Harrop Eaton ELocker Versus GU Family Wagon Auto Hubs

[MB]

G’day NP.com.au Team,
We are looking towards purchasing an ELocker for the front differential of our family GU wagon for some extra Nissan great rear LSD assistance on an upcoming adventure early next year.
Have experienced great mechanical reliability from ARB Air Lockers over the years on my shorties and utes with free wheeling hubs and saver rings although to be honest cannot be bothered with air lines this family time around.
As slow and steady as I’m allowed to wagon go would really appreciate any feedback on whether or not stock auto hubs (turned to true off road lock of course) would survive?
We really do like the stock auto function back at home in and out of grassy paddocks and are hoping they might be ok out there under heavier locker duress?
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2019/09/159.jpg
Many thanks in advance, appreciated!







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[mudski]

I think they will be fine Mark with a locker. Those hubs are pretty strong. I just dont trust the auto device in them. Last thing you'd want is for the auto to unlock itself when you really dont want it to. So just keep them and whne you are going to do the tougher stuff with the locker, just put the hubs into the lock position. So they are manually locked and can't self unlock.
Give the transfer case a birthday and put some new oil in it too. Auto trans fluid too, not gear oil...

[MudRunnerTD]

I run Auto Hubs on teh GUIV. after 10 years of abuse one failed a couple of years ago in the Flinders Ranges. I converted it to a Manual hub in Camp one night and finished the holiday in manual mode. I ahve since replaced them with another set of Auto Hubs (non-genuine unfortunately) and they work fine. Mate they made it this far.

[MudRunnerTD]

If your really concerned though swap them with a set of Manuals off one of the Utes..... Cause you can.

[MB]

Cheers Daz, appreciated mate!
Shocking memory me, your family weapon has front air or e lockers mate?


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[MudRunnerTD]

Cheers Daz, appreciated mate!
Shocking memory me, your family weapon has front air or e lockers mate?


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Air locker. Like it a lot. Bit an e locker would be awesome too.

[Hodge]

If your really concerned though swap them with a set of Manuals off one of the Utes..... Cause you can.So these units would fit on our later GUs Darren??

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2019/09/162.jpg

[MudRunnerTD]

Yes will go straight on. Drug money but Yes.

[Winnie]

Hey Markie if you're concerned that the auto hubs might not be up to the task maybe "borrow" the manual hubs off your ute for that trip and then bolt the auto hubs back on when you get home?

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[MB]

Fair call mates, lazy arse I’d be for sure :-(
Is it doable though, longer term wee’s hoping because the autos do truly rock as an easy daily [emoji106][emoji106]


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[MudRunnerTD]

Hey Markie if you're concerned that the auto hubs might not be up to the task maybe "borrow" the manual hubs off your ute for that trip and then bolt the auto hubs back on when you get home?

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That's what I said 😉

[MudRunnerTD]

Fair call mates, lazy arse I’d be for sure :-(
Is it doable though, longer term wee’s hoping because the autos do truly rock as an easy daily [emoji106][emoji106]


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It is an easy swap out mate. Take them off one of the guys It's a, they are not using them. I like the auto hubs to be honest, they are easy and convenient.

[MB]

Was truly hoping to knot upgrade to other bush hubs blokes :-)
Trying to read between the lines here I think they might be tougher (locked in) than I/we first assumed?




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[MudRunnerTD]

Was truly hoping to knot upgrade to other bush hubs blokes :-)
Trying to read between the lines here I think they might be tougher (locked in) than I/we first assumed?




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Stick with them mate. They are fine. If in doubt lock them rather than Auto.

[Hodge]

Yes will go straight on. Drug money but Yes.

Spewing! I had a chance to grab a brand new in box set for peanuts, but the seller was adamant they wont fit my Patrol so I backed out. Plus, their round shape instead of the hex / bolt cut out kind of shape on my patrol worried me about the fit. I just wanted them as a spare... OH well good to know now anyway!

I took the auto function out of my auto hubs. Now its just free or locked.

FWIW. I have a front arb locked Marko and have had now issues using them with converted hubs!

[Bidja]

I run Auto Hubs on teh GUIV. after 10 years of abuse one failed a couple of years ago in the Flinders Ranges. I converted it to a Manual hub in Camp one night and finished the holiday in manual mode. I ahve since replaced them with another set of Auto Hubs (non-genuine unfortunately) and they work fine. Mate they made it this far.

Got a link of camp mod of OEM auto hubs to manual mode?. Just in case.

MB all depends on what you want to go without, but do agree, just lock in manual operation if for long haul serious stuff, Run auto heaps, never an issue_Auto, for me just a bit lazy to engage smoothly on first cold run, but move lever in/out @ idle a few time before driving and all good.

[mudski]

Got a link of camp mod of OEM auto hubs to manual mode?. Just in case.

MB all depends on what you want to go without, but do agree, just lock in manual operation if for long haul serious stuff, Run auto heaps, never an issue_Auto, for me just a bit lazy to engage smoothly on first cold run, but move lever in/out @ idle a few time before driving and all good.

Its very simple to do john. Simply get a flat blade screw driver and lever out the flat plate in the hub you see when you first remove it from the wheel. Real simple....

[MudRunnerTD]

Got a link of camp mod of OEM auto hubs to manual mode?. Just in case.

MB all depends on what you want to go without, but do agree, just lock in manual operation if for long haul serious stuff, Run auto heaps, never an issue_Auto, for me just a bit lazy to engage smoothly on first cold run, but move lever in/out @ idle a few time before driving and all good.

I had very bad internet but googled it at the time. It is a very easy thing to do. leaver out the locking ring and refit it. 5 minute mod to be honest.

Check this thread on P4x4. Unfortunately the thread here and there are both corrupted by Photobucket paywalls damn it. But you might make out what is what.

https://www.patrol4x4.com/threads/convert-auto-hubs-to-manual-pictorial-explanation.188754/

[Rossco]

Hey Markie just food for thought mate don't really know too much about elockers at all but stumbled across this vid the other day and found it interesting. Don't mean to plant any seeds of doubt have heard good things about them and it is the family tourer so sure will be a great thing for that application. .

https://youtu.be/1nYZo--7Xh4

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[mudski]

Hey Markie just food for thought mate don't really know too much about elockers at all but stumbled across this vid the other day and found it interesting. Don't mean to plant any seeds of doubt have heard good things about them and it is the family tourer so sure will be a great thing for that application. .

https://youtu.be/1nYZo--7Xh4

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Says a lot for the Pro Locker hey!

[NissanGQ4.2]

Got a link of camp mod of OEM auto hubs to manual mode?. Just in case.

MB all depends on what you want to go without, but do agree, just lock in manual operation if for long haul serious stuff, Run auto heaps, never an issue_Auto, for me just a bit lazy to engage smoothly on first cold run, but move lever in/out @ idle a few time before driving and all good.

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/showthread.php?596-Fixing-GQ-GU-auto-hubs/page2

[NissanGQ4.2]

Was truly hoping to knot upgrade to other bush hubs blokes :-)
Trying to read between the lines here I think they might be tougher (locked in) than I/we first assumed?

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From my readings over the years the Auto locking hubs are stronger than any aftermarket manual hub, If out bush doing tracks then lock them in, if out and about having a quick play leave them in auto just remember to reverse up a few meters after changing back into 2wd

[MB]

Hey Markie just food for thought mate don't really know too much about elockers at all but stumbled across this vid the other day and found it interesting. Don't mean to plant any seeds of doubt have heard good things about them and it is the family tourer so sure will be a great thing for that application.
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Thanks heaps Rossco, didn’t know the ELocker did that :-( Not sure we’d be too happy either with rollback disengagement!
Looks like we’re running air lines again dammit :-)


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[Bidja]

Never had to do roll back disengagement since good old FJ45 days.

In GU auto mode, slap mine from 2 - 4 wd on the move heaps and never had disengagement issues. First, always at idle, before driving off (auto mode) I just engage/disengage from 2H to 4H a few times and then I have now engagement issues or clicking noises. Without doing this I have engagement issues (won't engage and click away). Have also been running LS90 in front diff for past 5yrs. Next will use 80w90 mineral.

[MB]

Sorry John mate, was referring to the Eaton Locker from the video and how its mechanism is designed.
After engaging it takes a 1/4 turn to lock forward so if urgently reversing up it becomes a full 1/2 rotation to relock backwards again apparently.


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[Bidja]

Sorry John mate, was referring to the Eaton Locker from the video and how its mechanism is designed.
After engaging it takes a 1/4 turn to lock forward so if urgently reversing up it becomes a full 1/2 rotation to relock backwards again apparently.


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Cool, silent time here at moment so have not watched video yet. Will do though.

[MB]

Definitely worth a view mate!
Unfortunately now for us just learnt, even though we were very much looking towards an easier installation system for the old family truckster it won’t suit our future needs either like the narrator shows.
There is plenty a rocky shale little track around our neck of the woods too that just wouldn’t forgive a start/stop/reverse/start again situation.
Our little 33” KM3’s I believe would equate to over a 1.3m half rotation distance rollback (or wheelspin) before engaging again and then the same again forwards back up a hill?




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[Bidja]

Did check it out, the guy certainly gives the pro locker a push and quite rightly so as the Elocker achieves positive lock (direction change) only after it overcomes the cam operation lag (bit ordinary). Hard core or not, it would feel loose "loss of direct control" for the 1.3m at least(.5x3.14x33 converted to SI units as U said).

Have to be careful with either running DC cable or hose routing (risk always exists from, being knocked and time fades away (Neil Young) once install completed.

Be interested though of difference in the Australian variant of Elocker operation to compare out of interest only. Have not the real life experience as demonstrated, but from what I have seen here recon the air control system for me.

[Cuppa]

I love my Elocker. It hasn't had a huge amount of use but on the occasions it's been needed it's done it's job. From the video I can see their might be an issue for some, but for the likes of myself it offers me the reassurance I need. When I need to use it it is invariably on uneven steep terrain where commitment is everything & where hesitation & rolling backward is to be avoided at all costs (particularly as I have the Tvan in tow). That said many of the experienced or 'hardcore' drivers here would probably manage the terrain I would use the locker for without need to switch it on. For me it's mainly about avoiding the risk of vehicle damage, by not relying so much on momentum, when alone in remote country. For those who use a locker to enable them to conquer ever harder terrain then maybe the rolling back issue is worthy of consideration.

[Bidja]

A bit of topic but related. I do not have either low range reduction gears or diff locker fitted. Would the reduction gear for low range application be the priority install of the two options (when stop spending on other bits)?

[nipagu7]

i think it depends on the type of fwd you do , faster sand and mud - diff lock . slower steep and rock crawling - lower gearing . ideally - both if funds allow. lower gearing would help a lot especially if you fit larger tyres .

[Bidja]

i think it depends on the type of fwd you do , faster sand and mud - diff lock . slower steep and rock crawling - lower gearing . ideally - both if funds allow. lower gearing would help a lot especially if you fit larger tyres .

Certainly both would compliment each other and in time may become a reality for me. Majority of my off road driving is high country not over difficult but on occasion seeking out new fishing spots, where what is ahead is not always predictable and generally find my LR gearing is too high(run 33s) and CRD. I rather have more low down torque and improved driveability at slower speed so reduction gearing would be an advantage with my setup.

[MB]

Agree with nipagu7 mate!
The type of slower more technical stuff you’re doing would unfortunately need both I’d suggest too.
As soon as you slow the climbing rate down to a much more comfortable speed you will need enhanced traction due to your loss of momentum.
Sand driving like we just did last summer found hours of shell grit patches up to the mouth of the Murray where LR reduction gears were just too low for the trucks there that had them.
Mind you their 150rwkw+ trucks smashed it in HR but our old 100rwkw stocky family wagon had to sit pinging in 4th LR most of the last half of that days adventure.
Front and rear air lockers through 63% custom reduction gears on my ute is a dream to drive up in our high country with how slow and comfortable it can go and like Cuppa kindly mentions a lot less damage can occur which is very reassuring and money saving too!

Disclaimer: One scenario to seriously watch out for with LR reduction gears is slippery mud steep mountain descents. Too much reduction like needed on rock crawling can find your truck breaking traction downwards and completely running out of engine rpm to try and gain it back.
You really do need to select your LR descent gear wisely in that scenario before committing downwards as changing gears say midway is never advisable in case you hit ‘Angel Gear’ (no gear and away you’re gone) !!

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[Bidja]

MB what did you end up doing Mark with your lockers. Have a few copper coins collected and looking at doing front locker and 43% reduction gears (CRD stock diff 4.1 on 33s_135rwkw/500N-m).

[MB]

ARB Air Lockers John Mate [emoji106]
Our entire Hills Crew uses them and my ute too so made sense for spare parts sharing out there [emoji106][emoji106]


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[Bidja]

ARB Air Lockers John Mate [emoji106]
Our entire Hills Crew uses them and my ute too so made sense for spare parts sharing out there [emoji106][emoji106]


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OK and did you install yourself or if U had it done, what sort of costs (unless much special discounted).

Interested as expect special high $$$s up my way. Would be in Canberra most likely if choose not to travel.

Plus any ideas for reduction gear install (transfer would be a heavy lift I guess).:gossip:

[MB]

Bought the locker and compressor on special combo direct from ARB about $1,200 IIRC.
Installed the compressor under front passenger seat utilising existing bolt holes in the floor and an adapter homemade plate.
Removed the front the diff in the shed and accidentally bastardised the new locker journal pressing the bearings on so took it to a specialist to clean it up and reinstalled all back at home in the shed.
43% reduction gears would be a good choice I suggest, purchased 63% custom gears here and had Patrolapart install them in my 6.5 ute years ago but just a whisker too slow for my likings on the slow Chev grunter.


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[Bidja]

ARB combo special _ so guess compressor thrown in as a savings pretty well. Will research more on locker type that best suit me. Most likely get locker and 43% reduction installed at same time.

Yeh was initially looking at 63% but have decided on 43% from reading around. Appreciate you suggesting same. Thanks Mark.

[MB]

Welcome John Mate!
It is hard to guesstimate how 43% on your higher reviving 3.0L with 4.1 diffs and 33’s will go but should be fine for your Kosciusko Trout needs[emoji106]
Rossco is super happy with his new 43% reduction 4.2TDi through 4.6 diffs on 35’s.
In saying that too AB still loves his 63% through same drive train and tyres as Ross.
Definitely worth getting some quotes from a shop for install, IIRC Patrolapart charged me $400-500 a few years ago.
All of Marks Patrol TC ratios do require some internal box carving/grinding to fit except for the 24% smaller gears that can fit straight in.
Personally wouldn’t choose the 24% as heard it’s not enough reduction for the gnarly climbs.
Cheers!



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[Bidja]

Would be nice to have good torque at 1200-1500rpm (even below) but not me. CRD does well these day but need up around 2000-2300RPM for confidence but motion is faster than like. Can hold on hauling well 500N-m @ 2000RPM 5th hwy(2wd of course).

Other day, for example going down to camp was fine but coming up out 2nd LR near top (Rock top of pic), needed slow mo (or head bash in roof) and stalled so dropped back into washout 1st LR no problem. Always most of prefer to have at least 1 ratio below me. "Old SWB '75 FJ/3L N/A with stock gearing would have had it for breakfast".

Thanks for install costs for ref and most likely Marks 43% will warrant rework of Transfer case.

Looked at 63% (good slower traction) but think the 43% would give me near 1 gear extra lower. Guess places I go are unpredictable sometimes but do go forth with caution as most times only me(43 could be enough and eng won't scream out before needing HR)..

[Rossco]

I'm happy when the 43's but think I would be equally happy with the 63's. If your after a little bit more the 43's will do the job fine, 63's will really crawl if that's what your into. Reckon you'd be happy with 43s. .

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[Bidja]

Thanks Rossco, appreciate your comments mate.
Just have to work out the locker type_ARB air locker does appeal. Did see the US made OX locker (mechanical engagement, do like their use of a cable and in-cab lever for engagement (thinking though not available for Nissan Patrol). Have sent them an email will see what they say.

Edit: Have just received email back from OX Locker (OX_USA) and advise that:
"We do not make one for the Nissan’s at all".
Pitty that_will move on deciding.

[mudnut]

While you're deciding, could someone please explain which ARB seals fail and allow diff fumes to enter the cabin? And is there a an easy fix, or have they dealt with that issue?

[MB]

The only way I could imagine diff fumes ‘constantly’ entering the cabin Muddy Mate would be through a jammed open locker solenoid if they’re installed in doors. I prefer them safely inside anyway and will always get the slightest wiff selecting on/off/on around hairpin climbing hills. One could always take the solenoid exhaust diffusers out and pipe exhaust them outside too whilst maintaining all the good bits solenoid/compressor safely indoors. To be honest hasn’t bothered me yet, most times when the lockers are on I have my head half out the window choosing rock lines slowly crawling and the Chev’s diesel incoming exhaust window fumes are much more of a problem [emoji23]


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[Winnie]

The only way I could imagine diff fumes ‘constantly’ entering the cabin Muddy Mate would be through a jammed open locker solenoid if they’re installed in doors. I prefer them safely inside anyway and will always get the slightest wiff selecting on/off/on around hairpin climbing hills. One could always take the solenoid exhaust diffusers out and pipe exhaust them outside too whilst maintaining all the good bits solenoid/compressor safely indoors. To be honest hasn’t bothered me yet, most times when the lockers are on I have my head half out the window choosing rock lines slowly crawling and the Chev’s diesel incoming exhaust window fumes are much more of a problem [emoji23]


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkYes my solenoids are in the cab and when ARB installed it they vented them outside.

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[MB]

Another peace of mind factor keeping all the good bits safely indoors is the audible tell tales that everything is working as it should under extreme much needed circumstances.
An example of this is if your compressor is kicking in too often you’ve sprung a slight leak somewhere out there. If your compressor is running full time then you’ve accidentally ripped a line clean off.
The solenoid/s (plural for twin lockers) have a very distinct sound when they’re exhausting properly or not.
Prior to installing a moisture remover/capture thingy in my main air system line prior to the 20L under tray air tank I was getting locker solenoids freezing shut on snow trips, well worth installing a good one of them for sure [emoji106][emoji106]


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[MB]

Decided to give Grandpa Spec his first shot of Viagra tomorrow....look out Ladies [emoji23][emoji106][emoji106]
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2020/12/4.jpg



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[Winnie]

Decided to give Grandpa Spec his first shot of Viagra tomorrow....look out Ladies [emoji23][emoji106][emoji106]
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2020/12/4.jpg



Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkYou are an absolute mad bastard MB!

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[Rossco]

Bloodey el Markie, no stopp'n ya [emoji106][emoji106]


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[PeeBee]

You installing MB - need my tap for the diff fitting? Watch out for the location, sure you won't get caught twice?. Sing out if you need it. Is this for front or rear?

[mudnut]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuzGxAKOnoY

[MB]

You installing MB - need my tap for the diff fitting? Watch out for the location, sure you won't get caught twice?. Sing out if you need it. Is this for front or rear?

That would be awesome again thanks Philstar Mate!
Utes loaded up now and off to the factory to do it down there today[emoji106]
Finally tracked down where I posted last installation booboos on the family wagon here:

What did you do to your Patrol today!
https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?share_fid=16273&share_tid=8424&share_pid=796335&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Enissanpatrol%2Ecom%2Eau%2Ff orums%2Fshowpost%2Ephp%3Fp%3D796335&share_type=t

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2020/12/7.jpg
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2020/12/8.jpg

Will kindly have access to a proper press today from the mechanic next to work and I’ll be sure to drill the 1/4” NPT bung further away from the crown this time around [emoji23][emoji106][emoji106]


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[Bidja]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuzGxAKOnoY

That was a good display and noted that his lockers were the Terrain Tamer that use the new 4 pin design Harrop Eaton ELocker. Been checking these out and they no longer use the cam ramp disc plate with the ball bearings to provide disc plate separation to move the pins to lockup assy. Harrop now use 4 pins in lieu of the ball bearing and at disc plate rotation/engement,the pins force a lug profiled lock plate to engage with the housing. Harrop claim a more positive lock engagement and axle rotational lag of max 1/8 turn in lieu of 1/2 turn experienced with earlier design.

For Info: Posted Harrop Eaton ELocker video of current build/operation
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nT_H6rpd-Ck

[MB]

Step #1 completed [emoji736]
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2020/12/9.jpg
Crikey some of these 35 year old OEM bolts were tight [emoji123][emoji23]


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[MB]

Mark up the bearing carriers:

A single ‘snake bite’ left:

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2020/12/10.jpg

Double ‘snake bite’ right:

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2020/12/11.jpg


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[MB]

A quick ‘Boiling Water’ bath expansion for the crown to fit over the new ARB center:

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2020/12/12.jpg
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2020/12/13.jpg

And....this is where I stuffed up last time, make sure to utilise a correct sized press for the bearings!

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2020/12/14.jpg

It’s the tiny air hole area on the journal that needs to be scratch free!!

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2020/12/15.jpg


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[Winnie]

Loving the photo journey, never seen how these are installed before.

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[MB]

Remembering from last time, found the ARB instructions a little misleading in regards to drilling and tapping the airline into the housing. Fingers crossed this slightly altered location should create a straight line away from the crown leading edge:

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2020/12/16.jpg

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2020/12/17.jpg

Chose to centralise the airline between two upper housing bolts for hopefully easier reinstall also:

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2020/12/18.jpg

Thank you kindly PeeBee Mate for driving your 1/4 NPT tap all the way out again, appreciated heaps [emoji120][emoji106][emoji106]



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[Bidja]

MB Noticed U wiped off the hands for assy_looking good mate:smiley_thumbs_up:

After 30 yrs of hard yakka, how do teeth look (crown/pinion wear mark / shine) and out of interest did U check backlash with indicator_ nom 0.010"??? is the go not sure there..

[MB]

All looks pretty decent inside John Mate, tis only the front diff though so far less wear expected [emoji106]
Set backlash by feel under mechanics guidance next factory over [emoji1696]



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[MB]

All torqued up again:

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2020/12/19.jpg

Seal housing installed:

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2020/12/20.jpg

Much happier with the straight line out this time around:

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2020/12/21.jpg

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2020/12/22.jpg

Bench tested up to 90psi with no leaks, hooray [emoji16]

Now to bolt it all back together again and hook up some in cab switches and air [emoji106][emoji106]




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[MB]

Harrop claim a more positive lock engagement and axle rotational lag of max 1/8 turn in lieu of 1/2 turn experienced with earlier design. .....]

Apologies ‘snippeting/quoting’ here John Mate!
As per this thread start and top members usage needs, I so wished too for an easier +/- couple of wires to connect activation too on the family touring/hybrid bushpig wagon truckster.
It is honestly now hopeful as you mention that elecy locking has reduced from 1/2 < > 1/8th of a spin but let’s still equate that up steep hairpin tracks, not straight line beaches and or bull dust deep long power stretching pits.
Please do correct me if late wrong calculations Brother[emoji106]
33” say legal tyre = 838mm diameter.
Circumference = 2,633mm.
Now a much better designed 1/8th of rotation for lock = 329mm travel.
As far as I nuffy understand we need to at least double that to (658mm) for a hairpin on/off/on rollback hairpin sometimes needed gnarly climbing turns.
Absolute bonus for newage elecy systems outback would be zero atmospheric diff intake such as salts etc...[emoji106][emoji106]

















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[Bidja]

All good Mark. IMO, Both locker would satisfy my out and about requirements.
Straight fwd Harrop ELocker install does appeal. ELocker having no airlines/compressor is the big one for me, easier to twist a couple of wires and being out (mostly alone), ready use spares can be difficult sometimes to ensure availability for repair.

Rotation comment is fair enough. Noted that Harrop state in their video that their current lock plate design (lugs) being profiled same as those in housing _ that when axles twist/wind up the force applied between the lugs of the lock plate to housing causes the mechanism to mechanically/physically lock solid(unless load comes off). How true not sure.


Recall many years ago in the SWB having to reverse down a troublesome boulder filled track, needed 3 guys on the bull bar to keep front wheels on the ground (no front locker would have helped me here most likely if by myself)_"Widow Maker" it was called (this one NSW).
I avoid this carry on.

[tryan277]

While you're deciding, could someone please explain which ARB seals fail and allow diff fumes to enter the cabin? And is there a an easy fix, or have they dealt with that issue?

Hi Mudnut
My experience.
I have the first designed rear locker to suit a GQ Patrol.

The "seals" that fail are the o rings inside the steel collar that moves to lock the diff.
Over time the o rings will wear/flatten and allow leakage, most noticeable as mentioned by others that the air compressor will cycle more often getting shorter times between operation when the locker is engaged and the "oil fumes" being expelled when disengaging the locker, unless the discharge has been piped outside. Ours is not.

Why do they wear/flatten? Usage would be the most common, then there is the installation. I think if done correctly then you will get maximum life. Done incorrectly ie. the routing of the copper pipe inside the diff causes unnessacary pressure/distortion on the moving steel collar.

Easy Fix - That depends on ones experience/ability - O rings have to be replaced. Was the installation done correctly when the locker was installed. I replaced the o rings in our rear locker. Not hard, obviously need the tools and the diff is bloody heavy. The sliding collar can be removed to access the o rings without having the to dismantle the crown wheel and pinion. I sourced o rings from an o ring supplier in Dandenong. Having a compressor to supply 90 psi to test before reinstalling diff is a good idea.

Have they dealt with the issue? As mentioned I think it comes down to installation, if done correctly then other then long term wear they should last.


If you look at page 6 of this thread and the picture supplied by MB and zoom in on the steel collar you should be able to see where the 2 o rings are.



My 2 cents worth

Cheers Trevor

[MB]

Awesome info thanks too Trevor Mate!
Hang on to those original lockers there, I hear the competition blokes prefer the oldest sets for slightly greater internal abuse strength preferred than new sets.
ARB appear to have fixed the Oring issue somewhat these days with a new Quad Oring set found supplied on my last two installs.
They’re basically still a ring but more of a square profile with two raised edges on each seating side.
This creates a dual seal on each side of the journal hole now so hopefully we’ll get twice as long between lugging out these bloody heavy diffs again as you kindly mention[emoji23]
Do have to be super careful too with these new Quad Orings installation as they are fiddly little buggers to ensure they are not twisted or leaning. Use some oil to carefully/lightly twist the seal housing over the journal too.
Fingers crossed I’ve got it right hopefully [emoji1696]

EDIT: Found a replacement set of the new style Quad Orings online if ever needed:

https://patrolapart.com.au/product/arb-air-locker-quad-orings-for-newer-style-diff-locks-pair

The ARB ones supplied here were more of a ‘tan/brown’ colour though and felt a lot more rigid than a standard old type ‘black’ rubber Oring if that makes sense.
What you’ll see in my picture above is the oil used to assist installation squeezing out between the journal seal [emoji106]

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[nissannewby]

The tan/brown and also the ones advertised at patrolapart are viton. Viton is better at maintaining its integrity at higher temperatures than standard nitrile o-rings.

[MB]

Cheers Always Mat Mate[emoji106][emoji106]
‘Viton’ as you’ve kindly educated here did appear super tough whilst scarily trying to tweak it into the grooves with the edge of my thumb nail, honestly thought I was going to start a nick and no doubt would have on old school Orings.


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[MB]

Tip12345 Mate, Legends kindly helped me here, not the Dodgey threads that SausageFingersTD created similar whilst snoozing [emoji42][emoji23][emoji106][emoji106]


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