:animierte-smilies-f :sterb003:Quote:
Originally Posted by the godfather
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:animierte-smilies-f :sterb003:Quote:
Originally Posted by the godfather
That sucks big time
keep an eye on it don't let them
bluff you
And they want 2.5k for fixing it, right?Quote:
Originally Posted by the godfather
2.5k worst case scenario.
So they checked the top block as well as the head to see if they weren't cause of the problem?
I am not sure. I know they took the engine right out. Greg (@ Brunswick) said he will call me when they know exactly what is going on.
I will probably call him mid week.
Keep us posted mate - doesn't smell good to me. Over boosting happens for a reason, not just for no reason at all. Its got to be something they did or didn't do when doing up the motor, or something you did or didn't do. Its really up to them to explain why their recently rebuilt motor failed. If they insist on this unknown reason bit, how long is the repaired motor going to last before it blows up for some unknown reason? The number if years they have being doing diesels, they should know what to look for and unknown reason is just not good enough. Checked out their stand at the 4x4 show today and they advertise plenty of experience and expertise.
They have a very good reputation of dont the right thing. Not sure they would intentionally do the wrong thing. They rely on their name for work. And at least half of it is Nissan's.
Update: Okay, the patrol has now been fixed. I am yet to pick it up, But not only have they refused to cover more on warranty, but they also put the price up to $3000.00
They have replaced the head with a new one, and fitted a dawes valve as well.
I have spoken to consumer affairs and to get any better a result will require civil action, at a cost of more than 3k.
So in reality, I lose.
So what was done to the original head, the one that failed. Was it tested before the rebuild and if so by who. If it wasn't tested did they warn you that the motor had been rebuilt with an untested head. When this happened a couple of weeks back, you posted that they said the motor had overboosted. Did the overboost cause the head to fail?? or was that incorrect?? What caused the overboost??
When I need a new motor or any work done I will have to think twice about using them.
Just another note, why did consumer affairs say you would need civil action. Do they think it is not a straight forward issue?
The problem will be proof of what happened and why, that has to be understandable and rock solid with clear cut processes leading to the outcome.
Any questions or variables to the evidence offered and your case is cut off at the knees.
It could have been this or that and there goes your case.
Years ago I had a Ford diesel work van that a local dealer reconditioned the motor, it failed and it turned out to be a broken bottom ring.
At the time Ford had lifetime warrantee on their repairs but the fine print said it only covered lubricated parts.
Ford said a ring was not lubricated!
The head of mechanics at our local TAFE was an acquaintance, I spoke to him about it.
He wrote a letter quoting Fords own training manuals how a bottom ring picks up oil, lubricates the bore and scavenges the oil off the bore during the pistons travel.
Ford could not dispute it was in fact covered in oil to do its job therefore lubricated and approved payment.
I could not have done that on my own.
Get your ducks in a row and if you are in the right you may well be reimbursed, good luck mate.
At the very least I think you should expect Brunswick to put in writing to you what they believe occurred, & what they believe to be the cause & why they think it is not covered by their warranty. Real words not 'whitewash words'.
If they are not prepared to do this in good faith then it is a very poor look for Brunswick & a warning to potential future customers.
What was the original warranty for the reco?
Sorry, not defending them but they do state ( i think ) 3 months or 5000 km on second hand ZD30 engines.
Unless they rip them open and refurb the engine, it would be pretty hard to qualify the status of the engine. Again, not defending BD but the engines they have are coming out of customers who have done V8 upgrades. They have no idea what the engine has been through.
Its sort of a lottery with second hand engines. Would I be pissed off, yes, could I blame them, probably not.
Kindest Regards
Rainsey.
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Sorry, forgot to mention, flame suit is on :)
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Ah, I mistakenly thought the motor was a Brunswick rebuild. I didn’t realise it was just a second hand motor. It does rather muddy the waters so my previous post should be discounted. We all take a punt on secondhand motors.
Im only guessing at a second hand motor. Didn't not think Brunswick refurb'd ZD30's.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuppa
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Over-boosting to 25 psi shouldn't cause what happened, someone is pulling your leg. They're not being honest and I'm sure that they're just covering up their arses telling you a tall tale so you cough up for the repair. ZD30 over-boosting is also well know phenomenon and engine control system has a built in protection meaning limp where you loose accelerator pedal and boost is limited to 10 psi until you reset (releasing pedal). For the control system not knowing the MAF would have to be really faulty as on GU series 4 the limps occur very quickly indeed once your boost goes past 18 psi and you keep going it will limp or fuel cut.Quote:
Originally Posted by the godfather
What they sold you is a second hand ZD30 motor with questionable history. BTW ZD30 Di never ever loose bottom end, that is built like a tank, it is the top end which is weak and if it was just a head gasket they wouldn't be pulling motor out. Ask them to show you the head gasket...although they will probably wiggle out of that one too.
What probably happened is that one of the pistons burned the hole in them which is not over-boosting but over-fuelling, that happens without warning or preceding symptoms and yes engine is usually running rough and or can be driven if the hole or crack is not extreme. The pistons are the weakest link in the whole scenario.
Fitting Dawes valve and blocking EGR is not a fix alone. Indeed I recommend Tillix valve instead ( it doesn't suffer from boost bounce effect as much) and also a needle valve to control turbo spool up time.
Do you have boost and EGT gauges installed? Lugging that motor in 5th gear or overdrive full throttle pedal will see EGTs going to 500°C + and starting to slowly ruining the pistons consequentially/incrementally.....
Did you know that glow plugs system contributes greatly to these motors failing? Having 5 mins glow time after engine is running is utter lunacy!
Indeed,modding glow circuit to reduce/limit glow time is a must.
Consider installing catch can as well.
In the end any ZD30 which did not have all the mods done prior being fired up for the first time is just a grenade set to go off once the circumstances align right.
Regards
Wow, so many questions.
Okay Brunswick have given me a comprehensive list of the work done, including costs. All up cost came to 7k.
The warranty was for 3 months or 10,000km, and excludes labour. This is in the terms and conditions.
They have offered me the part that have been taken off to inspect when I pick up the car. Or course who knows if they where mine or not?
Yes I have a boost and EGT gauge.
No they haven't really offered a reason as to why it happened other than over boost. According to my guage it hit 28PSI. The gauge lists the past highest spike.
Dawes valve is fitted and currently set to 14PSI (this is what they recommend).
EGR is blocked.
No catch can yet.
Warrant given on the repairs is 6 month or 10,ooo km.
Am I happy with the cost? No, of course not.
Will I be happy to get it back? Yes. I love that vehicle. Despite this it has served me well.
In regards to Civil action: anything that isnt criminal is civil action. So I would need to pursue it myself. I am fine with that....except, small claims opt out at $2,000, so the cost would be mine. Legal proceeding will be around $5,000...So no real point of throwing money away.
The real question is: Do I keep it?
Honestly for 7 grand or around there you could get Nissan brand new long motor (no IP pump or turbo), anyway can I ask why you had the engine replaced with Brunswick sourced unit in the first place?
To ponder whether to keep it or not is a dilemma I'd personally not wanting to face either. At the end of the day it depends how much do you want to sink to this venture because something tells me it ain't over yet. First instinct would be to cut the loses and be done.
Look I hate mine as a daily driver full stop. Under powered fuel guzzling slow behemoth which needs to be handled with care otherwise it breaks but I do love it in off road scenarios though, but question of reliability is always not far from my mind when going off beaten track.....
Regards
I went with Brunswick because they had the engine and could fit it immediately. I use the beast for work so I had to get it done.
Normally I would have fitted it myself. But I didn't have time.
Also they have a good name.....did have I should say.
A new motor from Nissan is as you say only 7k, but unless you fit new IP and component you void warranty. Which to start is only 20,000km.
Take it to small claims for 2000 of the 3000 if you think you have a case. Better to be 1k out of pocket than 3k.
i am interested to know was it a BD refurbished or rebuilt motor or a second hand as is where is motor? do you know what year the motor is?
Go to fair trading instead. Thats why they are thereQuote:
Originally Posted by Throbbinhood
True, I didn't even think of that.
Motor is a 2005Quote:
Originally Posted by 4bye4
Its a false economy sometimes, I guess we are all guilty of doing it. IMHO once mine blows and I decide to keep it and not engine convert to some real diesel unit then I'd be getting long motor and have IP rebuild as well with brand new injectors.
Indeed I'm partial to believe that one of the reasons for over-fuelling is/are the injectors, those horrible dual spring Bosch units (pre injection capable) which leak/dribble fuel when worn.
I still think BD's second attempt at your car is just the "Bandaid" to get rid off it ASAP. You are well advised to view it as such and perhaps get rid of it yourself or fix it properly if you want to keep it but who would now? Its called do it right first time.....
Anyway if this repair is approx 7 grand + previous install in not too far similar dollars wouldn't you be better off already with brand new long motor and recon IP and injectors set.
There is no cheap way to fix ZD30 and any short cut you make will bite you back again.
Sorry to break it this way but it needs to be looked at from this angle too.
I wish you good luck and hopefully you will succeed in getting back some of the monies you had forked out for this unfortunate and unpleasant experience.
Regards
In hindsight I would have been better off doing the job myself from the start. As usual Mechanics have proven to be useless.
alas hindsight is exactly that.
As for keeping it, i am not.
Do I still love Patrols, yes I do.
But the reality is I need my car for work, and running a Patrol all day, 5 days a week is not practical.
So I will be trading it in on a small, 4 cylinder, newer vehicle.
Yes I will make a loss, but in the long term I will be better off.
When my bank account recovers I will revisit my outback adventures.
Combining 4WD as a tourer and a commuter is a hard ask for most of us IMO.Quote:
Originally Posted by the godfather
I tend to stick with public transport and a bike for getting around.
If a car is necessary, there always are small, fuel efficient units, so maintaining two cars can even be cheaper
than wearing out a big 4WD as commuter.
4WDs are always more expensive to maintain. Learning some stuff to DIY is the only answer in my case.
I decided few years ago, I can either learnt to DIY or stick with cycling. I decided to become a DIYer, so I can keep the
troll.
After reading a lot of disappointing stories from the guys of the forum, I thought ZD30's are not a good choice, unless they are the
latest ones. I think sticking with old school TD42 & RD28 is safer for diesels. I think many guy's bank accounts and credit cards have taken a hard hit from those earlier ZD30's.
Personally I prefer RD28's. That 'cos I can put a one in my RB30 without having to muck around with the gearbox(afaik). :)
Looks like I sold it. Will know before the day is out.
Shame brother, at least the aggro will ease!Quote:
Originally Posted by the godfather
Deal is done. Delivery Monday. How will I survive without my 4WD.
You buy another one with the money.Quote:
Originally Posted by the godfather
Get a 4.2 this time or maybe a 4,8! Sometimes I think I should have got s 4.8. With all the luxury features
What are the luxury features the 4.8 came with?Quote:
Originally Posted by 89gqpatrol4x4
I hope the attractive fuel economy isn't one of the luxuries! ;) :D
Wait...you didn't give it away, did you?! :)Quote:
Originally Posted by the godfather
My mates tb48 gets similar economy to my rb30, but with a whole lot more power :(Quote:
Originally Posted by dom14
Imagine a 4.8 in a Q!!
What is the economy of your RB30 mate?Quote:
Originally Posted by Throbbinhood
15-16L/100km on 35's with winch, bar, 200kg of tools etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by dom14