CAV's what brand of filter is the best ?

[First Pooy]

I am looking for a quality filter,it has been suggested a Delphi what else is out there ?,And is a CAV with a glass bowl good enough on it's own or do I need a secondary filter with todays fuel I just installed my high $$$$ injector pump and I want to protect it, I have a 92 Gq Td42

[mudski]

I am looking for a quality filter,it has been suggested a Delphi what else is out there ?,And is a CAV with a glass bowl good enough on it's own or do I need a secondary filter with todays fuel I just installed my high $$$$ injector pump and I want to protect it, I have a 92 Gq Td42

My input.
I sell engine filtration for a living. I am a Fleetguard and Donaldson wholesaler. I have sold gazzilions of the CAV setups, also the Fuel manager setups etc. Unless you live in remote areas where your fuel supply is less than desired, the stock filter will be more than perfect. Eevn if you were to do a remote trip, I would just take a few spare OEM or equivalent filters on the trip as spares.
Whilst engine fuel filtration is important, on a TD42 its not as important as a newer common rail motor as they require much higher fuel pressures and tolerances are far less.
The other issue that has risen its head is some people have added an extra filter setup and then they have experienced some performance issues. This is due to the extra fuel flow restriction from adding a secondary filter. This is moreso for th CRD motors though. Not so common though but it can happen.

All in all. In my opinion. If you want to protect your IP. Change the stock filter more often. And use a quality filter. I change mine every 15 though regardless. And my Patrol wouldn't even see 15k in a year.

[Cuppa]

I use a CAV filter as a 'pre-filter' before the stock factory filter. It works (& no fuel restriction issues).I respect Mudski's knowledge but neverthless own a car I purchased to both travel in remote desert areas where fuel is not always as clean as in the city, & to last me for many years. Fuel pumps are expensive things to fix so I feel it not unreasonable to protect the pump from potential premature wear..... so I consider the extra filter to be cheap insurance.

The pic below shows both filters which were fitted at the same time after a trip of several months up to Queensland via dirt roads, around the outback channel country & back to Victoria. I decided after that to double the change period for standard filter.
I chose the CAV type filter because replacement filters will be available in just about any country town which supports agriculture of some sort. (Anywhere there are tractors). The downside is that changing filters is a bit more fiddly than a simple screw on type, but considering the effectiveness & the low filter cost I'm happy.

A few years ago a friend picked up some dirty fuel well in the middle of woop woop, & travelled some distance before his filter clogged up. He was able to get to where he was going, a couple of hundred remote kilometres by changing CAV filters & running until they clogged. He got through 6 or 7 filters on that leg of his journey. The point is that with the low cost he could afford to carry a few spares, & being quite small could fit them into his available space. I also fitted a diesel resistant one way bulb primer in line at the same time which makes priming an absolute breeze compared to the silly little pump on top of the standard filter.

78320

[mudski]

In your case Cuppa, or any case that see's someone being off road a lot and buying fuel from god knows where, a pre filter would certainly help. No doubt. But, for the majority of shopping trolleys, its not really a necessity, in my opinion.

If you are going to put a secondary filter on though. The CAV's are good. They are 12 micron at 99% efficiency, so it filters fairly fine particles but may not be enough for the CRD motors. The filters are dirt cheap too, about $6. Get a spare bowl too, and also zip tie some thick rubber around the bowl to protect it.

[PeeBee]

I swapped out my nissan factory filter for the CAV296 when I had the 2.8TD engine. When the conversion to the Chev was done,Brunswick left the CAV in place. It wasn't until I added flowmeters to the diesel supply and return lines that I found out what the engine fuel system was doing. Long story short, the CAV296 is rated for 42LPHR, so it might be a good check to check what your engine demand is before swapping to the CAV - I liked the CAV as its glass bowl made it easy to spot water, however it was way under size for the Chev in N/A format and totally undersized for the S/C. I now run fleetgurd units rated at 300LPHR with a lift pump rated at 440lpHR. I expect demand to be around the 180 - 200LPHR thru the filter, with maybe 90% going back to tank

[Cuppa]

In your case Cuppa, or any case that see's someone being off road a lot and buying fuel from god knows where, a pre filter would certainly help. No doubt. But, for the majority of shopping trolleys, its not really a necessity, in my opinion.

If you are going to put a secondary filter on though. The CAV's are good. They are 12 micron at 99% efficiency, so it filters fairly fine particles but may not be enough for the CRD motors. The filters are dirt cheap too, about $6. Get a spare bowl too, and also zip tie some thick rubber around the bowl to protect it.

Yep not recommended for common rail motors, & unnecessary for cars that get their fuel in populated areas, but filtration is a bit better than 12 microns I think, at least according to this according to this.

78321

Mind you I have read claims they are as low as 2 microns elsewhere on the 'net (have my doubts about that though - I would think that may well affect fuel flow). My guess is that along with the variety of brands of filter that fit these CAV type housings there is probably a variation in micron ratings. Bottom line for me is that it works as per my previous photo & with no fuel flow issues using the stock GU fuel pump & no additional lift pump. That photo was after around 10,000kms. As a result I decided to change the CAV every 10,000 & the standard filter at 20,000, I'm yet to do that though. If I have the means to cut open the standard filter when I next change it I will, & if it looks clean enough may up the next change interval of the standard to 30,000kms.

[ChadGU]

Good experience and knowledgeable comments guys.
I am planning a trip to remoter areas latter this year and need to put a secondary fuel filter/separator system on my 2014 CRD Ute, and the stand alone OEM filter doesn't fill me with confidence. I know how important it is to keep that fuel clean and enough volume for IP etc.
Anyone have links, names etc. of systems i could look at? want to start pricing it up.
I can install it myself, it's not not a drama if it's before or after OEM filter. Just want to look at some option and work out which is best value for money.

[PeeBee]

Good experience and knowledgeable comments guys.
I am planning a trip to remoter areas latter this year and need to put a secondary fuel filter/separator system on my 2014 CRD Ute, and the stand alone OEM filter doesn't fill me with confidence. I know how important it is to keep that fuel clean and enough volume for IP etc.
Anyone have links, names etc. of systems i could look at? want to start pricing it up.
I can install it myself, it's not not a drama if it's before or after OEM filter. Just want to look at some option and work out which is best value for money.

Talk to mudski, he knows his stuff

[mudski]

Yep not recommended for common rail motors, & unnecessary for cars that get their fuel in populated areas, but filtration is a bit better than 12 microns I think, at least according to this according to this.

78321

Mind you I have read claims they are as low as 2 microns elsewhere on the 'net (have my doubts about that though - I would think that may well affect fuel flow). My guess is that along with the variety of brands of filter that fit these CAV type housings there is probably a variation in micron ratings. Bottom line for me is that it works as per my previous photo & with no fuel flow issues using the stock GU fuel pump & no additional lift pump. That photo was after around 10,000kms. As a result I decided to change the CAV every 10,000 & the standard filter at 20,000, I'm yet to do that though. If I have the means to cut open the standard filter when I next change it I will, & if it looks clean enough may up the next change interval of the standard to 30,000kms.

They claim it to be 5 micron, but at what beta rating? It might be 5 micron at beta 2, which is 50% efficiency. Which means the filter will let 50% of particles at 5 micron or larger through. Some filters will have multiple ratings, 5 micron at beta 2, 10 micron at beta 10 (1 out of every 10 particles will pass through the filter) etc etc.
The beta ratings are as follows.

Beta Ratio. How Many Particles of a Given Size Will Pass
Through the Filter?----- Actual Filter Efficiency
2 ---1 out of every 2 particles 50%
10 ---1 out of every 10 particles 90%
20 ---1 out of every 20 particles 95%
75 ----1 out of every 75 particles 98.7%
100 ---1 out of every 100 particles 99%
200 ---1 out of every 200 particles 99.5%
1000 ---1 out of every 1000 particles 99.9%
2000 ---1 out of every 2000 particles 99.95%

So you can have a filter will 2 micron filtration but it has a really poor beta rating, which is just as important than micron rating. If the Delphi is 5 at beta 75 or better, then I would consider it a good filter.

[mudski]

78321


Notice they state not recommended for CRD motors. That tells me that the beta rating is poor. We sell 5, 7 and 11 micron filters suitable for CRD motors as the beta is suited...

[mudski]

I swapped out my nissan factory filter for the CAV296 when I had the 2.8TD engine. When the conversion to the Chev was done,Brunswick left the CAV in place. It wasn't until I added flowmeters to the diesel supply and return lines that I found out what the engine fuel system was doing. Long story short, the CAV296 is rated for 42LPHR, so it might be a good check to check what your engine demand is before swapping to the CAV - I liked the CAV as its glass bowl made it easy to spot water, however it was way under size for the Chev in N/A format and totally undersized for the S/C. I now run fleetgurd units rated at 300LPHR with a lift pump rated at 440lpHR. I expect demand to be around the 180 - 200LPHR thru the filter, with maybe 90% going back to tank

Whats the Fleetguard filter number your using Phil?

[mudski]

Good experience and knowledgeable comments guys.
I am planning a trip to remoter areas latter this year and need to put a secondary fuel filter/separator system on my 2014 CRD Ute, and the stand alone OEM filter doesn't fill me with confidence. I know how important it is to keep that fuel clean and enough volume for IP etc.
Anyone have links, names etc. of systems i could look at? want to start pricing it up.
I can install it myself, it's not not a drama if it's before or after OEM filter. Just want to look at some option and work out which is best value for money.

where are you located mate?

[Cuppa]

They claim it to be 5 micron, but at what beta rating? It might be 5 micron at beta 2, which is 50% efficiency. Which means the filter will let 50% of particles at 5 micron or larger through. Some filters will have multiple ratings, 5 micron at beta 2, 10 micron at beta 10 (1 out of every 10 particles will pass through the filter) etc etc.
The beta ratings are as follows.

Beta Ratio. How Many Particles of a Given Size Will Pass
Through the Filter?----- Actual Filter Efficiency
2 ---1 out of every 2 particles 50%
10 ---1 out of every 10 particles 90%
20 ---1 out of every 20 particles 95%
75 ----1 out of every 75 particles 98.7%
100 ---1 out of every 100 particles 99%
200 ---1 out of every 200 particles 99.5%
1000 ---1 out of every 1000 particles 99.9%
2000 ---1 out of every 2000 particles 99.95%

So you can have a filter will 2 micron filtration but it has a really poor beta rating, which is just as important than micron rating. If the Delphi is 5 at beta 75 or better, then I would consider it a good filter.

Thanks Mark, good info. I found this article which confirms what you've said which some may be interested to read.
https://www.donaldsontoolbox.com.au/files/4514/9266/2150/13TT001_Comparing_Fuel_Filters__Micron_Ratings_031 7.pdf

I looked everywhere to find the absolute rating for the Delphi HDF296 but failed until I came back to this thread & realised you had already posted it earlier. Doh. 12 microns @ 99% efficiency. I guess whatever it had been I'd still be happy with the result after cutting it open. Do you know what the absolute/beta rating is for the Ryco Z332?

[PeeBee]

Whats the Fleetguard filter number your using Phil?

Mark, no idea, on site still so cant check

[mudski]

I looked everywhere to find the absolute rating for the Delphi HDF296 but failed until I came back to this thread & realised you had already posted it earlier. Doh. 12 microns @ 99% efficiency. I guess whatever it had been I'd still be happy with the result after cutting it open. Do you know what the absolute/beta rating is for the Ryco Z332?

Not sure Ian sorry. We dont sell Ryco so I have very little to do with them. Even after a quick look I couldn't even find what micron it is on their website.

[mudski]

Mark, no idea, on site still so cant check

No probs, just curious. The popular spin on ones we sell would be a FS1251 or a FF5018, maybe an FF105.

[ChadGU]

No probs, just curious. The popular spin on ones we sell would be a FS1251 or a FF5018, maybe an FF105.

mudski these filters you mentioned are suitable for a CRD?

[Cuppa]

dont sell Ryco so I have very little to do with them. Even after a quick look I couldn't even find what micron it is on their website.

Yep that's what I found too.
Have since had a look at the Donaldson site & found they list the full specs for their filters, that sort of transparency has to be a good thing. They may or may not be any better than Ryco but at least you know what you are getting. I think I'll switch to Donaldson after I've used my current spare filters instead of the Rycos. Seeing the pics in their X902759 filter kit for my car it reminded me that I had had one of their air filters once before & liked the 'robustness' of the additional metal cage around the filter paper, especially when having to knock accumulated sand out of the filter on the bullbar :) .

Quite a variety of delivered online prices for that kit from $89 to $147.60 which pretty much mirrors online Ryco prices.

Looks like the Donaldson Delphi HDF 296 equivalent (P557111) is also 12micron @ 98%.

[mudski]

mudski these filters you mentioned are suitable for a CRD?

I wouldn't use these on a CRD...

This would be a good choice...
http://www.donaldson4wd.com.au/products/p902976/

[mudski]

Yep that's what I found too.
Have since had a look at the Donaldson site & found they list the full specs for their filters, that sort of transparency has to be a good thing. They may or may not be any better than Ryco but at least you know what you are getting. I think I'll switch to Donaldson after I've used my current spare filters instead of the Rycos. Seeing the pics in their X902759 filter kit for my car it reminded me that I had had one of their air filters once before & liked the 'robustness' of the additional metal cage around the filter paper, especially when having to knock accumulated sand out of the filter on the bullbar :) .

Quite a variety of delivered online prices for that kit from $89 to $147.60 which pretty much mirrors online Ryco prices.

Looks like the Donaldson Delphi HDF 296 equivalent (P557111) is also 12micron @ 98%.

The air filters in those Donaldson kits are good. They use their Blue range.
https://www.donaldson.com/content/dam/donaldson/engine-hydraulics-bulk/literature/north-america/air/f111431-eng/Donaldson-Blue-Air-Filters-for-Fleetguard-Direct-Flow-Air-Cleaners.pdf

[First Pooy]

I brought my Td42 with the CAV on it I didn't realize that it wasn't OEM part until I ordered a new filter and ended up with a genuine spin on, I haven't had the time to have a closer look at the filter all I know that it is a ryco and I don't want to run to much fuel through it until I change it,at the moment I probably do %60 on road %40 off road but hoping to do more of road

[mudski]

I brought my Td42 with the CAV on it I didn't realize that it wasn't OEM part until I ordered a new filter and ended up with a genuine spin on, I haven't had the time to have a closer look at the filter all I know that it is a ryco and I don't want to run to much fuel through it until I change it,at the moment I probably do %60 on road %40 off road but hoping to do more of road

Perfect filtration for the TD mate. Its a proven setup and has been for maybe 40 or so years.