Exhaust, Gauges, Dyno, Dawse, Needles & Intercoolers

[10G]

OK, firstly thanks to mudski for the help he's given me so far.

I'm still learning this all as I go, so I may have some strange sounding questions!

So I want to fit a larger exhaust to my 2013 3L CRD Patrol with 78,000ks on it.

If I find my OEM intercooler is leaking, is it worth repairing or should I replace it? Are they easy to fix? Should just about any radiator place be able to fix them?

Setting a Dawse valve. From what I understand, the Dawse valve relieves pressure when that pressure reaches a certain point. How do I know what that point is? I've been told fitting a Daws valve isn't hard, but I have no idea how to adjust it or what to adjust it to???

Needle valves. I've read that they can be used to alter the speed the turbo spools up at (not sure how, haven't looked it up yet). As I don't fully understand it's function yet, can I do any damage if I alter the needle valve setting? I understand it's there so you can get better response or economy from your motor, but is there any chance if I set it for one thing, let's say driving at 100kmh on flat roads for hours and then go belting up & down slippery muddy tracks, could I do any damage? I'm thinking about EGTs here.

Gauges. Does anyone know of a small combined boost & EGT gauge that would fit on the bottom in between the taco & the speedo. I can't use a pillar pod as I have my mobile phone dock there.

The input to the gauges, the stuff that makes the needle go up & down, is it air, fluid, oil etc or electrical? I'm wondering what will pass through the firewall and how large a hole I'll need.

Dyno tuning. Is it worthwhile if you don't have a chip? Will my Dawse be set as well as it can be if I get a dyno???

Exhaust. 2.75" or 3"? I've read that all that is needed is the 2.75", but there are many more options (and prices) in the 3" world.

EGTs. What is too low and what is too high? Does adjusting the needle valve have any effect on EGTs? How do I stay safe?

I'm after a reliable efficient vehicle that will last me for many years, I'm no mechanic so I need things to be robust. if there's any advice or info on what else I should or shouldn't do I'd greatly appreciate hearing about it.

Thanks for any help you can offer.

[mudski]

OK, firstly thanks to mudski for the help he's given me so far.

I'm still learning this all as I go, so I may have some strange sounding questions!

So I want to fit a larger exhaust to my 2013 3L CRD Patrol with 78,000ks on it.

If I find my OEM intercooler is leaking, is it worth repairing or should I replace it? Are they easy to fix? Should just about any radiator place be able to fix them?

Setting a Dawse valve. From what I understand, the Dawse valve relieves pressure when that pressure reaches a certain point. How do I know what that point is? I've been told fitting a Daws valve isn't hard, but I have no idea how to adjust it or what to adjust it to???
Basically the Dawes has a ball and a spring inside the valve. The spring keeps the pressure on the ball. The more pressure put on the ball, the higher the boost level.
Needle valves. I've read that they can be used to alter the speed the turbo spools up at Yes(not sure how, haven't looked it up yet). As I don't fully understand it's function yet, can I do any damage if I alter the needle valve setting? NoI understand it's there so you can get better response or economy from your motor, but is there any chance if I set it for one thing, let's say driving at 100kmh on flat roads for hours and then go belting up & down slippery muddy tracks, could I do any damage? NoI'm thinking about EGTs here.No, again

Gauges. Does anyone know of a small combined boost & EGT gauge that would fit on the bottom in between the taco & the speedo. I can't use a pillar pod as I have my mobile phone dock there.
McNally Electronics is what I used. And in the spot you want....
70853
The input to the gauges, the stuff that makes the needle go up & down, is it air, fluid, oil etc or electrical? I'm wondering what will pass through the firewall and how large a hole I'll need.
Depending on what gauge you get. The McNally uses an electronic sensor on the motor to pickup boost pressure. Some gauges use tubing and pass the boost pressure though to the gauge via the tubing. Then you have wires that you need to run into the cab to the gauge.
You need to fabricate a reference point for boost pickup too. Usually via one of the steel intercooler pipes.
Dyno tuning. Is it worthwhile if you don't have a chip? Yes, and no. Depending on how good you tune the valves via a road tune.Will my Dawse be set as well as it can be if I get a dyno??? Depending on who is doing the dyno. As I said via our pm, theres many mechanics that still dont understand the simplicity of the Dawes and the needle valve.

Exhaust. 2.75" or 3"? I've read that all that is needed is the 2.75", but there are many more options (and prices) in the 3" world.
I'll stay out of this one...
EGTs. What is too low and what is too high? Dunno about low, but anything around and over 500c in my opinion is dangerous territory. Does adjusting the needle valve have any effect on EGTs?Yes, have the spool up too slow, your egt will climb fast as theres not enough boost pressure and too much fuel (running rich) How do I stay safe? Tune it right. Theres a sweet spot when you tune the valves up. You will know it when you hit that spot.

I'm after a reliable efficient vehicle that will last me for many years, I'm no mechanic so I need things to be robust. if there's any advice or info on what else I should or shouldn't do I'd greatly appreciate hearing about it.
If its tuned right it will be reliable.

Thanks for any help you can offer.
..............................

[rainsey]

Holy crap .. my head is spinning with this one ...but let me respond to one of the 100 questions asked ..

The intercooler. Yes ditch the standard Nissan crimped intercooler. Crimped, crap, it is synonymous.

There are a multitude of OEM replacements, HPD, Cross Country, ARE ... the original ones Leak like a sieve and from my opinion are not worth trying to repair.If you want to try another I will happily give you my original unit but it also leaks.

I've lost a bit of the other questions but re gauges, try the Aurtron / Redarc as they may have one to suit.

I have the original Aurtron in my vehicle but since Redarc have taken them over there are slightly less ( actually a lot less ) options.




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[10G]

Thanks for the help guys, I'm beginning to make a game plan for this work and am sure I'll end up with a great setup.

I'm guessing the 2.75" Vs 3.0" question is like the "what's better mud tyres or All Terrains" in that case, I think I may go 3" then.

Thanks again.

[mudski]

Best to speak to the professionals about the exhaust size.

[Turtle_au]

The first question is do you have a good quality oil catch can fitted. Oil film in the intake is the root of all evils.

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[threedogs]

a 2.75" will work better with the CRD than a 3" system from what Ive read here.
replace the OE intercooler with a tigged and tested IC, that will cost about $3-400,
tigged ones are about 30% bigger as well.
Autron do a dual gauge same as Redarc

[10G]

Thanks for the help and info guys.

Yes I have a Provent 200 and it's working very well, just bought a 2nd filter for it in fact. Also blocked the EGR.

3-400 for a new IC, that's doable, I thought I was up for 1000-1500 for a new IC which isn't really do able.

Thanks again.

[threedogs]

I cant justify that kind of money for what you get.
Having a CRD a Scan Gauge should be high on your to buy list

[rusty00]

Thanks for the help guys, I'm beginning to make a game plan for this work and am sure I'll end up with a great setup.

I'm guessing the 2.75" Vs 3.0" question is like the "what's better mud tyres or All Terrains" in that case, I think I may go 3" then.

Thanks again.

I went with the Beaudesert exhaust, only because of what I read about them over others.
Installing this weekend so hope to comment on any changes.
Price was fair ($1,255.00 delivered from QLD to VIC) and would rather spend a bit more than a cheap one for peace of mind.

[threedogs]

Thanks for the help and info guys.

Yes I have a Provent 200 and it's working very well, just bought a 2nd filter for it in fact. Also blocked the EGR.

3-400 for a new IC, that's doable, I thought I was up for 1000-1500 for a new IC which isn't really do able.

Thanks again.

As for passing wires through the firewall there are 2 large rubber gromment on each side
tape any wire to a coat hanger[straightened out] and away you go

As for your boost buy one of these mudski this is a great price,,,neat even if you run a temporary
boost gauge to set things up. .Mark you may want to buy some at this price
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Nissan-Patrol-Navara-ZD30-DI-CRD-Boost-Gauge-Port-Adapter-Only-Sale-/331988022385?hash=item4d4c073471:g:4m4AAOSw5cNYLPm R

[mudski]

As for passing wires through the firewall there are 2 large rubber gromment on each side
tape any wire to a coat hanger[straightened out] and away you go

As for your boost buy one of these mudski this is a great price,,,neat even if you run a temporary
boost gauge to set things up. .Mark you may want to buy some at this price
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Nissan-Patrol-Navara-ZD30-DI-CRD-Boost-Gauge-Port-Adapter-Only-Sale-/331988022385?hash=item4d4c073471:g:4m4AAOSw5cNYLPm R

Yeah nup. No point buying them at that price, then adding my bit of top, plus your freight. I wouldn't sell them.

[10G]

Yeah I've seen those, I'll probably go that way.

It seems you have to raise the plastic cover around the IC when fitting these. Does anyone know if that causes any issues when you close the bonnet???

[10G]

So those Autron/Redarc or McNally gauges pass electrical cable through the firewall and not hoses with air or fluids??

[mudski]

Yeah I've seen those, I'll probably go that way.

It seems you have to raise the plastic cover around the IC when fitting these. Does anyone know if that causes any issues when you close the bonnet???
Throw that useless plastic cover away....

So those Autron/Redarc or McNally gauges pass electrical cable through the firewall and not hoses with air or fluids??

Yes sir. All electrical. As per pic I run the McNally dual boost/egt gauge between the speedo and Tacho. Then i have a dual pillar pod with a Redarc dual battery gauge and a water temp/ oil pressure gauge in it. Both gauges are good. But my pic for the boost and EGT is the McNally. Due to its pure simplicity. Theres a lot to look at when glancing at a Redarc gauge. In my opinion you want to quickly glimpse over the gauge, the McNally suits this perfectly.

[10G]

Throw that useless plastic cover away....


But it looks nice. I looked at my motor the other day to make sure it was still there and I could see where the foam around the bonnet scoop contacted nicely around the top of the IC. I though that was good.

I spotted a nice looking dual SAAS gauge. Back in the day SAAS stuff was pretty good quality, don't know if it still is??? - http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/SAAS-2in1-Diesel-Turbo-Boost-and-Exhaust-Temp-52mm-Gauge-EGT-Pyro-Set-Warning-/322343456938

[mudski]

But it looks nice. I looked at my motor the other day to make sure it was still there and I could see where the foam around the bonnet scoop contacted nicely around the top of the IC. I though that was good.

I spotted a nice looking dual SAAS gauge. Back in the day SAAS stuff was pretty good quality, don't know if it still is??? - http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/SAAS-2in1-Diesel-Turbo-Boost-and-Exhaust-Temp-52mm-Gauge-EGT-Pyro-Set-Warning-/322343456938

Each to their own. That cover was the first "mod" I did to my Patrol when I got it home.... SAAS are not that great these days too.

[rainsey]

So those Autron/Redarc or McNally gauges pass electrical cable through the firewall and not hoses with air or fluids??

Correct.

Also just an out there thing, some one indicated that the ingress for cabling through the firewall is via two large rubber grommets either side of the firewall. Continuous playing, prodding can really screw up the rubber. What I have done and touch wood has worked a treat is to make a slightly larger hole through the passengers side grommet an feed through it a length of 20 or 25mm conduit. I have put a pull wire through it and any time I need to pass cabling through Ai have a clean free path through.

Another thing to do if you think you might be adding a few switches like driving lights, compressors, yadda yadda. Use some trailer 7 wire cable and feed this through the aforementioned pipe. Terminate it at both ends on terminal block. You then have at least 7 wires that are already passed through in a manageable form that You can effectively patch at either end. No need for running one cable, then another , then another ...


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[threedogs]

But it looks nice. I looked at my motor the other day to make sure it was still there and I could see where the foam around the bonnet scoop contacted nicely around the top of the IC. I though that was good.

I spotted a nice looking dual SAAS gauge. Back in the day SAAS stuff was pretty good quality, don't know if it still is??? - http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/SAAS-2in1-Diesel-Turbo-Boost-and-Exhaust-Temp-52mm-Gauge-EGT-Pyro-Set-Warning-/322343456938

I took my engine cover off made no difference to the way things work.
If youre concerned the engine cover will touch you can use a power file to remove a bit to clear where it touches

[10G]

[QUOTE=rainsey;714419Another thing to do if you think you might be adding a few switches like driving lights, compressors, yadda yadda. Use some trailer 7 wire cable and feed this through the aforementioned pipe. Terminate it at both ends on terminal block. You then have at least 7 wires that are already passed through in a manageable form that You can effectively patch at either end. No need for running one cable, then another , then another ...


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD[/QUOTE]

That's a bloody great idea, I wish I had thought of that myself, thanks.

So onto exhausts!!

I think I'll go with 3", There are lots of 3" kits around and they are about half the price of a 2.75" kit.

I'm no mechanic and I could be 100% incorrect here, but this is my understanding ...

I've read that the 2.75" gives better back pressure. When I was young & into drag racing, I read that back pressure is good because it helps suck out the exhaust from the combustion chamber when the exhaust valve opens. Back pressure is enhanced and/or created by the design & size of the header pipe and the back pressure does it's thing because the header is bolted directly to the manifold.

But when you have a turbo, I can't see how back pressure can be affected by any size exhaust as the exhaust is connected after the turbo.

That's my understanding of things anyway.

The other thing I've read is that the 3" exhaust causes problems with overboosting, that a 2.75" system doesn't. Fitting a Dawse valve or similar would get rid of that problem. Even if you had a 2.75" system wouldn't you fit a Dawse valve as a security measure anyway?

So with that in mind, I think I'll go with a 3" system top to bottom, no muffler, not even sure about a Cat. Only thing about no Cat is, if Vicroads (I live in Vic) etc pull you over randomly, all they have to do is hang one of those guages on the end of your pipe and if the results grab their attention, they'll look underneath and Bingo, you're gone. Big fine I think.

Who are some reputable exhaust places???

Interested to hear from those with more knowledge than me on all this.

Thanks.

[BigRAWesty]

Hey 10G.
So just my input..
I can't see any issue with the cheap exhaust.
I bought a $550 playtime exhaust and as far as I could see it was built and welded as well as I've ever seen on an exhaust.

But.
There is an order or you may have issues..

So gauges first..
Imo a scangauge is a good investment.
I've also thrown in a boost, egt and oil pressure in a pillar pod..
But how far you go is up to you..

You need gauges for the mechanical boost control..

Very easy to setup. Set the dawes valve for max boost and then set the needle valve to suit your needs..
Ive taken my needle out for a try.
Its going pretty good..

Youll need mechanical boost control for exhaust and egr block if you fit it..
Id personally still fit the boost control even if you keep the stock exhaust.. the stock ecu is shit lol..

[10G]

Gday Kallen,

I've got a poor mans scanguage, it shows me stuff and I can clear errors with it. I also have the Torque app on my phone.

I'll be fitting a Dawse & EGT guage.

Re the exhaust, yeah. I was just sitting around this afternoon and was thinking about all that. I just need a mild steel or whatever it is exhaust, I certainly don't need stainless, mandrel bends would be nice, but I'm a bit in doubt as to how much of a benefit they are in the case of a 4x4. When you say mechanical boost control, do you mean the dawse??

[BigRAWesty]

Gday Kallen,

I've got a poor mans scanguage, it shows me stuff and I can clear errors with it. I also have the Torque app on my phone.

I'll be fitting a Dawse & EGT guage.

Re the exhaust, yeah. I was just sitting around this afternoon and was thinking about all that. I just need a mild steel or whatever it is exhaust, I certainly don't need stainless, mandrel bends would be nice, but I'm a bit in doubt as to how much of a benefit they are in the case of a 4x4. When you say mechanical boost control, do you mean the dawse??
Youll struggle to find an aftermarket exhaust these days that isn't mandrel bent, it's like a minimum standard now..

And yea boost control is your dawes valve..

[rainsey]

Sorry, got a scotch or two under my belt so if there is any incoherency in my reply you know in advance.

A few people have recommended the scanguage. In my ZD30 days I installed one and to be quite honest, it was the thing that I was toggling between if I stuck with the ZD30 or migrated ( see guys did not say upgrade) to the 6.5.

I absolutely loved it and would highly recommend from a monitoring perspective this is the first thing to do. Albeit a Scanguage (R) or a compatible alternative.

Now I have migrated to the 6.5. I still use my scanguage as my speedo, volt meter, Tacho and more important water temp gauge.

Kindest regards
Rainsey


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[10G]

So I just went for a 45 minute drive using the Torque app on my phone to monitor the Boost levels.

On the flat with the cruise control on doing 100 it was anywhere between 13-14. Going up rises it dropped to 10-12 and going down rises down to 6 or less.

I saw it peak at 16.2 but the highest it regularly got was in the low 15s.

I'm realising I don't understand as much as I thought I did. Wouldn't the boost go up when you went up a rise and not drop? And the readings are all over the place, the spike at 16 was going around a bend with a very slight rise at 100.

[mudski]

So I just went for a 45 minute drive using the Torque app on my phone to monitor the Boost levels.

On the flat with the cruise control on doing 100 it was anywhere between 13-14. Going up rises it dropped to 10-12 and going down rises down to 6 or less.

I saw it peak at 16.2 but the highest it regularly got was in the low 15s.

I'm realising I don't understand as much as I thought I did. Wouldn't the boost go up when you went up a rise and not drop? And the readings are all over the place, the spike at 16 was going around a bend with a very slight rise at 100.
Yeah that all sounds normal. Remember high boost is not the issue. Low boost is. If you had an egt gauge in you would see what i mean. When the low boost happens, your egts would be really high. In my opinion, with this motor you would notice no difference between mandrel bent or not. Its not a race car. As Kallen said too regarding the exhaust. A cheaper pipe will be fine. The cat is the important part though. A quality high flow cat is a must in my opinion. A muffler isnt needed for this motor. But is for legality reasons. Even if the sound output is under the limit, a muffler must still be present.

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[BigRAWesty]

As I said 10G the stock ecu control of the boost is shit to put it nicely..
But it's normal to drop boost down hills. Remember about the load on engine producing more boost than an unloaded engine.

But you've got some good data.
Once your dawes is in mate aim for that 16psi.
And your similar to mine on the cruzing levels to.
Mine sat on 14-15psi cruzing at 100kmh.

[10G]

Went for another 45 min drive with the Android boost gauge on the phone.

I've been learning a few things which are new to me. The more revs I do the more boost I get, (I know that's not rocket science but I've never had a boost gauge before). This isn't really what we want off road. How we can we create more boost at lower revs?

I reckon I understand what the Dawse valve does now, when the boost pressure reaches a certain point that pressure opens the Dawse valve which in turn opens the turbo actuator waste gate which in turn slows the turbo down. But I still don't understand what the needle valve does?

Another question, when I look at my boost gauge and it goes from 11 - 13 - 9 - 13 - 8 - 13 - 6 - 13 etc etc when I'm driving at a constant speed on a flat road, is it the ECU that is making the boost readings jump around crazy like that?

Another question. Does the Dawse valve setup take the control of the wastegate away from the ECU? If so, is there anything that needs to be done to the ECU after the Dawse valve is put in place, anything need to be plugged up, taped over, disconnected?

Sorry if the questions seem a little simple minded, but I'm finding all this fascinating.

One more thing. I think I read that one side of needle valve just sucks in clean air to go and do with whatever the needle valve does. Would this mean that if the needle valve was mounted in the cabin, you could get away with only 1 hose coming into the cabin and the hose, or the other side of the needle valve, just open sucking in air from the cabin??

Thanks for any help.

[mudski]

Went for another 45 min drive with the Android boost gauge on the phone.

I've been learning a few things which are new to me. The more revs I do the more boost I get, (I know that's not rocket science but I've never had a boost gauge before). This isn't really what we want off road. How we can we create more boost at lower revs? This is where the needle valve works. This is used to soley adjust your boost spool up.

I reckon I understand what the Dawse valve does now, when the boost pressure reaches a certain point that pressure opens the Dawse valve which in turn opens the turbo actuator waste gate which in turn slows the turbo down. Yes........But I still don't understand what the needle valve does? See above......

Another question, when I look at my boost gauge and it goes from 11 - 13 - 9 - 13 - 8 - 13 - 6 - 13 etc etc when I'm driving at a constant speed on a flat road, is it the ECU that is making the boost readings jump around crazy like that? Yes it is. Hence the reason for using manual boost controllers....

Another question. Does the Dawse valve setup take the control of the wastegate away from the ECU? YES..... If so, is there anything that needs to be done to the ECU after the Dawse valve is put in place, anything need to be plugged up, taped over, disconnected? No. Only plug off the three unused vacuum ports on the now defunked vacuum boost controller next to the air box.

Sorry if the questions seem a little simple minded, but I'm finding all this fascinating.

One more thing. I think I read that one side of needle valve just sucks in clean air to go and do with whatever the needle valve does. Would this mean that if the needle valve was mounted in the cabin, you could get away with only 1 hose coming into the cabin and the hose, or the other side of the needle valve, just open sucking in air from the cabin??


Hmm not sure what you mean here, but some people mount the needle valve in the cab. Not a good idea. all you will find yourself doing is constantly playing with the needle valve and screwing up the settings. This is a set and forget setup. Unless you are talking about the hose for the boost gauge. If that is the case, no. The needle valve requires a non positive air pressure to work.

Thanks for any help.
So in a nut shell.
The Dawes function is to cap or limit the max boost pressures. The needle valve is there to control how fast the turbo will spin or spool up to your max boost level.

[10G]

Thanks for all your help Mark I'm looking forward to getting this all setup an working.

[10G]

So it's exhaust time!

I'm settled on a 3" exhaust and am happy with that decision.

My question is .... will the exhaust drone at highway speed if I don't include a muffler? I'd like to not fit a muffler unless the feedback I get tells me that it's too noisey in the cabin. I'm not fussed what it sounds like outside.

Thanks.

[mudski]

It will be louder than with a muffler and will drone, but only a little. These motors aren't noisy. So no muffler is fine but even if the sound output is under the regulation limit, with no muffler its not road worthy. Not much of a big deal but i thought to say this so you know, if you didn't. If you want a muffler, just get a hot dog so it pretty much does stuff all but its there and legal.

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[BigRAWesty]

Which kit you leaning towards matt?

As you heard mine, the cat and muffler isn't loud, but its a nice deep note.
No drone.
If you keen to try no muffler I'd say give it a go.
If your not happy $200 will see you with a replacement section on a muffler installed by an exhaust shop..

[mudski]

Which kit you leaning towards matt?

As you heard mine, the cat and muffler isn't loud, but its a nice deep note.
No drone.
If you keen to try no muffler I'd say give it a go.
If your not happy $200 will see you with a replacement section on a muffler installed by an exhaust shop..
Actually the mob i got my current system from, manumatic i think it's called(they make the Redback systems) sell the rear section in three variants. Muffler, hotdog or no muffler. It was about $100 for the rear section to buy. This mob is in Epping and you can buy direct from the factory there.

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[10G]

I really didn't know it was illegal to have no muffler, thanks for letting me know Mark.

I'm not sure what kit I'll end up with, maybe DEA or Playtime. Yeah, yours is no noisier than stock Kallen, it just sounded more open, but no noisier. Do these mufflers restrict much?

And which is the less restrictive cat the 100 or 200.


And another thing. Under intercooler fans. Very easy job, hardest part will be finding a good quality fan coz they'll cop lots of heat and a good drenching when water comes in through the IC scoop on the bonnet.

[BigRAWesty]

Actually the mob i got my current system from, manumatic i think it's called(they make the Redback systems) sell the rear section in three variants. Muffler, hotdog or no muffler. It was about $100 for the rear section to buy. This mob is in Epping and you can buy direct from the factory there.

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Yea playtime do the same.
Can do basically the same, muffler, hot dog or straight threw..
I have the muffler so enquired about the straight threw and it's $90 delivered..
Obviously a section with muffler will be more..

[mudski]

I really didn't know it was illegal to have no muffler, thanks for letting me know Mark.

I'm not sure what kit I'll end up with, maybe DEA or Playtime. Yeah, yours is no noisier than stock Kallen, it just sounded more open, but no noisier. Do these mufflers restrict much?

And which is the less restrictive cat the 100 or 200.


And another thing. Under intercooler fans. Very easy job, hardest part will be finding a good quality fan coz they'll cop lots of heat and a good drenching when water comes in through the IC scoop on the bonnet.
When i had my Di and went from a muffler to no muffler i did notice an increase in mid range power. So it works...
I wouldn't bother with the ic fan personally. Not a lot of gain, if any, for the cost and time to fit one in. Get a better scoop for the bonnet. That will work much better.

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[10G]

Get a better scoop for the bonnet. That will work much better. Sent from my GT-N7105T using Tapatalk

Interesting you said that Mark. Yesterday I pulled up at lunch time. Had been driving at 100km/h for 20 or so minutes and checked the intercooler. The tanks were considerably warmer than the centre finned section which made me think that a fan may not be of as much use as I was thinking because the tanks were so much hotter than the centre section. My thinking is the entire IC needs to be cooler to make any considerable difference.

So yes, I reckon you're right about a better bonnet scoop.

[mudski]

Yeah theres a mob called A.R.E who make a taller scoop. Which is a factory fit. But they are expensive. I think I paid $550 for it about 4 years ago. When I did the conversion I changed intercoolers so a larger scoop was needed. I sold my A.R.E scoop for $300 and bought a Fairline Fibreglass scoop new and delivered for $365. But the bonnets needs a bit of trimming to make this one fit. There is plenty of other options around now for scoops, you just gotta find them....
A.R.E Scoop70947
Fairline Fibreglass scoop70948

[BigRAWesty]

Cat cpi is a very open topic lol.
If simply the cpi changes then a 100cpi will flow better than a 200cpi.

But take my Scott's rods cat.
Its 200cpi in a 4" body.
So although I have more cores per inch than the stock playtime cat it flows the same if not better.
The Scott's rods cat is also completely stainless where as the playtime one is ceramic core when I investigated.

[threedogs]

you need to run a CAT you wouldnt notice the difference it would be minimum.
There are many high flow CATs on the markets, I had a 3" done first and did the
high flow CAT later , didnt notice any difference, with a fine of say $200k I would
run a Cat

[mudski]

Cat cpi is a very open topic lol.
If simply the cpi changes then a 100cpi will flow better than a 200cpi.

But take my Scott's rods cat.
Its 200cpi in a 4" body.
So although I have more cores per inch than the stock playtime cat it flows the same if not better.
The Scott's rods cat is also completely stainless where as the playtime one is ceramic core when I investigated.

Yeah I was told by an exhaust shop that a metallic core is better than a ceramic core too. Cant remember the reason behind it though.

[BigRAWesty]

Yeah I was told by an exhaust shop that a metallic core is better than a ceramic core too. Cant remember the reason behind it though.
Its a smoother profile.
The course surface of ceramic makes friction and turbulence.
Not great for efficiency.

[10G]

Rang a couple of exhaust places this morning. One quoted about $1K, the other $1500. More than I was hoping to pay, but by the time I get an eBay zorst, pay for that & freight and get it fitted I'll be near $1K anyway.

The $1500 was a complete end to end custom build, going around everything that's in the way, using (something that I'm still not 100% sure what it is) heavier flex bellows (??) so the zorst has better support, flow through muffler etc. Not stainless, alumised steel. I'm past all this under car work type work now, and the appeal of paying more for a walk in walk out thing is inviting. And if it falls to pieces I can take it back say "fix this". My stock 2" zorst is already rubbing on my oversize rear shocks, a custom build wouldn't.

Hmmm.

I gotta get some guages soon.

I'm almost at that point when you say bugger it and just take the plunge.

Thank you all very much for your help & advice, it's greatly appreciated.

[mudski]

Rang a couple of exhaust places this morning. One quoted about $1K, the other $1500. More than I was hoping to pay, but by the time I get an eBay zorst, pay for that & freight and get it fitted I'll be near $1K anyway.

The $1500 was a complete end to end custom build, going around everything that's in the way, using (something that I'm still not 100% sure what it is) heavier flex bellows (??) so the zorst has better support, flow through muffler etc. Not stainless, alumised steel. I'm past all this under car work type work now, and the appeal of paying more for a walk in walk out thing is inviting. And if it falls to pieces I can take it back say "fix this". My stock 2" zorst is already rubbing on my oversize rear shocks, a custom build wouldn't.

Hmmm.

I gotta get some guages soon.

I'm almost at that point when you say bugger it and just take the plunge.

Thank you all very much for your help & advice, it's greatly appreciated.

Ring Manumatic exhausts. They are the makers of Redback and do sell direct. They make two ranges, one they call their Dinkum Exhaust and the other, erm not sure, Extreme I think, but its the best of the best in terms of cats, mufflers and flange setups.

Kinda off topic. It would be real interesting to do a dyno run on two identical zorsts, but one using mandrel bends and one not. I would safely bet there is f.a difference when fitted to a Patrol.

[threedogs]

Have you decided where and what style gauges you will use ,if you
go the pillar pod route I may be able to help a bit.

[10G]

Have you decided where and what style gauges you will use ,if you
go the pillar pod route I may be able to help a bit.

No I haven't yet. I have a mobile phone holder/coupler where the pillar pod goes. I may go with a single combined round gauge or 2 rectangular digital gauges, not too sure.

[10G]

Ring Manumatic exhausts. They are the makers of Redback and do sell direct.

I checked out the Extreme online. With muffler & cat, around $1250.

[threedogs]

If you want another idea you can use a tripple pod on top of the dash,
I have water temp ,,,volt and clock the first 2 are red digital its just
velcroed onto the dash pad

[10G]

think I may settle on a dual egt/boost gauge by redarc. couldn't find any autometer gauges, nor mcnally gauges. I sent McNally a message to see if they have any distributors down here and also shipping costs from the US.

[BigRAWesty]

think I may settle on a dual egt/boost gauge by redarc. couldn't find any autometer gauges, nor mcnally gauges. I sent McNally a message to see if they have any distributors down here and also shipping costs from the US.
I nearly bought the tripple with oil pressure..

Also fit exhaust yourself.
Or I'll help.
Hand mine out and in in a matter of 3-4 hours..
My playtime kit was $650 delivered.

[10G]

Ir I'll help.
.

Do you realise what you said???? That's a very kind offer Kallen. I'll be in touch.

[mudski]

You can buy direct from Mcnally. The price of their gauge worked out close to the price of two separate gauges and a pillar pod. And around the same as a Redarc. Which in my opinion theres too much to look at on the Redarc. Plus from what i saw, the Redarc boost gauge is a digital readout. Much easier to quickly read a needle jumping around imo.

Sent from my GT-N7105T using Tapatalk

[threedogs]

10G these dual and tripple gauges going around just to save space,
I think like Mark there is too much going on in a small space, I like
my red digital easy to read on a sunny day, and both the volt and water
temp have alarms. I love em,,,lol
I wouldnt buy a digital boost dont know why, just think being able to see
the needle move makes it easier to set your spool up rate

[mudski]

10G these dual and tripple gauges going around just to save space,
I think like Mark there is too much going on in a small space, I like
my red digital easy to read on a sunny day, and both the volt and water
temp have alarms. I love em,,,lol
I wouldnt but a digital boost dont know why, just think being able to see
the needle move makes it easier to set your spool up rate

Right on the money there John. Sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo much easier. A digital boost gauge makes it hard to spot boost bounce too. Not that its an actual issue, but some think it is. Another story....

[BigRAWesty]

I too agree, I like a needle, the redarc is pretty smooth though

[10G]

Yeah I agree. I'm stuffed for space though. I see I can buy the McNally gauges on Amazon in the States now so that may be a goer.

Your idea with the velcro has got me thinking about mounting things with velcro, cable ties etc TD, it just has to stay still and not rattle. I was thinking of some way mounting 2 guages on the steering wheel shroud (inbetween the sterring wheel and dash) and having them attach via velcro so you can easily remove them when needed.

[mudski]

You can buy the McNally direct from them, without going through Amazon.

[10G]

Hey Mark did you buy a McNally holder for your gauge?? Oh and did you go for the 6' or 9' thermocouple lead??

[mudski]

Hey Mark did you buy a McNally holder for your gauge?? Oh and did you go for the 6' or 9' thermocouple lead??
Just bought a 52mm single gauge cup from the local speed shop.
And go for the longer lead. Also if you do decide on the McNally, remote mount the boost sensor. I killed two sensors from mounting them directly on the motor. So i remote mounted the sensor and ran a hose from the sensor to the motor.

Sent from my GT-N7105T using Tapatalk

[10G]

These tickle my fancy ...
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/AUTOMETER-COBALT-2-BOOST-EGT-PYRO-DIESEL-GAUGE-POD-KIT-4X4-4WD-AU6144-M-AU6104-/131260615412?hash=item1e8fbe0af4:g:9PAAAOSwbqpT34N 1

[mudski]

These tickle my fancy ...
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/AUTOMETER-COBALT-2-BOOST-EGT-PYRO-DIESEL-GAUGE-POD-KIT-4X4-4WD-AU6144-M-AU6104-/131260615412?hash=item1e8fbe0af4:g:9PAAAOSwbqpT34N 1

A bit of a waste having two gauges when you can spend less and get both in one.

[10G]

Yeah, I know. I've contacted them twice via their web site form, can't find an email address anywhere, and on Facebook. I can't get a cost for shipping from the US and don't like dealing/buying from companies overseas unless I've been able to contact them.

I have a trip coming up in 6 weeks and need all this work done b4 then, hence looking at other vendors. I actually like mechanical gauges, I like their simplicity. The search continues....

[mudski]

I'll see if i can find his email.

[10G]

Oh, yep, thanks Mark, that'd be great.

I cut up 2 cans today to be about the same size as 2 x 52mm guages, I may be able to fit the in front of the speedo & taco????

71008

71009

I can easily put my fingers inbetween the end of the cans and the speedo front fascia.

I dunno, they may fit?? Not sure about routing cables/hoses etc, don't know how crap that'll end up looking???

I saw 2 vids on Youtube today comparing mechanical Vs electrical boost gauges. The mechanical gauges seem much more responsive.

If I can't get a McNally I'm leaning towards 2 x VDO mechanical gauges.

[10G]

Also built this today, a cage for my 50L water bladder ...

71014

[mudski]

Oh, yep, thanks Mark, that'd be great.

I cut up 2 cans today to be about the same size as 2 x 52mm guages, I may be able to fit the in front of the speedo & taco????

71008

71009

I can easily put my fingers inbetween the end of the cans and the speedo front fascia.

I dunno, they may fit?? Not sure about routing cables/hoses etc, don't know how crap that'll end up looking???

I saw 2 vids on Youtube today comparing mechanical Vs electrical boost gauges. The mechanical gauges seem much more responsive.

If I can't get a McNally I'm leaning towards 2 x VDO mechanical gauges.
Yeah just one gauge is better between the speedo and tacho i think.
4x4 concepts is the mob who make the pillar pods i think.
I got a factory defect pod for half the price from them. Unfortunately i cant access my old laptop which has the email address of the guy in the states for the gauge. Everytime i turn it on it just freezes....

Sent from my GT-N7105T using Tapatalk

[10G]

Finally getting some stuff sorted out.

I'm getting one of these EGT gauges:

71025

And using the Boost guage on my phone via the Torque app for the time being. I may even end up buying an old Android phone and running Torque on that and wiring that in some how, not sure yet. Or I may just buy a Boost gauge.

Not sure which zorst to get, or I should say what configuration?

I'd like to not have a muffler, just because of the restriction is presents. Anyone know what hotdogs in these 3" systems sound like?? I'm starting to think I may just buy anything just so I get started.

[mudski]

Its a 3ltr so no muffler and it wont be loud. It will drone but only very little.

Sent from my GT-N7105T using Tapatalk

[10G]

Ordered the exhaust system last night, 3" with a resonator and hi flo cat. It's all coming together....

[BigRAWesty]

Ordered the exhaust system last night, 3" with a resonator and hi flo cat. It's all coming together....
Be interesting to see how your exhaust goes against mine for noise..

[10G]

Be interesting to see how your exhaust goes against mine for noise..

Yeah it will be. They've already shipped the zorst, those Playtime folks are pretty responsive, I'm impressed so far. Think my EGT gauge may arrive tomorrow, the plan is to fit that this weekend, the zorst may even arrive before the weekend, I'll be amazed if it does, but it may.

[BigRAWesty]

Yeah it will be. They've already shipped the zorst, those Playtime folks are pretty responsive, I'm impressed so far. Think my EGT gauge may arrive tomorrow, the plan is to fit that this weekend, the zorst may even arrive before the weekend, I'll be amazed if it does, but it may.
Mine was 4 days.
Was stocked lol

[threedogs]

Finally getting some stuff sorted out.

I'm getting one of these EGT gauges:

71025

And using the Boost guage on my phone via the Torque app for the time being. I may even end up buying an old Android phone and running Torque on that and wiring that in some how, not sure yet. Or I may just buy a Boost gauge.

Not sure which zorst to get, or I should say what configuration?

I'd like to not have a muffler, just because of the restriction is presents. Anyone know what hotdogs in these 3" systems sound like?? I'm starting to think I may just buy anything just so I get started.

Max temps you'll see are 650 tops you wont need a gauge that goes to 1200 c
Pm if you go pillar pod way.

[10G]

Yeah, I know, to be honest I got tired of looking. Alot of the EGT gauges don't give you much definition, EG some go up in increments of 2 degrees so to spot a minor difference is pretty hard. At least this one has a nice big digital display. It's a ridgey didge Autogauge. The supplier said they are supposed to be very accurate, we'll see ho we go I guess.

I PMd ya.

[10G]

Look what was waiting for me when I got home. 1 day in the post, buy on Tuesday, receive on Wednesday, that just doesn't happen down here ...

71032


Now with the 3" exhaust, is there anything I should do? What I mean is, I think I can remember reading that you can over boost or something, I can't remember exactly what the problem was, does anyone know?

[mudski]

Yeah you will more than likely see over boost issues. I'm not sure with the CRDs if you will get limp mode or not. But the CEL will probably come on too.

[10G]

Yeah you will more than likely see over boost issues. I'm not sure with the CRDs if you will get limp mode or not. But the CEL will probably come on too.

Will the over boosting cause any damage to anything??? And if limp mode kicks in, can that be cleared with scanguage or the Torque app??

[BigRAWesty]

Max temps you'll see are 650 tops you wont need a gauge that goes to 1200 c
Pm if you go pillar pod way.
The crd runs hotter.
I've seen 650 a few times..

[BigRAWesty]

Will the over boosting cause any damage to anything??? And if limp mode kicks in, can that be cleared with scanguage or the Torque app??
I only had free spooling issues when coasting.
The ecu held 15-16psi fine..
That was with the egr blocked.
A few don't have it blocked and have no issues. .

[mudski]

Will the over boosting cause any damage to anything??? And if limp mode kicks in, can that be cleared with scanguage or the Torque app??

Over boost wont damage anything, unless it gets over 30psi which it wont. Limp mode can be deactivated by simply lift the foot off the go pedal and back down again. The CEL will probably come on and will needed to be cleared using the scan gauge...

[10G]

Well the 3" exhaust went on yesterday, went for a 30 - 40 minute drive on the way home.

I got a resonator in place of a muffler and 200CPI cat. First impressions, maybe the most noticeable difference is an increase in cabin noise. I wouldn't call it annoying, it's like having mud tyres on, it's a noise that can be tolerated, but it is noisier than the stock exhaust. I reckon I got it right, I wanted as little restriction in the exhaust flow as possible with as little increase in noise as possible, so I'm happy with how that has turned out. Actually it was a bit windy yesterday, so some of that noise may have been wind through my roof rack.

Next would be throttle responsiveness. It is more responsive to the throttle and it seems to be more responsive to small throttle movements which is great as it helps with car control. I can also feel the motor exhaling more freely.

There's a little more of a rumble upon startup & shutdown which sounds nice. I can't notice any more turbo whistle which really doesn't bother me.

On boost levels, if anything I think they went down, the highest I saw was 13, didn't see a 15 which I regularly saw with the stock exhaust.

I didn't fit the exhaust my mechanic did and he said it bolted straight in no problems.

I reckon with what I've got versus what I paid it was a good purchase, I'm happy.

Now for the Dawse valve ......

[10G]

One gauge in, the EGT gauge.

71048

Looks good I reckon.

[mudski]

Only one issue mate. You cant see how fast you will be going after 170ks. Lol.

Sent from my GT-N7105T using Tapatalk

[gubigfish]

One gauge in, the EGT gauge.

71048

Looks good I reckon.

I did something similar with my EGT gauge except its a rectangular and flatter but wider.

[10G]

So the exhaust is fitted up and looking great. One thing though. The mechanic said he couldn't refit the heatshield as the probe for the EGT gauge is now in the way.

I stuck my hand down there after a 30 min drive and yep, it gets hot down there. What have others done here? There's that exhaust wrap stuff, I was thinking of wrapping that around the heater hoses as they are pretty close to the turbo. Does that stuff work backwards like that??

I was hoping to rig up some ducting from the front and point it at the area, but I'm not sure I'll be able to do that, there's not a lot of room.

[dermie72]

Great thread so far - I'm happy I seem to have gone down the right path. 3" exhaust, dp chip and scan gauge. Dual pillar VDO egt and boost gauges.
Boost was still all over the place though. Jumping to 20 psi, then dropping to 10 then building back up to 15-16 psi - all while maintaining the same speed on a flat.
Fitted one of mudski's dawes/needle kits over the weekend and it stopped the erratic boost issues I was experiencing. Car is much nicer to drive with a smooth boost curve.
I used the instructions in mudski's kit and had everything up and running in a couple hours - car sits nicely on about 15-16psi at full boost and on 10psi at 100k's.
EGT's stay around 200-250 around town and only hit 400 when I'm right up it and drop again pretty quick.
I had my exhaust fitted by Berrima diesel and I see they cut the original heat shield in half to fit in the new dump pipe - worked out ok 'cause I had to get the egt probe fitted at a later date.
Interested to hear if anyone has tried any additional heat shielding - I heard sometimes the heat under the bonnets of gu's sometimes kill the aux battery - so far so good though.

[mudski]

Great thread so far - I'm happy I seem to have gone down the right path. 3" exhaust, dp chip and scan gauge. Dual pillar VDO egt and boost gauges.
Boost was still all over the place though. Jumping to 20 psi, then dropping to 10 then building back up to 15-16 psi - all while maintaining the same speed on a flat.
Fitted one of mudski's dawes/needle kits over the weekend and it stopped the erratic boost issues I was experiencing. Car is much nicer to drive with a smooth boost curve.
I used the instructions in mudski's kit and had everything up and running in a couple hours - car sits nicely on about 15-16psi at full boost and on 10psi at 100k's.
EGT's stay around 200-250 around town and only hit 400 when I'm right up it and drop again pretty quick.
I had my exhaust fitted by Berrima diesel and I see they cut the original heat shield in half to fit in the new dump pipe - worked out ok 'cause I had to get the egt probe fitted at a later date.
Interested to hear if anyone has tried any additional heat shielding - I heard sometimes the heat under the bonnets of gu's sometimes kill the aux battery - so far so good though.

Its good to see my jibberish is understood by fellow Patrollers. Thanks.
Why did BD cut the heat shield though? Its not that hard to remove, and the shield still can be used on any aftermarket zorst. I would have been quite annoyed if they did that to my car.
As for additional heat shielding. The heater wrap stuff is pretty effective on the dump pipe. I use this on mine, works really well. You just need to wear gloves when wrapping it on. Otherwise you will have some itchy hands for a while.

[dermie72]

Yeah.....long hot story.... it was 38 degrees in Berrima that day- nearly cooked the missus
At the end of the day I didn't get charged for labour and was pretty happy with the attitude of the owner's young bloke - nice guys.
A good lesson in the need for clear communication when you're not talking directly to the mechanics doing the job.

[10G]

Is that heat wrap stuff fibreglassy??

First real drive with the 3" zorst today. Great change. It picks up more quickly, it responds more quickly, it pulls for longer and I think it is better on fuel, I think I've only driven about 160ks today so it's a bit hard to tell??

But I think I've done really well.

[mudski]

Is that heat wrap stuff fibreglassy??

First real drive with the 3" zorst today. Great change. It picks up more quickly, it responds more quickly, it pulls for longer and I think it is better on fuel, I think I've only driven about 160ks today so it's a bit hard to tell??

But I think I've done really well.

Yeah its got fibreglass fibres in it.

[NikoR]

Hi every one, i have been reading all the thread and im happy to see you having good results!!.
i know you already covered the EGT gauges topic, i fell in love with McNally but it goes over the budget i was contemplating
Hope you guys could tell me if this one i find on eBay will be relyable, i like what it says on the description.
Thank you for sharing your work

71083710847108371084

[NikoR]

Sorry for posting twice de images, i´m also goning to do some exhaust work as i like what i have read here :D
Since I finally found where to fix the turbo for my SD33T, and im planning to change its original position and move it a little to the top so i can do easier the piping for a FM IC. Any thoughts on this?

Cheers

[threedogs]

Is that heat wrap stuff fibreglassy??

First real drive with the 3" zorst today. Great change. It picks up more quickly, it responds more quickly, it pulls for longer and I think it is better on fuel, I think I've only driven about 160ks today so it's a bit hard to tell??

But I think I've done really well.

The best solution is to get the dump pipe ceramic coated , think thermal dynamic
this will keep the heat where it belongs inside the pipe.

[threedogs]

Great thread so far - I'm happy I seem to have gone down the right path. 3" exhaust, dp chip and scan gauge. Dual pillar VDO egt and boost gauges.
Boost was still all over the place though. Jumping to 20 psi, then dropping to 10 then building back up to 15-16 psi - all while maintaining the same speed on a flat.
Fitted one of mudski's dawes/needle kits over the weekend and it stopped the erratic boost issues I was experiencing. Car is much nicer to drive with a smooth boost curve.
I used the instructions in mudski's kit and had everything up and running in a couple hours - car sits nicely on about 15-16psi at full boost and on 10psi at 100k's.
EGT's stay around 200-250 around town and only hit 400 when I'm right up it and drop again pretty quick.
I had my exhaust fitted by Berrima diesel and I see they cut the original heat shield in half to fit in the new dump pipe - worked out ok 'cause I had to get the egt probe fitted at a later date.
Interested to hear if anyone has tried any additional heat shielding - I heard sometimes the heat under the bonnets of gu's sometimes kill the aux battery - so far so good though.

I have a turbo beanie fitted so now I have no problems of the AUX battery getting to hot

[mudski]

So the exhaust is fitted up and looking great. One thing though. The mechanic said he couldn't refit the heatshield as the probe for the EGT gauge is now in the way.

I stuck my hand down there after a 30 min drive and yep, it gets hot down there. What have others done here? There's that exhaust wrap stuff, I was thinking of wrapping that around the heater hoses as they are pretty close to the turbo. Does that stuff work backwards like that??

I was hoping to rig up some ducting from the front and point it at the area, but I'm not sure I'll be able to do that, there's not a lot of room.
Just cut a hole in the heat shield where the probe is. Simple.

Sent from my GT-N7105T using Tapatalk

[10G]

Just cut a hole in the heat shield where the probe is. Simple.

Sent from my GT-N7105T using Tapatalk

Yeah I know that's the best solution, but I'm lazy and I have to remove all them hoses and get my floor wet and my fingers dirty, then put it all back together again. Maybe I'll give it a go ;-)

[10G]

Got my boost gauge today and the dawse kit from mudski yesterday.

Got a peak boost of 17.6 yesterday taking off from a dead stop up a hill on the dirt. Boost is sitting on 10-12 at 100kmh, down from 13-13 pre zorst install.

[mudski]

Got my boost gauge today and the dawse kit from mudski yesterday.

Got a peak boost of 17.6 yesterday taking off from a dead stop up a hill on the dirt. Boost is sitting on 10-12 at 100kmh, down from 13-13 pre zorst install.

Thats with the kit installed yeah? If so, I'd probably wind in the needle valve just a touch to get the 100k boost at around 12, and a little higher. The spool up on the turbo will increase a little too. But. You may not need to touch the needle valve though, if you think its fine. When you get the EGT gauge in, have a play around with the needle valve and you should see a difference in EGT's at 100k's with different adjustments.

[threedogs]

Go easy if your going to use an exhaust wrap especially on a 4x4,
you'll find it will rust your pipes very quickly, if subjected to water.
Even race car and nascars dont use it for that reason

[10G]

Thats with the kit installed yeah? If so, I'd probably wind in the needle valve just a touch to get the 100k boost at around 12, and a little higher. The spool up on the turbo will increase a little too. But. You may not need to touch the needle valve though, if you think its fine. When you get the EGT gauge in, have a play around with the needle valve and you should see a difference in EGT's at 100k's with different adjustments.

Nah, not yet, just got the kit last night, too bloody hot to go in the shed after work ATM.


Go easy if your going to use an exhaust wrap especially on a 4x4,
you'll find it will rust your pipes very quickly, if subjected to water.
Even race car and nascars dont use it for that reason

Oh, gee, didn't know that, don't think I'll use it then. Thanks for the info TD.

[mudski]

Go easy if your going to use an exhaust wrap especially on a 4x4,
you'll find it will rust your pipes very quickly, if subjected to water.
Even race car and nascars dont use it for that reason

I disagree their John. The wrap dries very quickly. When I did the engine conversion and I removed the dump pipe from the ZD, I took off the wrap that I put on that 18 months prior and the pipe was still new under neath it. Paint and all.

[BigRAWesty]

I disagree their John. The wrap dries very quickly. When I did the engine conversion and I removed the dump pipe from the ZD, I took off the wrap that I put on that 18 months prior and the pipe was still new under neath it. Paint and all.
Agree.
I've got my dump pipe wrapped, and after mud runs above the wheels by tge time I popped the bonnet and had a look the wrap was almost dry..

To get the heat sheild off easily remove the actuator and sheild.
They heat sheild will come off easily over the top..

That 17 psi is that a spike?
Being manual I find its best to get it into 3rd and plant the foot around 1300rpm.
Itll spike a bit but you want it to settle at 15-16 psi..

[Winnie]

Go easy if your going to use an exhaust wrap especially on a 4x4,
you'll find it will rust your pipes very quickly, if subjected to water.
Even race car and nascars dont use it for that reason
2 days ago you suggested to growler that he should wrap his?

[10G]

I'm not wrapping anything, I'll get the mechinic to refit the heat shield when I get services in a few weeks.

I also looked at the 2nd battery holder. It has the end near the turbo fully enclosed if that makes any sense so that will deflect some of the turbo heat. I have some 3mm alloy sheet banging around in the shed, I'm going to make a simple shield to sit just off the battery holder, that should give the battery lots of protection.

One thing I've noticed over the past few days since the 3" zorst went on is the turbo fluctuating, I can feel the throttle pulsate now.

I'm looking forward to getting the Dawse installed in about 2 weeks and having this little project complete, it's been a great learning curve that I've enjoyed very much.

[threedogs]

I'm not wrapping anything, I'll get the mechinic to refit the heat shield when I get services in a few weeks.

I also looked at the 2nd battery holder. It has the end near the turbo fully enclosed if that makes any sense so that will deflect some of the turbo heat. I have some 3mm alloy sheet banging around in the shed, I'm going to make a simple shield to sit just off the battery holder, that should give the battery lots of protection.

One thing I've noticed over the past few days since the 3" zorst went on is the turbo fluctuating, I can feel the throttle pulsate now.

I'm looking forward to getting the Dawse installed in about 2 weeks and having this little project complete, it's been a great learning curve that I've enjoyed very much.

Ive had a T3 turbo beanie fitted for over 2 years now and found I
can put my hand on the turbo after a long drive, one of the better
gizmo's imo.
I run a wet cell Aux battery and I get bugger all evaporation if any at all

[10G]

Thats with the kit installed yeah? If so, I'd probably wind in the needle valve just a touch to get the 100k boost at around 12, and a little higher. The spool up on the turbo will increase a little too. But. You may not need to touch the needle valve though, if you think its fine. When you get the EGT gauge in, have a play around with the needle valve and you should see a difference in EGT's at 100k's with different adjustments.


Go easy if your going to use an exhaust wrap especially on a 4x4,
you'll find it will rust your pipes very quickly, if subjected to water.
Even race car and nascars dont use it for that reason


Ive had a T3 turbo beanie fitted for over 2 years now and found I
can put my hand on the turbo after a long drive, one of the better
gizmo's imo.
I run a wet cell Aux battery and I get bugger all evaporation if any at all

Are those beanies as easy to fit as they look like they should? They look like you should just be able to pull them around the turbo and have it in all in place within 5 minutes.

[Kennedy]

This has been a very educational thread for me and has prompted me to fit a needle valve.
I hope I'm not doing the wrong thing by butting in on this topic with a few questions of my own.
My vehicle - 1999 TD42 turbo ute with aftermarket intercooler. I had it dyno tuned a couple of years ago and they fitted a boost controller....I assume this is what is referred to as a Dawes valve ( it is plumbed in line between actuator and IC side of turbo)

1. I am getting a boost and EGT gauge - where is best place to put EGT probe, engine side of turbo or exhaust side ? I have read somewhere that temps are cooler on exhaust side. There is a threaded plug in exhaust manifold just before turbo so I'm guessing this would be a good place for probe.

2. I can't find a needle valve on the usual sites selling turbo related products, plenty of kits with needle and dawes combo. I found this item however, would it be suitable ?? https://www.valvesonline.com.au/pneumatics/ancillary-valves/aps-in-line-precision-speed-controller

[gubigfish]

Kennedy the Dawes and Needle Valve are for the the 3L Di and CRD motors

EGT gauge supposedly you get a more accurate reading from the exhaust manifold and the max temp can be higher on that side. Most have it fitted to the dump pipe just after the turbo. If your dump pipe doesn't have a port then you can either get someone to weld the port on, or take your dump pipe off and then drill a hole and tap a thread in it.

You can just see mine here in this picture

71205

[Kennedy]

Thanks for that gubigfish, I didn't realise my old dinosaur wasn't compatible with the hi-tech stuff...I guess its a bit like me!!

If I don't have a port in the dump pipe I can rectify that soon, my exhaust flex joint is shot so reckon I will replace the whole show with a 3"

[threedogs]

Are those beanies as easy to fit as they look like they should? They look like you should just be able to pull them around the turbo and have it in all in place within 5 minutes.

The beanie is very easy to fit all you'll need is a pair of long nose plyers
Its all about thermal dynamics it [beanie] keeps the heat inside the turbo
and not radiating out, I luv it

[threedogs]

I'm not wrapping anything, I'll get the mechinic to refit the heat shield when I get services in a few weeks.

I also looked at the 2nd battery holder. It has the end near the turbo fully enclosed if that makes any sense so that will deflect some of the turbo heat. I have some 3mm alloy sheet banging around in the shed, I'm going to make a simple shield to sit just off the battery holder, that should give the battery lots of protection.

One thing I've noticed over the past few days since the 3" zorst went on is the turbo fluctuating, I can feel the throttle pulsate now.

I'm looking forward to getting the Dawse installed in about 2 weeks and having this little project complete, it's been a great learning curve that I've enjoyed very much.

As for wrapping or not wrapping do your research, yes it will dry quickly its on an exhaust pipe FCOL.
Personally I wouldn't wrap Ive seen what it can do to an exhaust.
It may well be different with todays aluminized steel, but not for me

[10G]

OK. Fitted the Boost Gauge on Saturday ...

71213

and unlit ...

71214

[10G]

Made myself a QED heatsink for the aux battery to protect it from the turbo heat this arvo ...

71216

and

71215



The heatsink sits off the battery holder so there's a small air gap (5mm) between the battery holder and the alloy sheet. It should make a difference and it's a QED product ;-)

[10G]

To wrap this adventure up .....

With the help of bigguwesty the Dawse & needle valves were installed on Saturday. It's real nice to watch the boost gauge sit steadily at a certain value and not go up and down like a darn yo-yo. Throttle response is improved as well and so is spool up time, the latter affecting the former no doubt.

It's probably just me, but it felt like the motor was more stable while driving and also at idle.

Thanks to bigguwesty for all his help and patience trying to explain this 'dark art' to me, much appreciated mate.

[Warwick89]

71247

so I now have my gauges fitted, only took the auto elec... 4 days and $800 :( still better than getting them done at ARB or TJM lol.

ok so I've got one major problem and after spending all day reading I'm starting to get confused:

problems
#1 egt hit 650 at 100ks on a flat straight,

#2 boost stayed around 4-6psi constantly apart from the odd occasion where it would climb to 10-12psi; so this I think is the priority as fixing this should effect egt's anyway. so this is were the CONFUSED part comes into play, can someone explain to me how the needle valve works and what effect it has on a stienbauer performance chip if any????

I will be going on a 3500k trip in the a few weeks but I only have one week at home before than so really need to get my head around this.

cheers Warwick


edit: and yes ive used the search function and yes I've read other post.

[Warwick89]

Ok after checking all hoses I'm certain that there is no cracking or leaks, although I desperately need a catch can.

[10G]

Warwick89, I'm far from being an expert in this area, but I suggest your high egts are due to low boost.

Have you mentioned what you've had done? I can see you have 3 gauges, did you get a dawse and needle valve installed?? If yes, I'd suggest your dawse valve needs to be screwed in a bit if your gauge contstantly shows only 4-6 psi, that's crazilly way too low. Try by screwing it in 1 turn and see how much more boost you get, if not, try 2 and see etc etc etc. Just beware that boost increases exponentionally so it'll be low, then all of a sudden way high.

Also, try starting your own 'help' thread, it may attract a few more eyeballs.

Good luck.

[threedogs]

X 2 you need to increase your boost it is way to low,
Needle valve has nothing to do with your chip.
Have you noticed if your IC is oily?? if yes then
its leaking and will required a fully tigged and tested
IC

[Warwick89]

Warwick89, I'm far from being an expert in this area, but I suggest your high egts are due to low boost.

Have you mentioned what you've had done? I can see you have 3 gauges, did you get a dawse and needle valve installed?? If yes, I'd suggest your dawse valve needs to be screwed in a bit if your gauge contstantly shows only 4-6 psi, that's crazilly way too low. Try by screwing it in 1 turn and see how much more boost you get, if not, try 2 and see etc etc etc. Just beware that boost increases exponentionally so it'll be low, then all of a sudden way high.

Also, try starting your own 'help' thread, it may attract a few more eyeballs.

Good luck.

10G sorry I had a few under my belt by the stage I wrote that.

I haven't installed a needle and/or dawes valve yet that was going to be my solution to the low boost issue I noticed after fitting the three gauges last week. my main worry was that the dawes and needle valve would effect the chip and tune in some way?? i am unaware of the relationship between them and the chip and tune.

So went for another drive this morning after replacing a dead crank battery :( and boost was roughly as follows:

12-14psi from 0-60kmh @2500rpm
6psi cruising at 60kmh @1800rpm
12-14psi while increasing speed to 80kmh @2500rpm
8-10psi at 80kmh cruising 2000rpm

boost was very minimal at lower speeds???

couldn't get 100kmh readings because traffic blocked up in cairns only 100km zone lol

ALSO egt's for all above were around 450-500deg

[Warwick89]

X 2 you need to increase your boost it is way to low,
Needle valve has nothing to do with your chip.
Have you noticed if your IC is oily?? if yes then
its leaking and will required a fully tigged and tested
IC

threedogs yes i know the boost was low.

i checked for oil around the intercooler hoses, the oil was inside the hose out to the turbo. i don't think the intercooler is leaking but will do some more research on how to check it properly. i am planning to replace intercooler in a couple of months with a cross country one if i can ever save up enough.

cheers Warwick

[4bye4]

12-14psi from 0-60kmh @2500rpm
6psi cruising at 60kmh @1800rpm
12-14psi while increasing speed to 80kmh @2500rpm
8-10psi at 80kmh cruising @2000rpm

boost was very minimal at lower speeds???

couldn't get 100kmh readings because traffic blocked up in cairns only 100km zone lol

ALSO egt's for all above were around 450-500deg
Sounds about right. Min runs about 50 deg cooler and my max boost is 16psi. Low boost at low speed is not unusual, usually you see boost pick up when you are accelerating. A minor temp difference can also depend on where the sensor is mounted.

[threedogs]

threedogs yes i know the boost was low.

i checked for oil around the intercooler hoses, the oil was inside the hose out to the turbo. i don't think the intercooler is leaking but will do some more research on how to check it properly. i am planning to replace intercooler in a couple of months with a cross country one if i can ever save up enough.

cheers Warwick

IMO the CC IC is not worth the $$$ an OE one tigged and tested will give you about 30% more IC
Bang for buck Id walk away from the CC IC its only a 3ltr after all,Just what I think. A tigged will
get and keep your EGT down, fitting the CC IC wont bring them down that much more for the $$$
you are paying, money that could be spent on say a front locker,,,,,lol

[Warwick89]

Sounds about right. Min runs about 50 deg cooler and my max boost is 16psi. Low boost at low speed is not unusual, usually you see boost pick up when you are accelerating. A minor temp difference can also depend on where the sensor is mounted.

yeah i thought they looked a bit better today. i got worried Saturday night when EGT hit 600deg at 100kmh and boost was around 6psi cruising 200RPM

[4bye4]

Actually i had that happen when I first installed the NADS. No boost and high temps. Readjusted the dawes and never had it happen again. Maybe the spring got jammed or somthing. Anyway turned the adjuster then put it back to within a smidge of where it was in the first place and havent had a problem since.

[threedogs]

Sounds about right. Min runs about 50 deg cooler and my max boost is 16psi. Low boost at low speed is not unusual, usually you see boost pick up when you are accelerating. A minor temp difference can also depend on where the sensor is mounted.

using a boost adaptor which fits under OE boost sensor it quickest and neatest way to find boost,
prices vary so check first


http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Easy-Fit-Turbo-Boost-Gauge-Port-Adapter-for-Nissan-Patrol-ZD30-DI-Intercooler-/192059463909?hash=item2cb7a2d8e5:g:hicAAOSwo4pYizI b

[10G]

Had my first day of driving post dawse & needle install.

Much nicer to drive but using more fuel. Seems to go up to max boost alot of the time or near it which I'm assuming is why she seems to be drinking more fuel.

I've not done much with the needle valve. I adjusted it so I could just see the actuator arm lift and locked it up at that point, to be honest I'm still a little in dark as to what it does!

Reading other info on the web, it seems that I can adjust the needle valve to adjust my boost, strange, I thought that was governed by the dawse valve?

Any pointers on what I could try to help cut down the fuel usage?

[10G]

A quick update.

Firstly, I'm not sure about the accuracy of my boost gauge. Before I had it I was using the Torque app on my phone. During that time, boost never really went above 15s. I've fitted a real gauge and there's about 7-8 psi difference between the Torque app and the new physical boost gauge.

So, I had my boost set via the new guage to peak at firstly 20 psi, then upped it to 22psi. After about 220ks at 22psi it was drinking like a fish. I've dropped the boost to 18psi and adjusted the needle valve. I realised I hadn't set the needle valve correctly, so did that and added a just a tad more.

The thing is like a rocket now, it actually pushed me back in the seat, not that I drive like that, but it's nice to know it'll move when I want it to.

Q1 - Anyway at 100kmh I'm sitting at 16 psi and 340-360 on the pyro gauge. Does that sound about right???

When I had boost set at 22psi egts were almost always under 300 and only hit 350 going up hill in 5th.

Q2 - How do people get to 10 psi at 100kmh without their egts being through the roof?????