EGR blocked today...

[steve4377]

Fitted a stainless steel egr blocking plate today.

Initial impressions. Absolutely no difference whatsoever, which is surprising as I expected something! Loss of power, gain of power, different spool rate or something... But nothing. Ran it cold to hot out to the highway, revved through to 4000 rpm and 130 kph. No difference at all..

Anybody find their circumstance different? I thought if the combustion is no longer suppressed by inert gases...at least it would feel different. Starting to think that maybe it is already blocked at the exhaust end before I bought it!

Thoughts...

Steve

PS. 8 bucks on ebay delivered for 1.7mm stainless plate...

[jack180]

I found the EGTs lowered a bit. I feel as if Ive got slightly better fuel economy, but no real firm data to prove it.
I didn't really expect to see much change, rather just peace of mind knowing all the crud is not going back into my motor.

[Lemo79]

I noticed the turbo spool up slightly sooner. Enough for a bit better drive ability. The biggest difference I noticed is after a couple of oil changes how clean the oil stays now. Doesn't turn that diesel black.

Lemo.

[threedogs]

What motor did you fit the egr plate to ???

[steve4377]

Thanxs for that guys. It is the ZD30, 2004, Auto.

[steve4377]

BTW. Do not have EGT gauges so cannot know for that. Agree with the crud peace of mind bit jack180! Interesting to see if I notice the used oil condition as I change mine every 10k. Also recently fitted a Provent 200 so that should help too. 230000 or so Kay's on the clock now and running beautifully.

Cheers

[threedogs]

Thanxs for that guys. It is the ZD30, 2004, Auto.

If you fit the dawes then you will have taken all the thinking of boost away from the ECU
I take it you have boost and EGT gauges fitted?? A must for any ZD30 owner

[steve4377]

Three dogs, no EGT gauges or Dawes fitted. Don't want them. Happy with the ecu boost control. If I have to watch an EGT gauge I don't want to drive the thing. Only interested in stopping oil mist into the manifold and stopping carbon soot in the manifold. I'm happy with that. The unit is 2004 and running great and hopefully will for a few years, but the body and interior is aging too, so if it blows the motor It'll just about be selling time. Starting to look her age exterior wise too, but I love driving the old troll and intend to keep here for a few years yet. The whole unit has been bullet proof for ten years, I'm happy with that. Time marches on for us all man and machine I suppose...

Cheers

Steve

[threedogs]

I hear ya ,I intend keeping my 04,
it may end up a bit like dad's axe but it will be my axe lol

[steve4377]

ROFL 3Dogs...I remember that old one. Best axe he ever had. Only had three new heads and three new handles. Big chuckles...

Cheers mate...

[Daveyboyjunior]

6500365004

One of the best & easiest mods Steve,
Next, I would remove your manifold for a check and possible clean-out.
Here's mine before and after..
A small adjustment of your VGT screw is normally required to compensate for blocking the EGR, but best done with at least a boost gauge fitted.
There's loads of stuff on here about this....

[BigRAWesty]

So I've noticed the boost coming on stronger earlier and a can actually hear it spooling up now..
But that's all feel.. no gauges yet to actually confirm..

[4bye4]

ROFL 3Dogs...I remember that old one. Best axe he ever had. Only had three new heads and three new handles. Big chuckles...

Cheers mate...

Have you guys noticed the new heads and handles are not as good as the old ones.

[steve4377]

What...the new heads are Craft Handed In Northern Australia. Or as I prefer to call it...Made in CHINA...hehehehe

Yeah will get around to that Daveyboy. Bit warm here at the moment though. I just measured the Tarmac temperature at Onslow Airport (on the ground not in the air) at 60 degrees Celsius. It was a 46 Celsius day but it melts boots. Don't feel like doing mechanical work in those temps!

Cheers guys

[Daveyboyjunior]

Damn that's hot Steve!:jawdrop:
We are due some snow here soon, but gone back to mild, wet and windy for now!
I couldn't believe the coke I chiselled out of my manifold and she is definitely sounding better for it.:thumbup:

[Lemo79]

Three dogs, no EGT gauges or Dawes fitted. Don't want them. Happy with the ecu boost control. If I have to watch an EGT gauge I don't want to drive the thing. Only interested in stopping oil mist into the manifold and stopping carbon soot in the manifold. I'm happy with that. The unit is 2004 and running great and hopefully will for a few years, but the body and interior is aging too, so if it blows the motor It'll just about be selling time. Starting to look her age exterior wise too, but I love driving the old troll and intend to keep here for a few years yet. The whole unit has been bullet proof for ten years, I'm happy with that. Time marches on for us all man and machine I suppose...

Cheers

Steve

I blocked my EGR without Dawes and needle valve. No can do as I found. When EGR opens the ECU winds back the boost to allow the EGR to flow in, which now it can't as it is blocked, your EGTs now climb rapidly as you only have a couple of pound boost. Normally the EGR must come in under pressure, which I guess it is and make up the shortfall in boost, as before blocking you didn't notice boost drop at all.
I would highly recommend some gauges, not necessarily for daily driving then but more so for when performing mods like these you can see the effect. I bought digital gauges, although not cheap, for the fact that they will alarm at presets when something is wrong.
I have blocked EGR but don't have a catch can. From reading it sounds like it is the combination of EGR and oil mist that creates the sludge, so I often wonder that maybe I could have put a catch can on and not blocked the EGR would have got the same result?

Lemo.

[threedogs]

So I've noticed the boost coming on stronger earlier and a can actually hear it spooling up now..
But that's all feel.. no gauges yet to actually confirm..

After you fit gauges will you be fitting a Dawes and needle vavle?
suppose it depends on what the gauges say eh

[Rock Trol]

As Lemo79 said, you will need to take boost control away from the ECU now that the ERG is blocked. Otherwise you will be running low boost when you least want it.

[steve4377]

Lemo and Rock Trol you make very valid points. I just went for another run and I believe it perceptible that I have lost boost and had to put the loud pedal further down to the floor as a result of the lower boost. Think I will just remove the blocker. I've already fitted the catch can, so think I'll remove the blocker and leave it at that.

Cheers for some sage advice.

Steve

[Dr Gary]

My 2006 ZD30 had a conniption at 70k--dreaded water leak. When the engine was out we inspected the intake manifold--plenty of crud there even with Provent and low k's.
I now have all the gear-Dawes, EGT, Boost etc. and have the EGR at optimum--if you get my meaning.
There is a product that is sprayed into a vacuum hose to loosen all that stuff--it comes out the exhaust as you rev the motor. Not my liking to put that through the engine.
That should give you a clue how much is blocking manifolds etc and you can make an informed decision on your plate.

[the evil twin]

As Lemo79 said, you will need to take boost control away from the ECU now that the ERG is blocked. Otherwise you will be running low boost when you least want it.

Uuummmm... never ever had low boost on mine and it was fully instrumented.
The ECU will still boost similar MAP with/without EGR overall and if anything my boost was higher till I tweaked the VNT to reduce boost pressures.
EGR block my cruise boost stayed around the same, put the welly in and the boost was momentarily higher post EGR block at around 36 to 38 PSIA
Had to tweak the VNT because of higher boost due to the EGR valve not cycling like the ECU was proggy'd to expect so reduced the MAP to around 32 PSIA max.

[Rock Trol]

Lemo and Rock Trol you make very valid points. I just went for another run and I believe it perceptible that I have lost boost and had to put the loud pedal further down to the floor as a result of the lower boost. Think I will just remove the blocker. I've already fitted the catch can, so think I'll remove the blocker and leave it at that.

Cheers for some sage advice.

Steve

it' not too hard to install a Dawes valve and needle valve (if needed). Once you bypass the connection to the air box which lowers vacuum and thus boost you will have full boost control. It will be a very linear boost curve, much nicer to drive.

its just a matter of redirecting the 4mm vacuum hoses and splicing in the valves. The hardest part is to find a boost source for the Dawes valve. My inter cooler (x country) had a port I could tap into. Otherwise you might need to weld a bung into the air pipe after the turbo.

the other option is to unblock egr and clean the intake on a regular basis. You can do this by removing and decoding or using something like wynns egr cleaner. My mechanic used the cleaner on my car last year and it breathes a lot better.

[Lemo79]

What year model Evil Twin? As you could imagine if the turbo is still pushing pressure into the intake manifold not a lot of EGR is going to get in there, it's going to take the path of least resistance which is out the exhaust, so the ECU throttles boost back to allow the Exhaust gas to flow into the inlet manifold. Just curious what year model as mine is a 06 GUIV and deffinately behaves this way.

Lemo.

[Lemo79]

I should add it is not a constant low boost, it will usually drop after you have been at cruise speed for a little while, then after a period or when you start to accelerate will come back up. But while it is low EGTs climb and if the timing was right you could hit a hill with already high EGTs getting them pretty damn high by the top.

Lemo.

[Rock Trol]

My crd used to drop from 14-15psi down to 10-12psi when cruising which is not too bad and then go higher if I accelerated or hit a hill. Being a crd it definitely controlled it better and I ran without a Dawes for 18 months without any dramas (until the 3 inch zhaust). When I installed the manual boost control the car did feel peppier and was always on boost. Much nicer to drive.

With the DI cars it may be different. When you look at the egr as part of a whole system then changing the boost control when you block it makes sense as all the fluctuations in boost are there to promote egr flow. Some cars may be more affected than others but it's interesting that you said you could feel the difference.

[steve4377]

Thanxs again people. Good advice all round. Gunna watch and shoot for the next month. Also gonna monitor fuel consumption rates. After about 80kph the extra go pedal is noticeable, but not alarming. See the rationale for the Dawes control but may just do a manifold clean every 50k if I remove the block.

My theory is that crud is mainly made of carbon. Carbon is a very poor heat conductor. When carbon is thick it retains massive heat and this causes the problem, more so than over fuelling. The heat creates local heat store areas than increase the local temp until the combustion chamber can take no more - classic reason maybe why the early failures were whilst cruising. Heat is the enemy and should be disposed of per design. Air passing through masses of hot carbon in the intake manifold must I would think raise the temp of the combustion gasses. Food for thought maybe. So if you fit catch can, Dawes and such then this may still not be enough if you don't clean out your manifold when you fit all those!

Interesting.

Cheers
Steve

[threedogs]

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Patrol-ZD30-Boost-Gauge-Port-Adapter-Only-/331773948996?hash=item4d3f44b444:g:LRIAAOSwsB9WDzL X
You can buy this style boost adaptor, fits booth the Di and CRD GU

[Sir Roofy]

Thanxs again people. Good advice all round. Gunna watch and shoot for the next month. Also gonna monitor fuel consumption rates. After about 80kph the extra go pedal is noticeable, but not alarming. See the rationale for the Dawes control but may just do a manifold clean every 50k if I remove the block.

My theory is that crud is mainly made of carbon. Carbon is a very poor heat conductor. When carbon is thick it retains massive heat and this causes the problem, more so than over fuelling. The heat creates local heat store areas than increase the local temp until the combustion chamber can take no more - classic reason maybe why the early failures were whilst cruising. Heat is the enemy and should be disposed of per design. Air passing through masses of hot carbon in the intake manifold must I would think raise the temp of the combustion gasses. Food for thought maybe. So if you fit catch can, Dawes and such then this may still not be enough if you don't clean out your manifold when you fit all those!

Interesting.

Cheers
Steve

GOOD POINT you might be onto something there

[Daveyboyjunior]

The throttle manifold is surprisingly easy to remove, to be able do this job regularly as you say Steve. Better than throwing an EGR cleaner in and sending all the loose crud into your engine!
Be careful to align the pressed metal gasket correctly when you do!

Hey TD that is a great little adaptor to allow a boost connection. Nice one!

[steve4377]

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Patrol-ZD30-Boost-Gauge-Port-Adapter-Only-/331773948996?hash=item4d3f44b444:g:LRIAAOSwsB9WDzL X
You can buy this style boost adaptor, fits booth the Di and CRD GU

That's as clever as clogs that is 3dogs...

[threedogs]

That's as clever as clogs that is 3dogs...

when they drilled and tapped my boost hose , un be known to me it had crimped
the nylon tubing, still showed good boost, They drilled and tapped under the IC.
Now I use this adaptor, love the simplicity of it and not overpriced like some things
Nissan.

So I can remove that inlet thingy and de crud it without buying a gasket is that correct??
Seems easy enough to get to.

[Daveyboyjunior]

Yes TD, four bolts to remove for the manifold. When you slacken them off you'll see the gasket is a thin pressed metal thing.
Just catch it as you take the bolts right out.
The two vacuum hoses on the other side will need pulling off, and one should have a coloured indicator mark on it to make sure they go back the right way round.
Undo your intercooler hoses and you're there, it'll come away easy.:1056:

[threedogs]

Thanks I think mine would need doing after a lot of small trips lately.

[threedogs]

Thanxs for that guys. It is the ZD30, 2004, Auto.

Did you also remove that butterfly,,,Thinking Ill tackle this on the weekend
From memory when I last had the IC off mine looked very clean,
but Ill inspect it a bit closer, short trips cant be helping either

[Daveyboyjunior]

No TD.
In fact I started a thread in this section about removing the butterfly and what effect it would have.
This was Mudski's reply which makes sense..

Its not necessary bud. Dont bother. you wont gain anything from doing it. The large butterfly assists in engine shut down, and the other i like a choke where it closes to richen the fuel mixture. Or something to that effect.
But if your keen to see the difference, just leave the vacuum tube of it so it work work and just stay open.

Hope this helps
Davey

Sent from my SM-P600 using Tapatalk

[threedogs]

Thanks for that,, a firm believer if you stray too far away stock
the more things can go wrong.
Ill have a look and see whats there.

[Sir Roofy]

Did you also remove that butterfly,,,Thinking Ill tackle this on the weekend
From memory when I last had the IC off mine looked very clean,
but Ill inspect it a bit closer, short trips cant be helping either

NOPE need to get out on a good long run

[threedogs]

NOPE need to get out on a good long run

Yeah but havent got confidence in the motor, even though it gives no problems ATM.
will be starting some longer trips and see what happens, I feel a need to fish been way
toooooo long

[Sir Roofy]

Yeah but havent got confidence in the motor, even though it gives no problems ATM.
will be starting some longer trips and see what happens, I feel a need to fish been way
toooooo long

You have mate can hear them calling you LOL don't baby it give it a bit more right peddle

[threedogs]

Lucky it did what it did and not a piston likr yours. Its only a
temp repair even though the bottle say permanent.
Got out to Johnno's ok the other week, next Ill see how it goes
out to Beveridge, if it can do that, Im right to go,
Pricey is ready to go as well, pricey's brothers mate caught
a 1.4 mtr cod at Mulwala over Xmas thats a cod eh lol

[Daveyboyjunior]

A 1.4m cod!!!!
Hell, that is a big fish!
If we had fish that big over here, they would be evacuating villages!

Seriously though TD, what happend to your truck?

[steve4377]

Well been using the car a bit now and it's still running beautifully with the blocker in. Will leave it and see how it goes as is for a while. If anything perhaps a tiny loss of boost btwn 80 and 110 but not even sure about that. Will report any changes!
What happened to yours 3doggies???

Cheers
Steve

Hey Daveyboy, did you see my how to change your fuel filter on YouTube vid yet??? Just look up Nissan Patrol Fuel Filter and MAF clean....

[threedogs]

A 1.4m cod!!!!
Hell, that is a big fish!
If we had fish that big over here, they would be evacuating villages!

Seriously though TD, what happend to your truck?


I was losing water and getting hot just out of the blue, so I figured I throw some Rislone head repair
in it to see how that goes. Now I dont use any water, still have great power, but just not confident
in the motor even though the bottle said it now fixed permanently. I did a 20min run to BA's
last week. Might get on the western ring road tomorrow and go into the city via the freeway
Just not confident in it at all. No money to repair so had to patch it GRrrrrrrr but Im on the road

[Daveyboyjunior]

That is pain TD.
I know what you mean about the trust thing.
I had similar symptoms with my Paj.
If we cruised constantly at about 100-110k, I would have to stop after 70miles she'd be boiling over. I'd let her cool down, top her up and off we'd go again, up into the mountains and back home again with 1000miles done, no problems.
It's like she just needed a burp!

[Daveyboyjunior]

Stevo, saw the vid a while back!
If it's the same one, I liked the idea of bolting the filter manifold back on upside down temporarily to undo the filter.
Top tip mate!

[threedogs]

That is pain TD.
I know what you mean about the trust thing.
I had similar symptoms with my Paj.
If we cruised constantly at about 100-110k, I would have to stop after 70miles she'd be boiling over. I'd let her cool down, top her up and off we'd go again, up into the mountains and back home again with 1000miles done, no problems.
It's like she just needed a burp!

Highly recommend any ZD30 owner have a bottle of this product in their Patrol.
If you ever breakdown with the same symptoms this stuff will get you mobile
again in 20 mins. Its called Rislone Head Repair

http://www.supercheapauto.com.au/online-store/products/Rislone-Head-Gasket-Fix-680g.aspx?pid=290752#Recommendations

[steve4377]

Highly recommend any ZD30 owner have a bottle of this product in their Patrol.
If you ever breakdown with the same symptoms this stuff will get you mobile
again in 20 mins. Its called Rislone Head Repair

http://www.supercheapauto.com.au/online-store/products/Rislone-Head-Gasket-Fix-680g.aspx?pid=290752#Recommendations

Noted 3dogs...took my troll for a highway run today. Ran great but noticed the water temp was up to 95 in stead of the usual 80 centigrade. Not noticeable on the car temp gauge but noted in my temp gauge mounted in the radiator cap. Wondering if this due to the inert gases not being there to cool combustion temps or perhaps a lack of boost as the ecu may be backing off the boost to raise temps as someone suggested on this thread - which is happening. Any thoughts?

Me thinks it's either the Dawes path or unblocking the egr plate!

Daveyboy, got the inverted fuel filter idea from this forum. Agree it's a top tip...

Cheers

[GeeYou8]

With a 'troll reliability seems to be everything, I got rid of the GU2 because it let us down twice.
The first time was the overflow spigot breaking off on the radiator, temporary fix, drive two and a half hours home on 38 degree day with no aircon dog, cat & kid in the car, new radiator.
Second time alternator died, charge battery, drive two and a half hours home on 38 degree day with no aircon dog, cat & kid in the car, new alternator.
New 'troll, problem solved.
Happy wife, happy life.
Graham