Lockers - front or rear?

[Steveo_the_Devo]

Thinking about putting some air lockers on the new GU - don't think budget will stretch to front & rear. What's the general consensus if you're only installing on 1 diff - front or rear?

[growler2058]

Nissan Rear LSD are the ducks guts as far as non locked diffs go......so id be doing the front, oh i did hahahahahaha:-)

[04OFF]

Definitely lock the front for best advantage , yes the GU rear LSD is well known as one of the better factory units.

[Dhuck]

go the front mate and if and ever (emphasis on ever) you need serious work on the rear then do rear

[Bigrig]

Yep - front mate - that's what I've done and the unlocked rear (still LSD though) hasn't exactly been a hamper to me going anywhere!! As Dhuck said, IF you find you are getting overly serious down the track, then look into a rear locker.

[Steveo_the_Devo]

Thanks for the replies. Front it is then! Now the shopping around part, I see ARB are offering the free compressor with any set of air lockers for their Christmas catalogue - under $2k installed.

What's everyone else using?

[growler2058]

Auto locker by 4wd systems "LOKKA" is the brand name $400 fitted myself best 400 bux ever spent

[Dhuck]

The auto lockers have been a good compromise, but personally I would be going for something you turn on and off like the ARB.

[bennibopps]

Have been mulling over the same thing for my GU. The bloke i bought my truck off shimmed up the rear diff to make it tighter. Its an even cheaper option 20 bucks in a shim roll and a half day in the shed.

What could be finer working on rig sinking beers!!! COME TO THINK OF IT IM EMPTY TIME FOR NEXT ALE

[Skull]

ARB front and shimmed rear sounds the part if you can afford it.

[xtreme patrol]

I walked into my local ARB and asked for a price on a front air locker and he asked if I had the rear locked already I told him no he then started to tell me that I should do the rear first I argued that the patrol has a really good LSD on the rear and I would see more benefit if I locked the front first .......... Long story short he didn't agree so I Walked out of there knowing not to ask those Idiots for advice again

[Woof]

Front, had them in my old 2007 GU before I upgraded to the 1988 Q................got front ARB Air Locker and shimmed rear on the Q.

[Skull]

Never rely on ARB advice unless you know they know there shit. I asked for advice about lockers in ARB cairns. The guy had not a clue what I was asking about. I explained further and he still had no idea. He ended up putting on the ARB locker advert Video and I walked out. The guys here in rockingham are a lil hit amd miss aswell. Two of them a brilliant, they actually drive 4x4's and have the gear. The rest are in the wrong job.

[nowoolies]

front locker thats all the buses of ours need,..... if at all

[YNOT]

I walked into my local ARB and asked for a price on a front air locker and he asked if I had the rear locked already I told him no he then started to tell me that I should do the rear first I argued that the patrol has a really good LSD on the rear and I would see more benefit if I locked the front first .......... Long story short he didn't agree so I Walked out of there knowing not to ask those Idiots for advice again

I almost put up a post on this very subject. ARB take a very hard line about fitting the rear locker first, they will talk the legs off a table trying to tell you it's a safety thing and that the Nissan LSD is no where near as good as everyone says, BULLDUST. Most people who fit a front locker never go back for the rear locker, but by selling the rear locker first they know they have a better than average chance you will come back for the front locker. Even their locker wiring loom is set up so you have to switch on the rear locker first - there is a really easy wiring modification to fix this (if you have twin lockers). If you only have a front locker you just plug the switch into the wiring for the rear switch.
Ignore the spin they give you, tell them to shut up and get the front locker for you.

Tony

[Bucky]

I have run into the same thing at another arb shop. I ended up just cutting him off 'mate, i've been doing this nearly 10 years i know what im doin. just give me a f%^&ing front locker' he still argued so i took all his catalogues and walked out.

[AB]

Whatever happened to the customer is always right and bloody listen to what the customer is wanting...LMAO

[Ben-e-boy]

I have run into the same thing at another arb shop. I ended up just cutting him off 'mate, i've been doing this nearly 10 years i know what im doin. just give me a f%^&ing front locker' he still argued so i took all his catalogues and walked out.

just get an auto locker mate you wont regret it..... they are cheap and effective

Cheers
Benny

[growler2058]

just get an auto locker mate you wont regret it..... they are cheap and effective

Cheers
Benny

X2!!.......

[Skull]

I have never used an auto locker but I have an experienced old mate who won't use them. He said they are great if you are going forwards and staying that way. However if your are in a bog and have to rock back and forth reckons that they will have to ratchet in forwards (lock), ratchet out and then in in reverse (unlock/ lock), out and then in forward and so on. He reckons you loose quite a few rotations of your diff ( locked that is) during this unlock/lock transition so most of your rocking it is unlocked anyway. He reckons if you cant afford a Air locker get free wheeling hubs and a mini or full spool. That way if you wanna lock her up lock your hubs and engage 4H/4L. To unlock but stay in 4x4 unlock 1 hub and go 3x4. Any of you guys who own them have an opinion on that?

[growler2058]

Definitely not the case with the Lokka brand they stay locked until you need it needs to unlock ie turning you can hear a click click dunno about other brands but there have been some vast improvements in recent years By far the best $400
I've ever spent on my ol gal

[Skull]

Got some interesting vids for you guys.

Lokka Lock Right Auto Locker $4-500 on ebay: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kL0hPEOStGk

Detroit/ Eaton Auto Locker $5-600: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYBOoljH-qE&feature=related

Eaton ELocker Electric Locker $15-1600: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VPPGsYq6TE

ARB does not have any vids like these however it works similar to the Elocker only opperated via air, similar price.

How Sir Cleatus The Imbread does it , free: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5syQBXH3oro&feature=related

[Ben-e-boy]

I have never used an auto locker but I have an experienced old mate who won't use them. He said they are great if you are going forwards and staying that way. However if your are in a bog and have to rock back and forth reckons that they will have to ratchet in forwards (lock), ratchet out and then in in reverse (unlock/ lock), out and then in forward and so on. He reckons you loose quite a few rotations of your diff ( locked that is) during this unlock/lock transition so most of your rocking it is unlocked anyway. He reckons if you cant afford a Air locker get free wheeling hubs and a mini or full spool. That way if you wanna lock her up lock your hubs and engage 4H/4L. To unlock but stay in 4x4 unlock 1 hub and go 3x4. Any of you guys who own them have an opinion on that?

You DONT wanna go 3x4 that is worse than an open wheel diff. When I broke my cv i had to get up a hill that could be achieved with a near stock,un locked truck, I had 3x4 and it took me 6 attempt to get up it

I drive some pretty hard core tracks and I have a front auto locker, rear LSD no shim, 2 of my mates run auto lockers front and rear the fact that they do lock and unlock is not evident.

Skull you will be happy with auto locker.... period

[Skull]

Woo. Am I in trouble? : ) "Skull you will be happy with auto locker.... period"

I am just trying to help out the boys with a bit of info and get some answers to my own questions as well. So thanks for your reply. I am glad to hear they are all you wanted and expect. I have always just been unsure about them. Why does everyone instantly go ARB when lokers are mentioned. If the auto locker is the ducks nuts why would anyone pay three times the money? I try to do what comp truck and more extreme guys do as that is where they use the toughest gear, tried and true. Not trying to challenge your position as I have never used one mate. Like I say. Just trying to get the full story, views and all the "pros and cons". Also obviously if you hit something that looked a bit hard 3x4 you would lock the other hub. You would only unlock one turning sharp on hard surface like granit to save you CV's. Sand,gravel, dirt tracks etc it would not be harmful to your CV's so leave her locked up if you like. My old mate swears by this method. He has run his trucks like it for years. His comp trucks where locked full time tho.

[growler2058]

Woo. Am I in trouble? : ) "Skull you will be happy with auto locker.... period"

I am just trying to help out the boys with a bit of info and get some answers to my own questions as well. So thanks for your reply. I am glad to hear they are all you wanted and expect. I have always just been unsure about them. Why does everyone instantly go ARB when lokers are mentioned. If the auto locker is the ducks nuts why would anyone pay three times the money? I try to do what comp truck and more extreme guys do as that is where they use the toughest gear, tried and true. Not trying to challenge your position as I have never used one mate. Like I say. Just trying to get the full story, views and all the "pros and cons". Also obviously if you hit something that looked a bit hard 3x4 you would lock the other hub. You would only unlock one turning sharp on hard surface like granit to save you CV's. Sand,gravel, dirt tracks etc it would not be harmful to your CV's so leave her locked up if you like. My old mate swears by this method. He has run his trucks like it for years. His comp trucks where locked full time tho.

Its the brand everyone knows i spose! At the end of the day its your choice, its a bit of the Holden v Ford though we know Holdens are better hahahaha but both options have their pros and cons. I have had a hilux with arb lockers front and rear and now ive got an auto LOKKA and love the fact its there when required and i dont have to stop an eff around with switches compressors etc.

[Mazodude]

I think this is the video for the arb air locker

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uxn0MHpDsSI

[Skull]

saw that one. I was hopin to find more how it works not what it does. They are different internally to the e locker but same principle. Was hopin to show that difference. Tiss all good. If people are that concerned ARB usually have a open cut dummy one on the bench you can play with. There are some top vids out there comparing ARB to chinese nock offs. I have seen these knock offs on ebay. Watch before you buy.

[Bigrig]

I agree with you on some of the Chinese numbers, but that said, we've got a member on here who thought he'd test them for himself and installed a fair while back - last report is that he's giving it a workout and no problem to report ... they might not be there as yet, but once the quality catches up (as the Chinese seem to be doing) ARB and the likes are going to have to find a new revenue stream. For $525 delivered for a locker, I'd take that even knowing I'd only get two years out of it over a $2500 locker that comes with a 12 month guarantee (yes, I know - they last for donkeys but we're talking 10 years out of the others to spend the same money IF they only last two years and meanwhile I have coin to spend on other goodies!!!).

Sorry for the hijack ... please resume!!! lol

[snicko]

Just come back from the Vic high country meet up and used our ARB lockers for the first time - AWESOME is all I can say!!

[Ben-e-boy]

Woo. Am I in trouble? : ) "Skull you will be happy with auto locker.... period"

I am just trying to help out the boys with a bit of info and get some answers to my own questions as well. So thanks for your reply. I am glad to hear they are all you wanted and expect. I have always just been unsure about them. Why does everyone instantly go ARB when lokers are mentioned. If the auto locker is the ducks nuts why would anyone pay three times the money? I try to do what comp truck and more extreme guys do as that is where they use the toughest gear, tried and true. Not trying to challenge your position as I have never used one mate. Like I say. Just trying to get the full story, views and all the "pros and cons". Also obviously if you hit something that looked a bit hard 3x4 you would lock the other hub. You would only unlock one turning sharp on hard surface like granit to save you CV's. Sand,gravel, dirt tracks etc it would not be harmful to your CV's so leave her locked up if you like. My old mate swears by this method. He has run his trucks like it for years. His comp trucks where locked full time tho.


Nah just being direct and having just got out of bed. no form of anger was intended. what I mean is pros and cons between the 2 are insignificant on the tracks,

[-ET 4wd-]

selectable locker in the front and wound up LSD in the rear....and a winch
This is what ive learnt after having tried all of the above lockers in various different ways.
This is the set-up my GU will be copping!

Steve.

[rottodiver]

Just remember though, by doing just the front it compromises your steering. I tend to flick the rear locker more than the front on tracks and more so the front on the beach

[growler2058]

Thats the beauty of the auto LOKKA it unlocks to steer and locks when you give it the berries again

[Skull]

We are starting to drag some very good info out this thread. Am sure that allot of people will be learning from this. I have picked up a few things myself. Thanks guys. Will be giving the autos allot mote of a look. Always had air locker. Dunno what i am gonna do with my new truck. $400 is heaps easier to get past the anchore. Like somone pionted out too, tell her it was $2000 and spend the rest elsewhere.

[HippoNZ]

curious to know, do these lokkas still stay locked while trying to do a steady slow hill climb?

[growler2058]

Yup basically they're always locked until you need to turn however if you're turning and put the power on so to loose traction then they lock again

[-ET 4wd-]

Only let down with a auto locker is they are hard to unlock on surfaces with low drag.
Makes changing direction very hard and can cause some probs if the front wont unlock.....ask the boys that used to use them at Loveday!...they all ended up in the bank! hehe

Steve.

[teleman]

Definitely front all the way bro.

[Steveo_the_Devo]

Interesting, looks like the guys on patrol4x4.com/forum/nissan-patrol-gu-gr-10/arb-diff-lock-special-75277/
are not impressed with the ARB air locker at all. To surmise - apparently the new air lockers are having issues - may be install related, may be design - the usual argy bargy.

Had a visit to ARB recently and when they finally dragged their fat asses away from their highly important computer screens to answer my questions - $1811 installed including the free compressor.

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[bennibopps]

I will be going front air locker and installing it myself. have all ready shimmed up rear Have found they are not very hard to do, just take your time and your fine. That last bit rhymes! :clapping: me funny guy???

[AB]

Good info all round peoples!!!

Looking into this soon myself for the front so It's good to get some feedback...

[Lewy]

Just go to Opposite Lock in Springwood. The boys there are very good and do not bull shit you at all.. I just ordered a heap of stuff from them (Bull bar, winch,steps, brush bars, lights, lift, Locker, brakes, duel batts, turbo timer, snorkel and so on:bananarock: ) they gave me a quote then beat it again so I got a few more things then they dropped the price again.. I also asked for a rear Elocker as well as a Front and they talked me out of the rear!! Now that's service talking me out of spending more money with them.. I tell you ARB have never done a deal like this for us before.. Will never use ARB again!!

Also don't over look the Elocker ......

Lewy

[Bigrig]

Give Torq4x4 at Hillcrest a chance to quote also - they are active forum members as well who actually get out with us on trips ... the prices I've gotten from them for gear I'm getting is definitely the best in the market, and you know you'll get quality service from Dave and Murray

[davejones]

I fitted a Detroit Softlocker to the front of the GU last year. I've been really happy with it.

Doing the research though I was staggered to find that it was about $200 cheaper to import an ARB Airlocker from the USA including $120 US for air freight.

Now that's pretty crappy, cos they're made in Vic. So you are paying freight in both directions and it's still cheaper.

The only conclusion I could come to after having spent the day at my mechanics installing the Detroit, is that their labour charge built into the "installed" price from ARB is too low for the job.

I reckon, and it's only an opinion, that they are front loading labour into the "uninstalled" price and that guys buying the uninstalled lockers are subsidising those of us who do it ourselves, not that I reckon that it would be a high percentage of their sales - ie uninstalled wouldn't be significant compared to installed sales.

From a purely sales perspective, it's a lot easier to sell a $1400 locker to someone and charge $400 to install it than it is to sell them a $700 locker and charge $1100 to install it.

It's the only way you can rationally explain the fact that you can buy the same locker in the USA for $700-800 or so, yet they are so much dearer here.

Of course if someone's got a better explanation I'm all ears.

Still pretty happy with the Detroit though, and it was cheaper out of the USA too.

Dave

[Richo460]

I had a mate with a land...ummm a 4x4 with a detroit in the rear, good lift and muddies and that thing was a weapon, made me realise how much better life is when a dff is locked. I am a fan of auto lockers and manual ones.
I just bought my patrol with a front TJM air locker and supplied but wasn't fitted was a reshimmed rear diff out of the 2.8 diesel. Old mate claimed that it would take 260nm to slip it rather than 180nm for a standard one? I know piss all about diffs and was gonna lock the rear too! Anyone hear anything about the diffs from the 2.8 diesels being different or is it just the shims that were installed?

[JoseM]

The RD28 brought H233 just like all of our busses. In my Trol I got ARB front (like better selectable for the front) and shimmed rear. No idea the nm for the rear before nor after, all I know is that it works great on the trails.

Tell me about the TJM, they are the new kids on tha block down here, and no one relly knows much about them.

about the ARB prices, it is just like davejones said. I purchassed mine in the US and had it delivered to my front door in Panama for a grand total of $874usd, had it installed for $250usd. So it seems you guys are being charged waaay too much.

Does anyone know what Steveo ended up doing? It is kindda an old thread...

[eddietrx]

Yeah I put a lockrite in the front best thing I ever did. Don't really need to do the rear the nissan LSD's are great