Question - Which Diesel chip is best ?

[patrol2011]

Hey guys just recently purchased a 2010 st and overall very happy with the car, except when I'm towing. I have a trailor that fully loaded is close to about 2 tonne and i'm finding that when going up hills the car is having a little bit of trouble, i'm curious how you guys are getting around this

I've been doing alot of research with diesel chips and what I have come across is that with the new diesel engines (not just nissan) the companies are waking up to fact that people are putting some "cheaper" diesel chips on their cars and infact are destroying their engine because all the chip is doing is ramping up the rail pressure and as a result the injector pins are failing and blowing holes in the pistons... so what the companies are doing is adding relief valves into the rails so that when it goes over what they consider to be normal the fuel is released into a catch can kind of thing which from what i can gather render's pretty much 90% of the chips on the market completely useless..

So what i'm asking is what experience you have with diesel chips and what you would recommend owning? The chip will also be fitted with an aftermarket exhaust (still undecided on what exhaust I want to go with )

thanks

[Mazodude]

Hey mate.
Welcome to the forum. When you have a chance, head over to the introduction section and tell us about yourself (and your truck).

As for chips, I heard Diesel Power (DP) is good. Never had any experience with them though because I have a GQ (manual fuel pump)

[patrol2011]

Hey

Thanks for the reply! much appreciated. I looked into DP chips and from my understanding they also just up the rail pressures which won't necessarily work on newer cars and can cause damage to the injectors.. I also looked into "Chip it" and "tune it " chips both of which i'm fairly confident do the same thing.. could anyone confirm or deny this?

In my research I did come across one chip... diesel smart made by supercar peformance.. I read on their website (http://www.supercarperformance.com.au/) that their design has full control over the engine and they don't add rail pressure which means my injectors should be okay? I rang them up and spoke to a guy there named mick or mike err i don't remember to much haha he said I could take my car in to one of his franchises and have one of the chips fitted to it and see how it goes for free then if I like it they will custom tune it for my car... I'm going in next week to see how it goes... will let you know how it goes

[baboo]

GDay, Have been looking at chips myself Have a look at Chipit they monotor exhaust gas temps ajust acordingly, have various programs and I reckon best results will be in conjunction with an exhaust upgrade They recomended to me 3" mandrel bent inc converter from turbo back. If anyone has experiance with this I would also be interested in comment.

[Finly Owner]

Try Super Roo as well. They do full setup.


Tim

[nowoolies]

i have just installed a Tunit chip
so far great more power, to early for fuel report

[patrol2011]

Thanks for the replies..

@baboo
I looked at the chip-it egt system and I was abit concerned about having the module cut out on me especially if i was going to overtake someone or going up a hill towing without any warning. I then also spoke to the guys selling the diesel smart product about it and they told me their egt defense system has a display inside the car that gives me a reading of egt's and will sound an alarm if egt's start to get high, I like this idea because it will give me warning before it cuts the module. they also said it will cut the module if egts climb to high to what they consider to be dangerous before it does any damage to the engine. they also said their module is custom tuned here in australia and that it would be very difficult for me to get the car to reach dangerous levels using their module as they are tuned in central queensland where lots of their customers actually have 4x4's kitted out for remote work on mine-sites carrying constant weight. As I said before I have done a fair bit of research on this and really don't want to put a chip on my common rail diesel engine because of the damage they do and constant unwanted engine lights that everyone is complaining about on forums. The other thing I liked about diesel modules is they have a 10 year warranty and they pacifically designed to suit common rail diesels.

The guys at Diesel Smart pointed me to this youtube video of a nissan patrol with all the products fitted that I'm looking to buy. Tell me what you think

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35KlKxK-yjI

Cheers

EDIT: youtube video didn't work correctly

[Arwon]

Go the full set up Chipit chip, you won't be disappointed. But would suggest having a pyro meter installed especially for towing, those EGT's can really get high very quickly.


Sent from my iPhone. Please excuse the spelling.

[baboo]

Hmm !! patrol211, Im in the process of rebuilding the top end of my ZD30 had major leaks from a stuffed intercooler . rekon it was stuffed while still under warrinty , mentioned it to the dealer ,all the oil leaking ect got fobbed off they just cleaned it .Ended up with cracks in the head I think caused by hi temp diferences between the exhaust and inlet valves, anyway possibly would have been better outcome if I had some sort of warning and maby if it cut back it would react faster than my right foot!!

[patrol2011]

woah that sucks man, did you have a chip fitted to it at the time baboo? or is just one of those famous zd30 engine problems lol.

Arwon.. i'm almost 100% confident that chip-it chips really just up the rail pressure and won't work to well with the common rails and cause damage to my injectors which could destroy my engine... can you confirm or deny this? or give me a reason why I should go with the chip-it chip other then "you won't be dissapointed"

[baboo]

Didn,t have the chip, and knowing what I know now about the ZD30 if it drops power or something changes in performance, ie increase in turbo lag when changing down. Have it checked out, just keeping the boot in will do some damage. By the way I was quite impressed with the X Country 4x4 aftermarket intercooler, have bought one and will be interesting to see how it performs. Also Intercooler kit includes dawes valve witch should protect from over boost when I block the EGR valve.

[patrol2011]

Well when I took the car in to have the chip fitted they informed me that my car already had a steinbeur chip on it.... (many wonders of buying a 2nd hand car) so I asked them to do a dyno run with the steinbeur, without and with their diesel smart module. The car made 72.4rwkw standard - 82.2rwkw with the steinbeur and around 120rwkw with their Diesel Smart module. I have the dyno sheet around here and when I figure out how to get it onto my computer I'll put it up. I also took photos of the module being fitted and how it plugs directly into the top of the injectors

I must say I am very impressed. the car is so much quieter then before and it feels like a whole new car. I couldn't believe it was the same engine. I had to pop the bonnet to make sure it was lol. Very impressed with them and their service! recommend them highly.

[baboo]

Wow thats great! is that with the standard exhaust and how much difference did it make to the torque, haven,t made a decision my self yet, still putting my beast back together .

[Skull]

Just wondering about warranty... My truck is on a boat on the way over here. I traded my 03 for a new one but took all the go fast bits off first and it drove like crap. The power figures for the CRD and older DT are not too different. Don't think it will be long before I want more. Would be stoked with that sort of increase. Read a very very lengthy review on Chip it. Sounds like a very comprehensive chip. Did you get the washer fitted into the fuel rack?? The Chip It seems very reliable as far as EGT's go (according to this review). Apparently it augments the boost indication going back to the ECU to allow for greater boost without "overboost" triggering.

[patrol2011]

hey skull.. i didn't get the chip-it chip because i'm still sure they only just ramp up rail pressures which is no good for your injectors and reading your above comment i'm assuming by putting the washer in the fuel rack that means it's blocking off the release valve that is designed to keep it safe.

the product i got was a diesel smart module from supercarperformance. the module I got was optioned with the boost controller and the egt package. so it ended up costing me 2200 fitted and dyno tuned. which I thought was an incredibly good price. The egt system they have takes over the remainder of the new car warranty for driveline damage. so should something happen to my gearbox or my engine dies they will take responsibility and fix it unless of course i'm trying to do 4x4 burnouts on the road and blow a diff or something extreme like that.

as for egt's i have never had an egt system fitted before so I don't know how this module compares to standard but I'm told by the people who fitted up the module to my car that their module runs lower then standard and its only under full acceleration and under tow if i held my foot flat for an extended period of time (like 4 or 5 minutes) that theirs get to about the 550-600 mark and at 600 it sounds an alarm if they get to 650 it will cut the module and return it back to standard.

hope that helps skull

for baboo that was with a 2.75" stainless steel exhaust and as for the torque.. looking at the dyno sheet it peaked at about 575nm of torque and 121.6kw.. again I'll figure out how to upload this thing for all to see but not having a scanner makes it hard lol

[Skull]

All sounds pretty good. Tis hard to know which one to get isn't it. Everyone says mine is the best, highest gain, lowest EGT etc. Can't all be the best though eh. Is good to get some cold hard figures and some seat of your pants comparison to standard. Cheers bud.

[patrol2011]

hey i was able to get my dyno sheet scanned haha its a bit off center but you can still read it


http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/2365/dynosheetpatrol001.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/337/dynosheetpatrol001.jpg/)

[robbo0001]

Look, I am a sarcastic bast%$d but a 96 percent increase in torque, and a 68% increase in power (from a chip).....is BS.
I call shenanigans....purely on the basis that NO MECHANICAL CHANGES have been made.

Long term effects? Short term effects? Effect on fue consumption" Engine wear? Drivetrain wear?...there is NO gain without a loss, somewhere.

Thats my opinion....if that scale is true, and proved correct over the long term...I will buy one.

Not holding my breath, LOVED to be proved wrong.

Cheers

[patrol2011]

it's not a chip. it doesn't change the rail pressure. it goes into each injector and alters injection timing, injection pulse width, pulse times and by doing this it can alter how the fuel gets into the engine. it also changes the boost. please note this is also with a 3" exhaust. if you look at their youtube channel you will see similar results across all the cars. I did my research before buying something. I didn't want to put something on my car that just alters rail pressure as it destroys the engines. take a look at the chip it chips. they know their chips will throw an engine light due to over fueling so they give you a bolt that goes into your fuel rail to block off the release valve so they can continue to get power out of new common rails with just changing rail pressure. i do not like that idea at all and as such the only 2 I came across on the market that actually worked with the injectors was Steinbeur and Diesel Smart. I could be wrong, their could be other companies that don't just change rail pressures but very few companies actually offer indication about how they get their power.

the module also comes with 4 tunes, economy, light tow, heavy tow and all out power... this dyno run was done in all out power obviously the car is not always in this tune and in fact most of the time I just leave it in the economy tune. I'm noticing that at 100k's an hour my car is reving about 500-700rpm less then what it use to so obviously that's gotta be helping my fuel economy. I haven't had a chance to test it properly but when I do i'll let you know how it goes

if you read the rest of the post you would see that because my car still has some factory warranty left by fitting their EGT defence system it moves the drivetrain warranty to them.

[patrol2011]

further to my post above.

it's like owning a supra or a skyline or anything with a turbo on it. put more diesel in, add more boost, do it safely. the limit on a diesel engine is the turbo not the engine itself. its only running about 15-16 psi to make this power, my understanding is they can run up to about 22-23psi before they start running into problems?

[Skull]

Here is the link to the company selling it http://scarparts.3dcartstores.com/Patrol_c_55.html

The write up the have is a fairly convincing write up. Am seriously looking at it. Wondering would they mach my extra 3yrs new car as well? This "Module" (don't ever call it a chip) does seem to be a whole different kettle of fish for sure. There are no products I have seen as yet taking this approach and JESUS what an outcome. If that is sustainable i'll take 2 : ) I do agree though that you can't expect all this out of standard intakes and exhausts. I do beleive that physical mods should be made to make it easier for the donk to put this sort of power out. I know my self that smokers and athsmatics can't keep up with the fit guys. Engines need to breathe too so the easier it is the safer it will be. I did notice that the turbo control is just the 3BAR Racing kit down to the red silicone vac hose. They have obviously set it and then hit it with heat shrink to prevent us playing. Dunno if it is woth the extra $400 bucks ($300 worth of heat shrink maybe) I am pretty glad to see them put their money were their mounth is with the matching New Car warranty. Not many companies will do that. 10 yrs on the module..... $1400 is fair cheap to. They even offer to let you test drive on fitted to your own car. They have it all covered. The badging/decals are a bit over the top. Only thing they missed is a Massage and executive finish.


patrol2011.
QUOTE: I'm noticing that at 100k's an hour my car is reving about 500-700rpm less then what it use to so obviously that's gotta be helping my fuel economy.

What tha. Is your troll an auto?

[patrol2011]

hey sorry 500-700 is probably a bit over exaggerating lol but yes it is noticeably quieter and definitely revs lower then what it did before.

You could always call them and ask about the new extended new car warranty?

the biggest seller for me was the 10 year product warranty, the driveline warranty and the fact that the power gains come without increasing rail pressure. my module doesn't even plug into the fuel rail at all.

[Skull]

Now i know you would be still wraped with the whole thing. I would be sleeping in it. Honestly and seriously what downers have you come across so far. Wanna try and get the full picture. We have heard all the pro's now for the con's. You are my guinne pig. Can you please try to get some real life fuel figures for us. Would be great to know exactly how my truck could end up before i spend the dosh.

[BillsGU]

I'm noticing that at 100k's an hour my car is reving about 500-700rpm less then what it use to so obviously that's gotta be helping my fuel economy.

Not sure how that could work. As I understand it, at a certain engine RPM, the gearbox turns at a certain speed, turning the wheels at a certain speed which equates to a certain road speed. Only way to change road speed / RPM is to change diff ratios, tyre diameter or gears. I could be wrong tho.

I bought a Steinbaur module and a 3 inch mandrel exhaust a month ago. The Patrol drives MUCH better now. The turbo lag is noticeably less and it has more towing power. Around town I am getting 0.5 l/km more - which should give me about an extra 60 km to a tank. Have not tried it on the highway yet - but I will over the holidays. So far I am happy with the module.

[bundy4127]

Would have thought BillsGU is on the money when it comes to RPM.

[BillsGU]

I bought a Steinbaur module and a 3 inch mandrel exhaust a month ago. The Patrol drives MUCH better now. The turbo lag is noticeably less and it has more towing power. Around town I am getting 0.5 l/km more - which should give me about an extra 60 km to a tank. Have not tried it on the highway yet - but I will over the holidays. So far I am happy with the module.

Update on the Steinbaur on the highway during the holidays. At 110 kmh on the freeway my fuel consumption is the same as before the upgrade. The car does do better on the hills and the auto either does not shift down on hills where it did before, or gets a lot further up the hill before it shifts down.

Is the module worth what I paid for it and would I buy another one if I changed cars? Just for the pure difference in driveability - yep I would.

More updates when I add the ASE intercooler, (That is - when it finally arrives !!!!).

[macca86]

how does the safari d tronic chip fair? I picked one second hand for 700 good buy or not?

[Swiss gu]

Hello folks

@Patrol2011. Your dyno is quite impressive. After a few months now, What's your feed-back ?
- still happy with your Diesel Smart module ?
- What about torque down low ?
- What about the "useable" zone ? from what 1600 rpm to what ? 3500 rpm ??
- do you have a manual or an auto ?
- How does the new power match the gearbox gearing ?
- Have you or do you plan to fit larger tires ?
- Should this help with the amout of power you have now ?
- what is your average fuel consumption ?
- What brand of exhaust do you have ??

Sorry for all these questions. I'm very curious about this setup. Thank you for your already helpfull contribution.

Nicolas

[APTUNING]

First - Patrol2011 Steinbeur is the premium chip to buy costs an arm and a leg but has an awesome reputation. It is the closest you get to an ECU tune and the only tuning box I would let touch my vehicle. Unfortunately with chips/tuning boxes you do not necessarily get what you pay for, there are some very expensive pieces of crap out there. I would suggest you all consider an ECU tune, price is fairly cheap, just make sure the tune edits the actual original program, is reversible and the engine is warranted

[BillsGU]

First - Patrol2011 Steinbeur is the premium chip to buy costs an arm and a leg but has an awesome reputation. It is the closest you get to an ECU tune and the only tuning box I would let touch my vehicle. Unfortunately with chips/tuning boxes you do not necessarily get what you pay for, there are some very expensive pieces of crap out there. I would suggest you all consider an ECU tune, price is fairly cheap, just make sure the tune edits the actual original program, is reversible and the engine is warranted

I have seen them and it all seemed a bit complicated - so I went for the Steinbaur. If it all turns to poop I can just unplug it - even in the middle of nowhere.

[notsterling]

Steinbaur is the only 1 worth looking at .Bought a STERLING chip $1300 4 my mazda 6 MZRCD DYNOED before and after very small increase no where near the touted increase on there web site. basically a con as it was supposed to be designed specifically 4 my engine.

[macka17]

Hi.
Regarding the D-Tronic.
'02 model 3 ltr ST. chipped from 10k with tuned exhaust added at 100k.
I tow(ed) a 6.5mtr Offroad caravan for 12 yrs with this rig.All over Aust. (Old. Fat, and retired)
Without the chip YUK.....
With the chip. (and this is over the life of the car.) I pulled past all Std 80 and 100 ser Toyota's climbing hills, long and short.

At fuel stops (running together ) From Adel to Darwin and all stops in between.
The Toyota's ALWAYS used a fair bit more fuel than us. and I travelled Comfortably at posted road speeds (plus)
Overtaking multiple road train convoys etc. Best was 7 rigs at 140 plus on graded dirt rd. Missus driving.
She logged the GPS 173 kmph on it when near new too. Bloody leadfoot.

Average consumption

with caravan. 6.2 to 6.5 KMPL combined weight av. 5.8\6 ton.
Obviously booting it used more.
Car by itself. 8.7 to 10 KMPL depending on conditions. Hills. wind. etc.

Prev 17ft 6in Single axle semi offroad van.
I averaged 7.3 to 8 KMPL towing that. ALL at posted road speeds mainly.

We have a nice short STEEP hill here in Yeppoon. Just over the bridge going into town.
Straight up to the sky looking at it.
Car will go up it from a rolling start in third gear easily WITH chip.
Without. Just, as it rolls over the top in second.

With caravan. Does it comfortably in second.

That chip will puff a bit of black smoke on take off. Sometimes when well loaded.
Otherwise clean pipe.

This is a well recommended chip (in my case) But according to some.
you sometimes have to try a couple b4 getting one that works?.

Everybody "I" know\met with one fitted, never has\had a problem from new. (shrug")

I paid $1400ish fitted. Then.

NON adjustable. reliable. bulletproof.

I don't ever bother about figures.
Just what happens in the real world. On the road. with my rig.
Physical comparisons.

[skits]

hi. i have a 2006 gu zd30. Im thinking about gettin a chip soon, most of the posts are a few years old now, does anyone recommend whats the better one out these days.

[kevin07]

yeh steinbauer

[threedogs]

A chip alone you wont get the best out of your motor,
Combine it with a straight thru 2.75" Beaudesert exhaust or 3" with full flow Cat to really reap the benefits
I have DP chip on 7 and full 3" exhaust with 200k on the clock, I'm still getting 12/100Ks and plenty of power to over take
Very happy camper


I think Diesel Smart have a complete re map service on offer for $1500 for 50% power increase,
Big call but ring for details I suppose

[rainsey]

Skits,

I have just ( 2 weeks ago) had a Unichip put in with a 3 tune predefined switch setup.

Unichip will work on boost control, rail pressure, monitor a multitude of parameters and is highly tuneable.

It cost me $1500 which included Dyno tuning.

The absolute only negative of a Unichip is that it has to be installed by a dealer, it is not a end user fitted device.

Having said that I did a 2400km round trip to get mine put in as this was the only chip I felt comfortable with.

I do not know if he posts on this forum, but if you shoot over to the Patrol4x4 forum there is a guy that goes by the name of DieselTuner, that has firstly written what equates to a textbook on diesel tuning and secondly has done a comprehensive comparison of a multitude of different chips. It is, I think, an unbiased description of the products with pros and cons.

I think they have it in their sticky section so it should not be hard to find. Read this first if you have time and then have a look out there.

For your info, I did have a ChipIt dominator 3, before I went with the Unichip so I have had some exposure to
What's out there.

Whilst some may not agree with me, I seriously think that having the vehicle Dyno tuned is the way to go. By having before and after results gives you quantitative feedback as to what you really have rather than perceived.

Kindest regards
Rainsey


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[rainsey]

Oh ... Just read Threedogs response and cannot agree more.

Get a decent exhaust in first before you chip. Secondly, possibly an EGR block. A good exhaust gets the engine breathing a whole lot better and gives you some valuable KW's and torque.

If you do go with a chip that requires dynoing, you may well be better to have all the other bits that affect tuning done first.


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[skits]

thanks everyone. i will be looking into an exhaust first just trying to figure out the best and easiest chip to install. Ive read about some that you can adjust yourself as you add mods to your car. are these ones any good,

[threedogs]

Scotts Rod exhaust are vendors here and make a great exhaust for the right price.
Drop them a PM for pricing etc

[rainsey]

Skits,

There are pros and cons with all chips. They turn into a religious argument as to what is the best, and reality has it that there probably is not a "best" chip.

When I had my ChipIt, it was tuned by 2 jumper pins that modified the rail pressure and the boost, I think from input from the MAF.

I adjusted the jumpers the rail jumper until such time that my over pressure valve did not blow, and I adjusted the MAF jumper until the vehicle ran like crap then went back one setting. But what was I actually achieving?

Waiting for a valve to pop or the term running like crap are subjective and don't give you actual figures.

It's like a Placebo. You take a pill so you fell better. Has it really made a difference or is it just you thinking it has ( sort of Matrix like ).

Some chips modify the rail pressure, some modify the injector timing, some modify the turbo boost. Some do all 3.

Some do it by you tinkering with it yourself, whist some require professionals doing it with monitoring tools. Unfortunately the latter usually means no user intervention.

Some have plug and play harnesses and some are hard wired.

What you have to come to terms with is what you want to accept If self tuning and what risk you want to accept with its outcome. If you are a tinkerer and like to change things yourself... Go with a self install chip.

If you want something that is set and forget, and you want a definitive record of the result, go with a chip that is installed and tuned by the vendor.

Either way there are probably 4 or 5 chips on the market that have a very good reputation, have good customer service and have a proven record. Not going to tell you what to go with, as I said it is a religious argument. But just make sure you are sure in Your mind which way you want to go and what riskou are willing to accept.

Kindest regards
Rainsey


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[rainsey]

Oh again what Threedogs said re exhausts.

There is also Bauedesert that make a good system albeit for the patrol they recommend a 2.75"

What I can recommend is find an exhaust supplier that gives you a mandrel bent system as this gives you a uniformed diameter from front to back.

Get a system that bolts immediately to the back of the turbo dump, not after it.

Get a system that already has an EGT bung welded I to the dump pipe, that way you do not have to then take it somewhere to get it retro fitted after you put it in.

Kindest regards
Graham




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