supercharging a tb42

[da' maverick]

just wondering if someone has done this and is it worth it.
i have a tb42 dual fuel - carby motor.
the torqe is good but overall power sucks.
i was thinking of of fitting a sc12 type blower. they can be turned on and off like a air conditioner.
dose anyone know if they are compatible with lpg?
any help is appreciated.
cheers

[growler2058]

Rekon youl be hearing from bigrig soon mate

[patch697]

I don't know what your looking for but an sc12? It would be to small for a 4.2 I would think. ^ to part 2 of your question YES you can supercharge on LPG with a blow through type your looking at.

Your TB42 an "E" or an "S" ???

[Bigrig]

I have a tb42e on dual fuel with a sc being fitted next week - that said, apparently it is best to lose the LPG completely due to reasons beyond me (like, proper adjustment of fuel mixtures is a lot more difficult, different boost required for each?, etc).

I'll know more in the next few days as I found out what's going in etc, and let you know.

[da' maverick]

how about a solenoid that swaps to petrol when the blower is engaged. how about the sc14 is that any better.

[YNOT]

SC12 was fitted to Toyota 4AGZE 1.6 litre engines, SC14 was fitted to 2 litre Toyota engines. Both are far to small for a 4.2 litre engine.

Tony

[da' maverick]

what would you sugest tony, dont know if a 571 would fit but im will to give it ago, just want some more power.

[Bigrig]

what would you sugest tony, dont know if a 571 would fit but im will to give it ago, just want some more power.

If you can wait till tomorrow mate, I'll get the model of the one being installed in mine - all I know at the moment, is he is talking about 60-80 kilowatts extra - talking 180-200 odd kw's for a vehicle that came off the showroom floor with a touch over 120 ...

[YNOT]

Assuming you're looking at second hand blowers an Eaton M90 off a supercharged V6 Commodore (also used on some American Ford V6 engines) would be closer to the right size.

Tony

[YNOT]

If you can wait till tomorrow mate, I'll get the model of the one being installed in mine - all I know at the moment, is he is talking about 60-80 kilowatts extra - talking 180-200 odd kw's for a vehicle that came off the showroom floor with a touch over 120 ...

Standard TB42E was rated at 129kw, TB42S was 125kw.

Tony

[growler2058]

Standard TB42E was rated at 129kw, TB42S was 125kw.

Tony

Yeah Scotty more accuracy please hahahaha attention to detail mate hahaha

[Bigrig]

Standard TB42E was rated at 129kw, TB42S was 125kw.

Tony

That's it ... fully rebuilt engine with the SC he reckons 200+ kw's .. That's a lot more berries ... but the rebuild includes smaller pulley wheels also (or something like that) and lowering of the engine compression (somehow, probably to do with the pulleys? lmao) ... essentially, I know squat other than it will have a truckload more go!!!

I'll find out model etc tomorrow.

[TUR7LE]

That's it ... fully rebuilt engine with the SC he reckons 200+ kw's .. That's a lot more berries ... but the rebuild includes smaller pulley wheels also (or something like that) and lowering of the engine compression (somehow, probably to do with the pulleys? lmao) ... essentially, I know squat other than it will have a truckload more go!!!

I'll find out model etc tomorrow.

How much is it costing u n do u have any idea wat the fuel economy will be like ..... Just wondering wat I can do to mine in the future

[Bigrig]

How much is it costing u n do u have any idea wat the fuel economy will be like ..... Just wondering wat I can do to mine in the future

Economy should be better (depending on how I go at it) - more power should hopefully mean less need for the skinny pedal when cruising, taking off etc.

As for the price, the SC is about $4K but that includes some other work removing the LPG also - the engine rebuild price depends a bit on what needs to be done, but somewhere between $3-4K plus the installation of the new fuel tank, sender, etc.

[Bigrig]

Righto - here's the disappointing news (apart from mine not getting done next week). There is no kits for them at all, and the Eaton's are too difficult to fit as the manifold etc needs to be customised also.

If anyone finds differing information, I'd be ecstatic to hear it, as this has pushed me back down the path of a new motor (priced up an LS3 this morning for $7000, but that doesn't include p/s pump, ECU, air con compressor, etc, etc ... so not bloody cheap at all ...).

Frustrated is an understatement at the moment ...

Hope you have better luck finding something mate ... please let us know if you do!!

Cheers
Scotty

[Bigrig]

Some more information:

Have found a mob that do the VE SS square port motor which throws out 255 kw's (not the cathedral port LS2 which punches out about 300+ kw's), for $5995 AND they do the conversion kit which includes the ECU, electric pedal, fly by wire cable, fuel pump cable, all wiring looms etc for an additional $1600 - Total being $7595. They profess this to be a straight swap in with Marks gearbox and engine mount Adaptors and shouldn't cost more than about $1500-2000 total for the conversion and literally turn the key and drive away - Derek is planning on retrofitting my power steering pump and hopefully the air con compressor also, so is working that out now.

Essentially a SC was going to set me back about $4K with the engine rebuild at least another $4K, so for an additional $3K approx I can get a brand new motor, fitted, wired, etc, etc with 255kw at the flywheel (not sure what it equates to at the rear wheels, but basically more than double what I have now!!).

That's my plan post the disappointment of not being able to SC - that said, when I finally pick myself up off the floor from the shock of the price, dust myself off and earn some more money, I can always SC this motor (easily thankfully!) down the track and get an estimated 345kw's ... won't happen as I'm not out to do wheelstands, but nice to know the option is available ...

Still would love to hear if anyone finds out any further information regarding SC'ing a TB42 ....

Good luck one and all ...

[patch697]

Some more information:

Have found a mob that do the VE SS square port motor which throws out 255 kw's (not the cathedral port LS2 which punches out about 300+ kw's), for $5995 AND they do the conversion kit which includes the ECU, electric pedal, fly by wire cable, fuel pump cable, all wiring looms etc for an additional $1600 - Total being $7595. They profess this to be a straight swap in with Marks gearbox and engine mount Adaptors and shouldn't cost more than about $1500-2000 total for the conversion and literally turn the key and drive away - Derek is planning on retrofitting my power steering pump and hopefully the air con compressor also, so is working that out now.

Essentially a SC was going to set me back about $4K with the engine rebuild at least another $4K, so for an additional $3K approx I can get a brand new motor, fitted, wired, etc, etc with 255kw at the flywheel (not sure what it equates to at the rear wheels, but basically more than double what I have now!!).

That's my plan post the disappointment of not being able to SC - that said, when I finally pick myself up off the floor from the shock of the price, dust myself off and earn some more money, I can always SC this motor (easily thankfully!) down the track and get an estimated 345kw's ... won't happen as I'm not out to do wheelstands, but nice to know the option is available ...

Still would love to hear if anyone finds out any further information regarding SC'ing a TB42 ....

Good luck one and all ...

Bigus, Have you looked into turboing? there is plenty of kits out there for that & your SC of choice is a blow through system anyway.

[Bigrig]

Bigus, Have you looked into turboing? there is plenty of kits out there for that & your SC of choice is a blow through system anyway.

Sure have boss - quotes vary between $9-11K due to the fact they have to decompress the engine so much (bigger head gasket, etc, etc) let alone pulley wheels etc ... not overly wanting a turbo, as I want the power bonus under 1500rpm when using low range with the reduction gears, rather than having it spool up ... thousands of ideas, so confusing!! lol

[patch697]

Sure have boss - quotes vary between $9-11K due to the fact they have to decompress the engine so much (bigger head gasket, etc, etc) let alone pulley wheels etc ... not overly wanting a turbo, as I want the power bonus under 1500rpm when using low range with the reduction gears, rather than having it spool up ... thousands of ideas, so confusing!! lol

To much bloody money more like it......LMFAO

Throw a bit my way I'll help you spend it.....ROFLMFAO

[Bob]

Sure have boss - quotes vary between $9-11K due to the fact they have to decompress the engine so much (bigger head gasket, etc, etc) let alone pulley wheels etc ... not overly wanting a turbo, as I want the power bonus under 1500rpm when using low range with the reduction gears, rather than having it spool up ... thousands of ideas, so confusing!! lol

I would think that a larger Motor would be the answer as Supercharging an older type Motor would place considerable strain and would be the same for Turbo Charging.
You need low down Power at times and top end as well and a larger Motor should be the answer

[Timbo]

What's wrong with the good old Turbo guys?

You don't have to have a large laggy turbo to make power. You can get them custom made to suit your needs so.. ie: come onto boost earlier, later, mid range. Some guys actually put smaller turbos on the 4.2 to have the boost come on lower in the rev range, purely for bush driving and comps.

I mean, supercharging is cool and all that but I think you could definitely get similar results from looking into custom Turbo's a bit more. Would save a bit of hassle, just my 2cents. :)

[Bob]

Have you checked this out ??


http://www.turbonetics.com.au/2026/index.htm

[patch697]

I would think that a larger Motor would be the answer as Supercharging an older type Motor would place considerable strain and would be the same for Turbo Charging.
You need low down Power at times and top end as well and a larger Motor should be the answer

Yep I agree......... I think it would be the cheapest way out too in the long run....

Thay used to say, you can't beat the cubic inch but these days thay have proven you can (to a degree anyway) What you won't & normally don't get from an aired up smaller engine is longevity & also it reliability comes into question as well.

Yet non of these questions are raised when talking about cubes (ie V8's & the likes). No one ever says: well that won't last long or thats not real reliable??? Ok so you may spend a little more up front but if you get more reliable power & Torque & good life & airing up a smaller engine shortens its life & makes it less reliable for almost the same bucks I really don't see the point in going any other way.

Just my thoughts on the subject.

p.s Nothing sounds tuffer than a V8 mate.

[Timbo]

255kw at the flywheel (not sure what it equates to at the rear wheels, but basically more than double what I have now!!).



Hmm.. from memory, I think you factor in around -30% calculating F(fly)WKW's into R(rear)WKW's.

So; 255kw - 30% = 178.5rwkw's

Would be *roughly* around that i think.

cheers

[Timbo]

Oh and just to clarify, I'm not saying superchargers are worse than turbo's (because fact is, they are both classed as superchargers!) I'm just talking from price point. If money isn't an object then I would definitely be dropping in an LS2 V8 with the marks adapters rather than stuff around make the old TD42 push out heaps of power. Or even better, one of those awesome V8 diesels that are becoming popular now. Even more money but best of both worlds! :D

[Bigrig]

To much bloody money more like it......LMFAO

Throw a bit my way I'll help you spend it.....ROFLMFAO

I wish mate - like you, I work for it ... it wasn't a gift, nor a lottery win!! Starting to feel like I should keep my build to myself!! lmao

Nahhhh ....

[Bigrig]

Hmm.. from memory, I think you factor in around -30% calculating F(fly)WKW's into R(rear)WKW's.

So; 255kw - 30% = 178.5rwkw's

Would be *roughly* around that i think.

cheers

That's about it old mate!!

[Bigrig]

Oh and just to clarify, I'm not saying superchargers are worse than turbo's (because fact is, they are both classed as superchargers!) I'm just talking from price point. If money isn't an object then I would definitely be dropping in an LS2 V8 with the marks adapters rather than stuff around make the old TD42 push out heaps of power. Or even better, one of those awesome V8 diesels that are becoming popular now. Even more money but best of both worlds! :D

Me too!!!! lmao

Can't afford the big V8 diesels, and can't justify it for my needs either ... that said, at the end of this process I'll be about $34000 out in total including the buy price of the rig - for what I want that's acceptable to me - no different to going out and buying a $34000 car and paying it off over a loan period ... which I'm sure plenty of us have ...

[Timbo]

Me too!!!! lmao

Can't afford the big V8 diesels, and can't justify it for my needs either ... that said, at the end of this process I'll be about $34000 out in total including the buy price of the rig - for what I want that's acceptable to me - no different to going out and buying a $34000 car and paying it off over a loan period ... which I'm sure plenty of us have ...

Yeah have to agree with you there mate!

[da' maverick]

mmm. much to think about. my situation is my motor is only ten thousand kms old. A motor swap is too expensive for me.
how hard is it to convert to efi? is it just bolt on things or is it a completely different motor? turbo not a bad idea either

[patch697]

mmm. much to think about. my situation is my motor is only ten thousand kms old. A motor swap is too expensive for me.
how hard is it to convert to efi? is it just bolt on things or is it a completely different motor? turbo not a bad idea either


Do you want tp keep your duel fuel or will you settle for one r the over?

[Timbo]

mmm. much to think about. my situation is my motor is only ten thousand kms old. A motor swap is too expensive for me.
how hard is it to convert to efi? is it just bolt on things or is it a completely different motor? turbo not a bad idea either

I'll leave this one to Patch or Tony.. but could you possibly sell the motor on ebay or something? I think you'd have quite a bit of interest in a 10,000km engine, no matter what it is.

1. Pull engine out
2. Put on ebay
3. ????
4. Profit!

[growler2058]

Righto - here's the disappointing news (apart from mine not getting done next week). There is no kits for them at all, and the Eaton's are too difficult to fit as the manifold etc needs to be customised also.

If anyone finds differing information, I'd be ecstatic to hear it, as this has pushed me back down the path of a new motor (priced up an LS3 this morning for $7000, but that doesn't include p/s pump, ECU, air con compressor, etc, etc ... so not bloody cheap at all ...).

Frustrated is an understatement at the moment ...

Hope you have better luck finding something mate ... please let us know if you do!!

Cheers
Scotty

F@#$%^& SPEWIN MATE !!!!!

But do like the sound of the CHEV Just check i thought i heard they can have overheating issues in gq. Coulda been the diesel i was thinkin about. But worth checkin out

[YNOT]

mmm. much to think about. my situation is my motor is only ten thousand kms old. A motor swap is too expensive for me.
how hard is it to convert to efi? is it just bolt on things or is it a completely different motor? turbo not a bad idea either

TB42 carby and EFI engines are basically the same but unless you are technically minded and able to do the EFI conversion yourself the cost involved would far out weigh any benefits.
Converting from carby to EFI would involve sourcing and fitting the complete inlet manifold with throttle body, idle up solenoids etc, airflow meter and airbox (good luck finding an airbox in good condition), electronic distributor, wiring loom and relays, high pressure fuel pump, filter and lines, accelerator cable, and probably a few other bits and pieces. It would be cheaper to sell your pre '92 Patrol and buy a post '92 model instead.

Scott, if you are interested in turboing your original engine talk to Darren (Blackers) at TJM Coopers Plains. Last time I spoke to Blackers he was just finishing off and tuning his TB42E turbo.

Tony

[Bigrig]

TB42 carby and EFI engines are basically the same but unless you are technically minded and able to do the EFI conversion yourself the cost involved would far out weigh any benefits.
Converting from carby to EFI would involve sourcing and fitting the complete inlet manifold with throttle body, idle up solenoids etc, airflow meter and airbox (good luck finding an airbox in good condition), electronic distributor, wiring loom and relays, high pressure fuel pump, filter and lines, accelerator cable, and probably a few other bits and pieces. It would be cheaper to sell your pre '92 Patrol and buy a post '92 model instead.

Scott, if you are interested in turboing your original engine talk to Darren (Blackers) at TJM Coopers Plains. Last time I spoke to Blackers he was just finishing off and tuning his TB42E turbo.

Tony

Thanks mate - appreciated, but at the end of the day, I only end up with a turbo charged engine that still has just on 300K on the clock and whilst I take care of it, it is bound to let go at some stage, and as per Murphy's law, that'll be at the moment I most need it!!!! Hence I'm going for full replacement ...

[yort]

hey big rig, what did you do in the end?

[Silver]

hey big rig, what did you do in the end?

he dangled his end over a rolled over hilux at scenic rim, is what he did :-) (sorry for a silly post to a serious question.......hmmmm no I'm not :-) )

[YNOT]

hey big rig, what did you do in the end?

Scott is currently eagerly awaiting the arrival a turbo charged TB42. Keep an eye on his members ride thread, it's going to get VERY interesting.

Tony

[patch697]

Scott is currently eagerly awaiting the arrival a turbo charged TB42. Keep an eye on his members ride thread, it's going to get VERY interesting.

Tony

It should be landing in QLD tomorrow................. Man he is gonna wig when this is finished......I know I am...........lol

[Bigrig]

Yep - due to arrive today ... I'm going down to check it all out later and give it a hug!!! lmao

[yort]

Yep - due to arrive today ... I'm going down to check it all out later and give it a hug!!! lmao

give it a big hug now cause when it's fitted it'll be a bit of a stretch lol

troy

[CHAPAS]

if you use a gasoline engine, you can use both LPG turbo or supercharger, the limit is on the technology they use, and of course the ability to regulate the mixing ratio.

today the option of mounting a modern V8, with a modern injection system and ECU open like Haltech or even MegaSquirt, is more than attractive.

I am sure a 2UZ-fe toyota engine does not have much trouble adapting to the gearbox of the patrol.

and if you use propane gas to run the engine not only have a fuel savings, but also extra benefits, like a more controlled combustion, better lubricasion cylinder and lower emissions

a greeting!

[GQshorty]

thanks for the info guys would be interested in doing the mod to my truck!

[Pezzer]

check out Efi upgrade in this forum.