wait unfortunately Mark, as the Patrol is now a daily for the wife as her Mazda 6 is not going. Last thing I want to happen is make the Patrol out of action, I'd be really in the bad books then.
Max 30mins full bleed changeover after hours I nuffy promise mate!
Cringing myself thinking of such a beaut TD running 40C then back right up again, can’t be too good brother!!
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Yeah I know. But, unfortunately priorities in life at the moment mean the Patrol see's no love. I have a Red ship box Mazda sitting in the garage i am supposed to fix, but feck knows what I'm even doing with that. Lol. I tried burning it but as we know, shit doesn't burn, so I failed there.Quote:
Originally Posted by MB
What’s a low km TD42Ti donk worth these days mate?
Fark load more than any Zoom Zoom I says :-)
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I’m truly shocked now, just back from a north west highway run and cracked the magic 600km for exactly 80L burnt. (13.3L/100km)
I don’t believe this old dinosaur family wagon ever did that even back when it was bog stock with only the factory alloy bar (2,500kg Tare).
Its now got a stupid amount of steel bolted on front/back/sides/top (3,000kg Tare).
Performance wise it honestly feels like its got say an extra 1/2 gear up those dreadful rises near Diggers Rest and Sunbury.
Full mixture today of 80/90/100/110kmph with engine temps 88/89/90/91C.
One more tank fill up and this new OEM TD27 88C thermostat has truly paid for its self folks[emoji106][emoji106]
EDIT: Todays peak ambient temperature pic below for my summer time reference safe storage :-)
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...019/08/205.jpg
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Half burnt diesel stench has fully gone!
IMHO now these great donks need stabilised much higher temperatures than ever taught before, aim for stabilised 89.99999C averages maybe....?
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Curious about your results I did some Googleing and I just found a study that compared engine coolant temp to engine performance.. i didn't read the whole thing but flicked to the results and looks like from 60 to 90deg generally speaking fuel usage drops but emissions go up...
Might explain some things. I absolutely wouldn't be surprised if Nissan ran it a bit colder to drop those emissions down a notch.
The study looks very specific but i think it would be a reliable indicator of what you could expect.
I'd be keen to try a hotter stat but i don't know if it would get through summer... I've always wondered about this. I figure technically your cooling system should still be able to maintain 88deg with the same efficiency as it does 76deg.. so really in regards to overheating issues the temp of the stat shouldn't actually matter?
That sounds about right mate, how many car manufacturers have you seen where emmisions get propped up at a cost to performance.
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I know with mine, until the engine reaches operating temp it will puff out a lot more black smoke than usual. My last snow trip past Marysville, the water temps got down as low as 45c on the downhill run and then along the flats out of there it was like puffing billy until the water temps got back up there. The weather is warming so I wont even bother with putting a hotter stat in. But then again, Im curious to see if a hotter stat will benefit or not during the warmer months.
What is a TD42’s official operating temp Mark mate? That was one of my first queries I believe?
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This goes along with what I was thinking though.. surely even if you put a hotter stat in the cooling system will still work at the same efficiency.. i.e. you would have the same chance of overheating with a 76deg or 88deg stat.Quote:
Originally Posted by mudski
Yes the water gets warmer in the engine.. but it also has more chance to cool in the radiator..
I've never tested this but it makes sense in my head.
Water temp? What ever the stat is rated at would think.Quote:
Originally Posted by MB
Not so much of having more chance once the water cools to the stats range it will shut anyway. So a higher rated stat means it will shut earlier when trying to cool down, only cooling the water in the radiator and not the engine. IF the stat is shut that is. But by then its cool enough anyways.Quote:
Originally Posted by 0-TJ-0
confusing shite...
I think I posted earlier that my 6.5Chev manual clears states its operating temp (water) as 88C and its max at 125C before catastrophic failure I guess:-) It also states other temps like oil etc...
I believe I have read unofficially somewhere that a TD42 max operating temp was something like 117C but buggered if I have been able to find Nissan’s operating temp?
I believe most tropical TD42 drivers with 76.5C thermostats find in reality they run full open and in the 80’s somewhere as a minimum and much higher under demanding conditions anyway?
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Ah ok... Yeah without looking I think it is 117c is their danger level. I've had mine past that. Dragging the camper through the snowy mountains, crawling up massive inclines near Corryong in 44c temps. Wasn't fun.Quote:
Originally Posted by MB
my brother bought a diesel vw last year and it sits on 99-100 degrees and gets 5 lph . i think that the older cars engines being bigger and not as efficient put out more heat and keeping the engine temps low ( 76d ), in hot ambient temps would make the car more comfortable to ride in and help the air con do its job. i have a mate with a old xp falcon ( no air con ) and it got uncomfortably hot to ride in , so much so that he put insulation on the inside of the firewall and it helped quite noticeably
Safe storage note here for oneself look back folks.
Ambient early spring nightfall temps here have happily risen quite a bit :-)
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...2019/09/23.jpg
A/C fan on demisting/cooling engine bay at idle for 30mins seems to have come up to 87-89C ping pong compared to frigid nights prior pictured before at 82C.
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...2019/09/24.jpg
A/C fan off for a further 20mins and seems to ping pong between 88-89C.
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...2019/09/25.jpg
Gave it a good flogging this afternoon up our local test hill to reach 550EGT’s and scored 93-94C at best before coasting down the other side back to 87C amazingly quickly.
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Finally some half decent weather down here earlier today to record some more TD27 88C winter thermostat findings in the old TD42Test.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...eb96618665.jpg
As per last highway runs record it appears to have now increased all numbers by approximately 1-2C.
So previous range of 80/90/100/110kmph with temps of 88/89/90/91C have today now jumped to 89/90/91/92C and a sneak into 93C at one short blip up and back.
Off highway/freeway gave it another top flogging 575EGT’s up our test hill and did manage to score 96C briefly.
Not too stressed at this stage as previous 88C TS pot tests showed full open wasn’t until 98C.
EDIT: Idle has now come up to 89C too IIRC
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Diesel use may or may not have gone up a whisker just found, although approximately 25% of Friday’s test were start/stop traffic and some local highway bigger hills yesterday.
Fill up: 292kms for 42L to the brim. (14.38/100km)
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What about this for something different MB? Have read lots of good things about using these in TD42s as they block the bypass hole which means the hot water doesn't circulate until the thermostat opens at a rated 82C.
https://www.4x4andcamping.com.au/pro...an-patrol-td42
Thanks mate appreciated, did see on another Google forum them being used with good success it seemed. Have been very happy with the OEM 88 over the tail end of winter, may have to trial the OEM 82 I have ready in the back when it hits summer possibly.
EDIT: Apologies Chrisso mate, should have mentioned I’m now trying to OEM test everything first as a base point (including the bog stock plastic air dam underneath kept In situ etc...
Will be adding an intercooler to the old family faithful TD42T before years end too, just don’t want to skew results atm :-)
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Just found I believe an OEM quirky behaviour on these ‘Jiggle Pin’ equiped 88 & 82 thermostats folks:
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...019/09/139.jpg
A good quick water pump cavitation rev after say 30 minutes left alone and can only assume it is Jiggle seated again from stable 89C results found again for 30 minutes thereafter.
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...019/09/140.jpg
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...019/09/141.jpg
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Love your work good Marko ! While most are trying to stop the kettle from whistling , you're fueling the fire!! Haha [emoji1][emoji106]
I've subscribed!
I've read this post start to finish. I'm glad it's not only me that thought , sometimes when the temps are up she seems to sing better and feel smoother ... [emoji848].
For what it's worth ... I recall walking into Patrolapart when I bought a box of goodies for my cooling system makeover.
And after a brief conversation about the infamous dreaded long bolt in thermo housing , he asked why I went for the 76 thermostat. I disregarded his question with a dopey "cooler is better" mindset... Thinking of it now , he may have tried to sway me for a upper centigrade unit.
Mine cruises 78-80 most of the time and without load , always defaults to its 76C groove (idling) no matter what ambient temps are doing .
I really have to whip it good and proper to reach 90 or beyond , by which time egts are pushing the 500C spectrum , where I usually back off , and then temps once again fairly quickly reset to 76c range ...
I don't tow. So I don't know how it would behave in that scenario.
Just a sub-curious-question.
I wonder.
Would a thinner oil in winter and thicker in summer months play much part in this cooling game ?
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...019/09/142.jpghttp://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...019/09/143.jpg
Around 92 degrees is the sweet spot for performance
And there is the definitive answer. Thanks bloke, on song as always.Quote:
Originally Posted by nissannewby
Like you @Hodge I can't flog mine much past 80, even towing and prior to the tune it barely touched 82 and maxed 450egt. W2A IC I'm guessing.
Time to source the higher deg TS.
Big thanks to @MB for his diligent research.
Thanks Matty, really appreciated mate!
Most welcome Touses mate!
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@Touses mate, I think I’m thankfully ready to move ahead now and start looking at intercooler options for our old TD42T to try and heavy hauling tame factory Exhaust Gas Temperatures (EGT).
Just wondering what brand Water to Air (W2A) system you might be running please mate?
Have only briefly looked online at PWR, Plazmaman, Frozen Boost to date.
Hoping W2A might be a good option for us too down here in the frosty mountains.
Have decided now to keep the bonnet stock looking to draw less attention found recently to modifications so that rules out for us a Top Mount Intercooler (TMI) Air to Air (A2A).
Also thinking that a W2A front mounted full size slimline radiator might help incoming sleet and snow better than a half size Front Mounted Intercooler (FMI)(A2A) ?
Any advice appreciated thanks mate!
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@MB I'm running a frozen boost type 10 (I think), water cooling is achieved by 2 10" craig davies strapped to a radiator thingy that I think is an evaporative unit from a tractor AC.
That lot is mounted under the tray along with a bosch water pump and fans and pump are switched from the dash. This to facilitate warming the great silver frog on chillyish QLD
winter mornings. Have a temp sender in filler on the IC itself, dash mounted gauge to monitor. With the unit working the gauge needle doesn't move.
Will endeavour to dig out the pics of the setup over the weekend. Did have to body lift by 1" to clear the IC/ plennum under the bonnet.
@nissannewby is the go to man for the plennum if you go down that route. Keep in mind you've just done the hard yards on the TS research to get your unit to operating temp.
I'm convinced the W2A makes mine run too cold so will try higher rated TS.