ZD30 CRD possible fuel starving loss of power problem with no codes

[R055IE]

Hi All,

Still ongoing with the fuel starvation , losing power intermittent issue.

Need some help , can’t be the first one on here , and it’s doing my head in , I need this vehicle to be reliable as I travel all over outback WA for work and right now I don’t trust it to drive around town ....

For info the car drives fine then when ever it wants it loses power , no throttle response , just like air in the system or no fuel pressure , then it picks up again and either goes back to normal or keeps randomly doing it for the rest of the trip.

When it’s not doing it , the power and torque are normal.

I dropped the tank today , checked the hoses at the tank, pulled the pick up out and checked it , found nothing wrong.
Yesterday I bypassed the filter and it kept doing it.

Q. Could it be the pressure relief in the rail ? But the fault comes and goes ?

Or could it be the lift pump ?? should I fit a external fuel pump to help it ??

The only codes I have previously had were for the maf sensor , throttle body and throttle pedal which I replaced with no dramas since .

Thanks

[Fireblade]

there is no lift pump in these. only the injector pump. some people do fit lift pumps to aid in starting and make it easier on the injector pump though.

if the pressure reliefe valve were failing im it would only onpen (relieve the pressure) when the rail pressure gets really high. sometimes they can stick open and that'll cause hard to start.

see you say you had codes for throttle pedal, nissan warranty had a saftery recall out to replace the pedal assembly.

check your vacuum lines. seen alot where the line to the turbo actuator cracks but i would expect that to present symptoms all the time not intermittently.

also been told to always use genuine fuel filters. if your running after market (non genuine) id sway back to genuine.
its ok to add a good quality secondary filter to the system though and there is still no need for lift pumps..

also have seen a rag in a fuel tank once, intermittently would block the pickup pipe in the tank. he was as shocked as we were to see a old shirt sleeve in the tank.

[R055IE]

Hi Fireblade,

According to Nissan all recalls on my vehicle have been done , I was hoping they hadn’t to get out of buying the parts but not that lucky,

There is no trouble starting or idling.

I have run all new vac lines to the turbo when I added the boost controller and needle valve , the problem was there before doing this as well.

The problem was still there after I bypassed the filter with an inline one.

There was nothing in the tank , I pulled the spring loaded thing off the bottom off the suction line and pulled it apart but everything looked good.

Got me stumped.

[Hodge]

For info the car drives fine then when ever it wants it loses power , no throttle response , just like air in the system or no fuel pressure , then it picks up again and either goes back to normal or keeps randomly doing it for the rest of the trip.

When it’s not doing it , the power and torque are normal.

\ Mate, to me this has limp mode written all over it, usually caused by overboosting. You lose throttle response , and once you're OFF the throttle it resets its self until next time it gets triggered again.
\ Do you have a boost gauge ???

[R055IE]

The boost is set to approx 20psi , but it may spike a bit as it spools up pretty quick

When does limp mode kick in ?

Will go out and drop it a bit and see what happens

[BillsGU]

Reduce your boost a bit. As above ^^^^^^ - Sounds like limp mode. It apparently varies, but my Patrol went in to limp mode above 15 PSI until I modified it.

[R055IE]

Hi All ,
So I adjusted the boost down , it now runs at around 15psi , it spiked to around 17psi between gear changes and runs
10-12 psi at 100 km.

Looking at it now I think it may have been spiking to around 25 psi or so , my gauge only goes to 20psi.

It did run with the fault after I adjusted it and drove it out my driveway (about 150m) to test it , but once on the road and opened up it ran faultless, will keep on it hopefully it’s as simple as this , fingers crossed

[BillsGU]

Good to hear! You may have a sticky ball valve in the boost controller as well. If it persists open the valve and clean the ball.

[R055IE]

Hi All,

False alarm, started playing up straight away this morning just idling out of the driveway, then drove about 8km without issue and then started, worse its ever been, drove the rest of the way to work (about 10km of dirt roads) at about 50km/h no throttle response , dying like no fuel, no codes as usual.

?????

Thanks Bill, but this problem was around before fitting the boost controller, fitting it was a suggested fix previously..

has to be something simple or rattling or something , cant see anything unusual.

temped to run a pump at the tank to pressurize the inlet but don't want to keep wasting money , should I do it anyway ??? Any thoughts are more than appreciated...

[BillsGU]

Have you changed the fuel filter? When/If you do, cut the old one open and see if it has picked up any muck out of your tank.

[R055IE]

Hi Bill,

Yes I changed the filter , it was clean , I pulled the tank out on Friday and it was spotless inside, I was hoping to find a rag stuck to the pick up or floating around....

I just went out and bled the filter to see if there was any air and I have noticed that the fuel bulb pump no longer gets firm after a couple of pumps ??

I took the outlet off the filter (hose to engine) and it is pumping good amounts of diesel when squeezed with no air present.

I hooked it back up and took the return off the filter and pumped the bulb but no return came through ??

The bulb doesn't firm up and I have no return ??

[Bidja]

Certainly do not rule out possible fuel issue.

With engine at idle is your actuator rod lifting and dropping all the way when you connect and disconnect vac hose at actuator?

Check and see if the electrical connector for the VNT vac solenoid is securely plugged in. CRD need this plugged in with manual boost control, DI do not.

[Bidja]

Maybe air trap.

FWIW

For me, previous fuel filter changes have had no problems, but the last filter change, the primer bulb would not come up firm. Was cranking with main battery and was quickly fading so paralleled up Aux. Only a couple attempts and decided not good.

Ended up removing both fuel tank filler caps and primed up by leaving larger filter metal outlet hose off and squeezed primer bulb letting the filter vent thru outlet pipe, then placed finger over the metal outlet pipe while letting the bulb expand to draw fuel into and thru filter (many pumps). Pressure in bulb came up when the filter was near full and when I had a visual of fuel put hose on, primed bulb further maybe 6 times and came solid. Glowed / cranked and eng started straight up and then pumped primer a few more times at idle and all was good there after..

[R055IE]

Hi All,

just went and took the black return valve thing off the top of the fuel filter and pumped diesel out of the filter through that hole , got a bit of air out, put it back together and have pressure in the bulb now.

Bidga, the connector is connected and the actuator rod is moving about 15mm

NOTE: this problem only started after I fitted the 3" exhaust , could of been a coincidence , maybe not ??

[Hodge]

NOTE: this problem only started after I fitted the 3" exhaust , could of been a coincidence , maybe not ??

Again, you mentioning this, it triggers possible overboosting , hence possible limp mode again. Larger exhaust obviously promotes more flow through the snail, hence more boost, which possibly triggers limp mode.
One of limp modes primary triggers is overboost. ZD30 crd are very sensitive to this...



However... You mentioned it played up idling this morning ??? When you say idling, you mean putting along slowly out of driveway?

[R055IE]

Hey Hodge,

The boost is now set at 15psi.

I am onsite now but the problem happens straight after start up as you go to drive out of the carpark, it doesn't matter about the rev range, the speed, the gear or the terrain , it just does it

[Bidja]

R055IE

As you got a solid primer bulb "Pump it at idle" several times to purge a bit.

As Bill BillsGU, suggested clean you boost controller (Tillix/Dawes).

Try your testing with you needle valve fully closed, CRD can handle max spool.

If still no joy we can isolate manual boost control and run actuator direct off vac line. Hold off on this at this stage, need to very careful not to overboost.

What boost gauge U have and what is the max scale reading?
What max boost or bounce are you getting with quick full pedal with slight eng load (say 40-50%)?

Out of interest, have U blocked your EGR?

[R055IE]

Hi All,

I pumped the bulb at idle, pulled the boost controller apart (all clean) and reset to 15psi, closed needle valve and went for a drive.

No throttle response at all , dead pedal , zero boost , reset needle valave and still no throttle response, dead pedal, zero boost,

Fault code PO123 is now coming up but I am unsure if this is just an offshoot of something else.

I have already replaced the throttle pedal TPS assembly.

wont even get home tonight if it doesn't get sorted today.

Going to go and try the vac line to the actuator see if it can move at least....

[Hodge]

Hi All,

I pumped the bulb at idle, pulled the boost controller apart (all clean) and reset to 15psi, closed needle valve and went for a drive.

No throttle response at all , dead pedal , zero boost , reset needle valave and still no throttle response, dead pedal, zero boost,

Fault code PO123 is now coming up but I am unsure if this is just an offshoot of something else.

I have already replaced the throttle pedal TPS assembly.

wont even get home tonight if it doesn't get sorted today.

Going to go and try the vac line to the actuator see if it can move at least....


Hey mate. When my fuel relief valve on my CRD blew open, I was getting that code, 0123 and 1089 at the same time. I think i still got photos at home when I replaced mine. Geez been a while i dont remember the instructions for it. From memory it's check that there is NO fuel going through the valve at approx. idle pressures.

Not sure whether it's worth checking that out perhaps...

[Bidja]

P0123 Throttle/Pedal Position Sensor/Switch A Circuit High Input.

Suggest you clear all trouble codes and start from there as you have stated that: have already replaced the throttle pedal TPS assembly.

Yeah bypass manual boost control. There is a vac hose that runs along front of motor may have broken but you said that actuator is working with vac hose on/off actuator (check operation again).

[R055IE]

Code PO123 will not clear so I Just replaced the Throttle pedal out with the old one as the same codes are coming up ,

Read a post on here somewhere showing how to clean them out , might try that ...

Pretty stumped right now , stuck onsite going nowhere , so have to try something

Got any other ideas ??

[R055IE]

Hodge Q.Could the pressure relief show up as an intermittent problem at different revs / loads / conditions ? wouldn't it just fail ??

[Hodge]

@Hodge (http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/member.php?u=15680) Q.Could the pressure relief show up as an intermittent problem at different revs / loads / conditions ? wouldn't it just fail ??

This is how mine went ...
First time it failed and popped that code was just taking off at a set of lights then lost nearly ALL throttle, engine light came up, turned motor off then on and it was good to go, it drove fine for maybe a week, and then losing throttle at random times and motor cranking but not starting symptoms began showing up here and there and became more regular. Each time the valve code popped up, and then at later stages BOTH codes popped up.
This is when I just took the car to nissan as i still had stat warranty and within 20 minutes they diagnosed it as a relief valve.

Don't quote me on this. But my understanding behind this valve is, once it's cherry is popped , it can still withstand pressure up to a point until it completely fails / gets worse. It leaks and it leaks internally back into the return pipe so you can't see it leaking.
This is from what I remember the nissan "tech" explaining it to me back then... (back in 2014). Now, a lot of people consider nissan tech's knowledge with that of a fence post. But , I drove out of there with full power.

As to WHY I also got the P0123 code ( the one your getting ) at the same time * shrug * . But I never got it again since that valve was replaced. Mind you, I sold that car 4 years ago.

More importantly that this may NOT be your issue, but sometimes systems are known to have a domino effect and throw up random codes down the line...

[R055IE]

Thanks Hodge,

I have just drilled , cleaned out and refitted my spare TPS.

If that doesn't make it better I will head down the Pressure relief path

[R055IE]

Update,

Didn't make any difference cleaning out the TPS, I have just removed the Boost controller and needle valve and put it back stock. has boost now and some throttle but the boost is hunting now under acceleration fluctuating between about 10 and 15 psi.

Might have to take it to an expert.....

[Hodge]

Update,

Didn't make any difference cleaning out the TPS, I have just removed the Boost controller and needle valve and put it back stock. has boost now and some throttle but the boost is hunting now under acceleration fluctuating between about 10 and 15 psi.

Might have to take it to an expert.....Damn..not good to hear TPS cleaning didn't help.

Boost hunting or yoyo effect on zd30 crd is a factory normal effect.
Needles and Dawes valves give it a linear smooth Boost curve.

Sent from Pixel 3a XL on Tapatalk Pro

[R055IE]

Hi All ,

Another update ,

After going through the wiring schematics I traced all the earths and checked them , while checking for earths behind the drives side kick panel I noticed an extension loom between the main loom and the pedal.

After removing it and plugging the main loom directly to the pedal the problem was gone ... the PO123 fault came up again after an hour of driving but with no symptoms , maybe it was because I had had drilled the pedal and tried to clean it ?

The Ute is now at the auto elects , getting them to go through everything and fix any dodgy stufff they find , they did say that the loom extension is standard in patrols so maybe others that are having problems with there tps could try removing it also .

Going out the great central road to near the NT border on Tuesday so it needs to be on its best behaviour.

[R055IE]

Hi All,

FYI , The auto elec found a fault in the ground wire for sensor 1 on the accelerator pedal tps

After weeks of chasing codes and changing out unnecessary parts , it was $250 well spent , Hopefully this the end of it

[Stump2jz]

So instead of starting a new thread, i may aswel add to this one. Im having very similar issues with my 07 crd. Problems just came out of the blue for me. No build up or anything. I can eventually start mine after some areostart, priming and winding for ages. Mine threw a p0089 code a few weeks ago. So i replaced the suction control valve. No change. I have since put in a new fuel filter, new glow plugs, new fuel lines at the tank and at the filter to the ip, and replaced the primer bulb and nothing has changed. I can drive about 50m under full load, boost drops from 15psi to about 10psi and it just feels like turbo lag. then after a few minutes of driving normally, it just completely dies. I have to pull over and use areostart and prime to get it running again.

Wondering what i should be looking at next. Relief valve on the rail? Injectors? Or a lift pump? Or should i bypass the fuel filter for a moment to see if it will start? Non genuine fuel filter, just an sca one as ive never has issues with them before. Feels like air in the system to me but any other advice is greatly appreciated.

[Bidja]

So instead of starting a new thread, i may aswel add to this one. Im having very similar issues with my 07 crd. Problems just came out of the blue for me. No build up or anything. I can eventually start mine after some areostart, priming and winding for ages. Mine threw a p0089 code a few weeks ago. So i replaced the suction control valve. No change. I have since put in a new fuel filter, new glow plugs, new fuel lines at the tank and at the filter to the ip, and replaced the primer bulb and nothing has changed. I can drive about 50m under full load, boost drops from 15psi to about 10psi and it just feels like turbo lag. then after a few minutes of driving normally, it just completely dies. I have to pull over and use areostart and prime to get it running again.

Wondering what i should be looking at next. Relief valve on the rail? Injectors? Or a lift pump? Or should i bypass the fuel filter for a moment to see if it will start? Non genuine fuel filter, just an sca one as ive never has issues with them before. Feels like air in the system to me but any other advice is greatly appreciated.

Firstly, CRD do not handle fuel delivery restriction too well so IMO only use Genuine fuel filters.
Based on my experience: 12 months so ago, I experience code P0089 under full pedal and only happened twice (pwr only dropped away momentarily). Then shortly after noticed diesel leaking from fuel pump (over o/s of housing side plate), and needed a rebuild but was advised to install new pump. Installed no further problems.

[Stump2jz]

Well im 99% sure i dont have diesel leaking out of the pump. Guess i will go and get a genuine filter tomorrow and see how that goes.

[Stump2jz]

Well no change with a genuine filter. Started better when it was cold, but as soon as it warmed up it went to shit. Fuel tank vent seems to be clear as i can pressurize the main tank just by blowing air down the vent with just my normal lung pressure. Going to try and limp it to work tomorrow to blow out the lines and probably fit a new pressure relief valve to the rail. This is doing my head in

[Bidja]

Pressure relief valve OK but may also need to look at fuel pump / injectors ie: do a return a return leakage.

[dermie72]

GDay Stump2jz,
how'd you go with your power loss issue? I have a 2015 zd30 with the standard NADS fitted (3" exhaust, boost/egt guages, dawes and needle) as well as a DP Chip. Occaisionally I will lose power for maybe 1-2 seconds with that distictive rattley diesel sound, then power comes back. Seems to happen when cold more often than not. The Scan Guage is showing a P0089 code - Fuel Pressue Regulator. It's been doing it for so long I can't really remember when it started (before or after the mods). But, I'd love to get rid of it. A couple of times it's been more persistent, losing power all together and I 've had to back right off to reset. I'll reset the code today and monitor.