Need a much softer ride

[threedogs]

Hi all as you know my back is knackered basically, and I would like a softer ride.
ATM I have 2" EFS suspenion and shocks. Its ok but it could be better, I cant
go a different spring rate because of my accessories fitted. I can however change the shocks.
Im thinking if I change to say Koni will that improve the "ride".
I know Koni are adjustable and rebuildable, any thoughts

[rusty_nail]

Hi all as you know my back is knackered basically, and I would like a softer ride.
ATM I have 2" EFS suspenion and shocks. Its ok but it could be better, I cant
go a different spring rate because of my accessories fitted. I can however change the shocks.
Im thinking if I change to say Koni will that improve the "ride".
I know Koni are adjustable and rebuildable, any thoughts

dont srpings take out the bumps and shocks just stop the springs from bouncing? i would have thought if you were to improve your ride, you would have to reduce the spring rating? maybe you need to take out some of your accessories if thats the difference between being able and not being able to drive your car?

[BigRAWesty]

If shocks are valved to tight then they will add resistance to the absorbing rate.
So you really have 2 choices. Grab some adjustable shocks, or try a little lesser spring rate.
I guess if your chasing the ride height you have and weight capacity then change the shocks.

[threedogs]

I'm hoping the insurance Co will come to the party by either suppling a
Strato suspension seat from their 3000 range or some Konis for all 4 corners.
I think they would go the seat as they would have no idea on suspension set ups
and Im not selling the Patrol just because I cant get the ride right.
Council has recently added 8 new speed humps in my area, so just getting to the shop and back I have to go over
20 for a return trip

Maybe even air bags all round

[rusty_nail]

I'm hoping the insurance Co will come to the party by either suppling a
Strato suspension seat from their 3000 range or some Konis for all 4 corners.
I think they would go the seat as they would have no idea on suspension set ups
and Im not selling the Patrol just because I cant get the ride right.
Council has recently added 8 new speed humps in my area, so just getting to the shop and back I have to go over
20 for a return trip

Maybe even air bags all round

i never said sell it mate. just take some of the dead weight out of it

[BigRAWesty]

Then who would drive it??? Bahahaha.

I'd say hit them up for adjustables mate then you can set it to how you like.

[taslucas]

Yeah if it's mainly used for going to the shops over 20 speed humps maybe there's not a need for a lot of gear in the back?

[threedogs]

Ha ha lucas you are a wasted talent, hope you never injure your back
@ Kallen only since putting in the speed humps its aggravated my back more so Im going to hit them for what I can' Koni's and the seat would be nice.
Insurance dont like making life better its there job. lol
@ Rusty didnt mean I was going to sell it, just need the ride to be better.

[BigRAWesty]

A nice set of koni adjustables mate. Win all round

[rusty_nail]

@ Rusty didnt mean I was going to sell it, just need the ride to be better.

clearly my point is lost.

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=56730&d=1427759204

[rusty_nail]

and i think youll find lucas broke his back not even 12 months ago TD, even walked into the hospital and the nurse didnt believe him, thats tough. he tickled it the other day when he was starting the mower tho haha.

and kallen, re deadweight and your comment mate, very punny =P

[the evil twin]

My experience with adjustable shocks is they are more trouble than they are worth.
I also think there is no way you will get a "much softer ride", improved yes but by a large amount, no.

Try for air suspension such as http://www.airbagworld.com.au/airbag-man-coil-replacement-airbag-suspension-kit-.html.

I think you will have a better case to argue and get a much better result and use the Seat and Shocks as a fall back position

[Winnie]

Is this really a competition about whose back is worse?
Lucas gave some good advice I thought? Less gear in the car would mean you could use softer springs and have a more comfortable ride. What about airbags? Then you could pump them up for when you do put your gear in to go fishing on the Murray?

[threedogs]

My experience with adjustable shocks is they are more trouble than they are worth.
I also think there is no way you will get a "much softer ride", improved yes but by a large amount, no.

Try for air suspension such as http://www.airbagworld.com.au/airbag-man-coil-replacement-airbag-suspension-kit-.html.

I think you will have a better case to argue and get a much better result and use the Seat and Shocks as a fall back position

Ive sent them an email, how do these affect articulation they only say its about 2" higher than OE.
Can only ask I suppose, Did read an article a few years back of a guy who did 4 airbags conversion.
Had trouble with the valving, we'll see

[threedogs]

Is this really a competition about whose back is worse?
Lucas gave some good advice I thought? Less gear in the car would mean you could use softer springs and have a more comfortable ride. What about airbags? Then you could pump them up for when you do put your gear in to go fishing on the Murray?

Its empty all the time

[rusty_nail]

Is this really a competition about whose back is worse?
Lucas gave some good advice I thought? Less gear in the car would mean you could use softer springs and have a more comfortable ride. What about airbags? Then you could pump them up for when you do put your gear in to go fishing on the Murray?

yeah mate, wasnt trying to compete for anyone, im just trying to offer advice thats all. if i didnt care, i wouldnt have posted in the first place...

[rusty_nail]

Its empty all the time

so what accessories are making things so heavy that you need more rigid springs mate?

[Cuppa]

I’ve had Konis on both motorcycles & on our bus. When the Lovells I had fitted to the Patrol as part of the GVM kit are knackered I will replace them with Konis. That said I think Rusty is correct. I don’t believe that changing shocks is going to help with your back issue. You need to change springs and/or get a suitable suspension seat for that. Shocks control rather than create the level of softness/firmness. I also doubt that airbags would help.

Softer springs with adjustable Konis could have some potential, but if you dont want to change springs then I reckon the seat is your best answer.

[the evil twin]

Ive sent them an email, how do these affect articulation they only say its about 2" higher than OE.
Can only ask I suppose, Did read an article a few years back of a guy who did 4 airbags conversion.
Had trouble with the valving, we'll see

Shouldn't be an issue, there are a few different LV orientated manuf around and various lift options.
Not quite the same choice as the millions of trucks, buses etc but should be able to get the right gear and info these days.

I wouldn't go air over existing coils as that is more a load levelling solution so your 'unladen' spring performance won't change a terrible lot.
FWIW I have rear air bags over flexi coils with Tough Dog shocks on my truck and it has a very nice ride IMHO... easily whomps a Prado around the speed humps at Bunnings but I have a gut feeling it is not the fix you are looking for.

Air is def the solution if you want a leap in the ride softness and someone else is paying/subsidising costs

[threedogs]

so what accessories are making things so heavy that you need more rigid springs mate?


I dont want it more ridgid just soak up the bumps better
Most options as per any one else bullbar winch with rope, dual batteries, no roof rack ATS
no drawers, When fitting the EFS I told them I needed it as soft as possible and thats what I got.
@ Cuppa I ran Konis on a few of my bikes boy big difference over OE thats for sure

[rusty_nail]

Most options as per any one else bullba,,r winch with rope, dual batteries, no roof rack ATS

you should be able to get away with softer springs, with the softer springs you will only run onto trouble if you ever tow. i remember when i upgraded the suspension on my swb, it had lovely sagged springs with bullbar winch etc, it rode like a rolls royce. after i upgraded it was too rigid and uncomfortable. if i had of kept the standard load springs with the 2" lift if would have still had a nice ride. i think the same would apply to you mate.

[threedogs]

I've sent a few emails out to get some idea of fitting costs etc

[taslucas]

A mate has rancho 9 point adjustable shocks and tough dog 3" springs. Regardless of how the quality of those brands rate, I will say that on number 2 setting (second softest) it was very very soft. But as far as I know the springs were standard rate.

Edit: oh and I just spent a week laying down after aggravating my back. 10 months since I've been out of my plastic taco shell lol

[Cuppa]

Air is def the solution if you want a leap in the ride softness and someone else is paying/subsidising costs

A few blokes I know run Fournales shocks (spring-less air shocks or ‘air springs’ for want of a better term) on their Harleys. The link here (http://www.mawsolutions.com/html/fournales_shock_absorbers.html) (follow the link & then click on ‘About Fournales) mentions 4x4 shocks . You could have no springs at all. They are not cheap, but are an excellent product, infinitely adjustable & can give a very plush but controlled ride.

[liftlid]

Springs will be ok unless you have way way over on spring rate, koni are a hassle to adjust and not as good as some of the more advanced shocks.
Try fox, king, icon or Amarda? All the better shocks will make the car drive over speed humps like they are pebbles, fully loaded

[garett]

no offence by this but have you tried slowing down for the bumps ? :eck05:

[threedogs]

I'll go and talk to Andrew at on Track about the Amadas and Fox shocks,
or anythink he thinks can be done,

[threedogs]

no offence by this but have you tried slowing down for the bumps ? :eck05:

its more about ironing out any harshness from general driving, off road its ok
If I can get it softer/less harsh on road then off road it'll be better again I hope.
The Fox shocks look look the go, but I dont think the insurance Co would have anyone
in the field to know what works and what doesnt, They gave me a $1500 backhoe seat for my other
4x4.
That was bordering on dangerous driving around. Ill get some quotes then get my Doctor to put in a request.
then its a waiting game.

[threedogs]

Just received a call from the guy at Air Bag It and had a long talk.
you remove the coils and replace them with air bags, retaining
your shocks for control. He's writting me up a quote for 2 x digital gauges for front and rear
a compressor and an air tank, 4 x air bags the lot. He says its completely different than coils and smooth as
with better articulation, and on road manners. all up to the insurance Co now, sounds good though.

Anyone want to guess on a price??

[liftlid]

no offence by this but have you tried slowing down for the bumps ? :eck05:
What bumps?

[Winnie]

What bumps?

Hahahahahahahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa............

[the evil twin]

Just received a call from the guy at Air Bag It and had a long talk.
you remove the coils and replace them with air bags, retaining
your shocks for control. He's writting me up a quote for 2 x digital gauges for front and rear
a compressor and an air tank, 4 x air bags the lot. He says its completely different than coils and smooth as
with better articulation, and on road manners. all up to the insurance Co now, sounds good though.

Anyone want to guess on a price??

Yep... thats exactly what I was saying you need in the prev posts.

There is only one downside and that is doing a bag off road, everything else is upside IE flex, handling, ride, etc etc
Given the gazillions of K's and the flogging the industry boys give them they are pretty damn reliable these days

Price for all that with full remote... ummmm... $8,399 plus GST

[threedogs]

Cant see the insurance Co going for that, but Ill put it to them who knows!!
I wont see the doctor again till next thursday week.

A replacement bag if touring would be a good spare to carry

[the evil twin]

Cant see the insurance Co going for that, but Ill put it to them who knows!!
I wont see the doctor again till next thursday week.

A replacement bag if touring would be a good spare to carry

Don't go too much by me... just a SWAG for full retail
I reckon $2,000 an axle plus $2,000 for the onboard air, plus $2,000 for the installation, plus $399 so it isn't a round number.

[MudRunnerTD]

Springs will be ok unless you have way way over on spring rate, koni are a hassle to adjust and not as good as some of the more advanced shocks.
Try fox, king, icon or Amarda? All the better shocks will make the car drive over speed humps like they are pebbles, fully loaded

I have Amada Extremes Remote Res shocks and they are impressive. They are the bottom of the pile in the list that Gary has there.

Kings Smoothies are at the top of that pile and if you are being sponsored then id be all over them. Matched with the right spring and it will be magic.

[Clunk]

Sounds like you need one of those hydro-gas setups that used to be fitted to Citroen's years ago.......... man they were damn comfy.


Of you could just buy a Citroen 2CV for those shopping trips :D

[threedogs]

Sounds like you need one of those hydro-gas setups that used to be fitted to Citroen's years ago.......... man they were damn comfy.


Of you could just buy a Citroen 2CV for those shopping trips :D

Remember them well the lever was next to the driver near the door.
shite I may be older than you lol

[threedogs]

I have Amada Extremes Remote Res shocks and they are impressive. They are the bottom of the pile in the list that Gary has there.

Kings Smoothies are at the top of that pile and if you are being sponsored then id be all over them. Matched with the right spring and it will be magic.

@ MR do the remote reservoir/cannistor fox shocks fit ok ,as in straight bolt up??

[liftlid]

@ MR do the remote reservoir/cannistor fox shocks fit ok ,as in straight bolt up??
You need brackets for reservoir, as long as you get shocks to suit your travel no further mods.
Otherwise you might need bumpstops, ft shock towers extensions, body lift, for example
Just put your adjusters in a location you can get to as I find I adjust mine to what load / type of driving I'm doing.
I've had fox 2.0 smoothies and now icon 2.5 remotes and found both to give a great ride with the icon able to soak up big hits with ease, I no longer notice when the car leaves the ground then lands over those high country woop tee doos. And I removed nitro charger sports to put on the fox.

[Winnie]

I no longer notice when the car leaves the ground then lands over those high country woop tee doos.

I can testify to that after driving behind Gary through the high country... Lmao

[BigRAWesty]

You need brackets for reservoir, as long as you get shocks to suit your travel no further mods. Otherwise you might need bumpstops, ft shock towers extensions, body lift, for example Just put your adjusters in a location you can get to as I find I adjust mine to what load / type of driving I'm doing. I've had fox 2.0 smoothies and now icon 2.5 remotes and found both to give a great ride with the icon able to soak up big hits with ease, I no longer notice when the car leaves the ground then lands over those high country woop tee doos. And I removed nitro charger sports to put on the fox.

Darren is in the same boat with his gu..
Was getting air every woop down south here and didn't know it..

[doka404]

I originally had Dobinson Remote res shocks in my GQ with Dobinson coils. Whiel the shocks performed well I found that they were a little to harsh.
I bought a set of 2.5" Koni 82's and have been running them for around 1000km now and all I can say is that even with the same coils, the ride was transformed.
The harshness is no longer there and they seem to absorb small as well as large bumps better than the dobinsons ever did. I could probably adjust them up a bit as I have them on the softest setting.

My only issue with them is that they really are too short for what i want and will have to get a longer set of shocks for the truck..so will probably be coming out in the next couple of days and put the spare set of OME Nitrochargers untill the new shocks arrive

[the evil twin]

Remote res shocks won't make any difference for 'speed bumps'.
That isn't why the 'remote res' design concept evolved.
They are for sustained rough terrain where ordinary shocks can overheat and the fluid aerate due to sustained heat and motion

[liftlid]

Remote res shocks won't make any difference for 'speed bumps'. That isn't why the 'remote res' design concept evolved. They are for sustained rough terrain where ordinary shocks can overheat and the fluid aerate due to sustained heat and motion
So a speed bump isn't rough? Well it isn't when you have a set of remote Resi installed yeehaa

[Winnie]

So a speed bump isn't rough? Well it isn't when you have a set of remote Resi installed yeehaa

Rough but not sustained... Unless you are driving through a Bunnings car park

[liftlid]

Rough but not sustained... Unless you are driving through a Bunnings car park Yep just a benefit of a good set of shocks though

[Evo]

I was thinking the suspension seat would be better.
No need to change any suspension or remove accessories, plus aren't they fully adjustable for height, weight, rebound, etc?
Have been thinking about maybe looking at one of these for myself...

Evo

[threedogs]

I was thinking the suspension seat would be better.
No need to change any suspension or remove accessories, plus aren't they fully adjustable for height, weight, rebound, etc?
Have been thinking about maybe looking at one of these for myself...

Evo
.
Seems to be the right way to go, insurance co wont know anything about suspension
and cant see them forking out $8k, the seat in question is an LTSS Strato
http://www.stratos.com.au/Page/stratos-3000-ltss .They way Strato make their
seats is a RHS one will fit the LHS as the knob to turn the back is recessed.
so I already have rails for the left hand side,
@ EVO if you do remember to cut some rubber to go between the seat rails and the floor
otherwise you'll feel every ripple in the road through your back, I just cut pieces of tub liner
and punched a 12 mm hole in them,

[the evil twin]

I was thinking the suspension seat would be better.
No need to change any suspension or remove accessories, plus aren't they fully adjustable for height, weight, rebound, etc?
Have been thinking about maybe looking at one of these for myself...

Evo

Huge PIA for engineering tho I would think... dunno for sure as I've not looked into it.

I thought Seat belts on full suspension seats are all part of the seat because you can't use the factory ones

The Stratos are low profile which would prob be OK

[threedogs]

On the seat I have now you only bolt the OE seat belt stem to the base on the side,
I dont think Strato seats need to be engineered as they are already ADR approved and a straight swap

[threedogs]

@ Et you were only a little off , total cost with compressor,
3 gallon tank gauges and 4 bags etc came to $4200.
Not that bad for what you get I suppose

[the evil twin]

@ Et you were only a little off , total cost with compressor,
3 gallon tank gauges and 4 bags etc came to $4200.
Not that bad for what you get I suppose

Wow... that is way cheaper than I expected.

Hmmm... Considering I have on board air and almost brand new shocks I would only need the bags and controllers I might have to give them a call

[threedogs]

Want me to PM his details
$2900 delivered for what you want

[Clunk]

this is what you need TD lolhttp://www.discussionsnetwork.com/forumfiend/uploads/images/53395.jpg

[krbrooking]

this is what you need TD lol


WTF!!! Are they actually in production.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

[Clunk]

WTF!!! Are they actually in production.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner


I'll just leave this here

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/showthread.php?32846-Y62-convertible

[krbrooking]

I'll just leave this here http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/showthread.php?32846-Y62-convertible

Yeh scrolled down and found the other thread thanks.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

[threedogs]

He's a very funny man , I think he doesnt know just how funny he can be lol
He should work out a routine for the retirement home, hat, cane the lot


ET PM sent

[dads tractor]

TD talk to O/Lock they can do the suspension seats with blue plate foe QLD for about the $500 range .

http://www.stratos.com.au/Page/nissan-patrol-gu-seat

[threedogs]

Thats the one Im after but it wont be in the $500 range , I currently use the LTS Stato seat
with lumber and cost was $700 for the seat and $400 for the rails, No ticket required as its
an ADR replacement seat so no mods required to fit it. All I did was raise it 40mm to
increase the view over the bonnet.

[dads tractor]

I must have been looking at another then ,and the rails were extra . What about checking truck wreckers for a KAB air ride maybe a bit big though probably .

[threedogs]

I had a KAB 305 on my troopy, would not recommend them to anyone.
They are about 3" too high so your head is on the roof to start with.
You then adjust it to suit your weight, that gives about 3" of travel,
now remember head is already on the roof ouch ouch ouch.
Ended up using small g clamps to hold it shut, I welded it to a
stool and use it my shed to sit on lol,
I see the doctor tomorrow so hopefully he can get the ball rolling
I'll get a price for the suspension seat soon.

Plus the KAB 305 looks like it belongs on a back hoe very agricultural

[dads tractor]

Yeah used KAB in trucks and used to lock them down on the bad dirt roads because you were on the way down as the truck was on the way up no fun in that especially with a triple .The other thought I had was variable rate springs ; I,m interested in this as the back is getting a bit frail and I,ve given it a flogging over the years so post all your findings for us to follow if you will .

[threedogs]

first tip is remove your wallet on long drives lol
Already have the Strato , but if you want to try some extra rubber
where the seat bolts to the floor will make a huge difference

[dads tractor]

Wallet after what I want to do between now and the Cape next year for the Tractor my wallet will be thinner than a Dominos thin crust lol! What sort,thickness rubber are we talking here TD ?

[threedogs]

I used some tub liner from the local 4x4 shop 6mm Id say.

[threedogs]

Wheels are in motion now its a waiting game ,with my insurance co. being what they are I dont expect
an answer before the grand final at the earliest, so hopefully a suspension seat from Strato or air bags all round
who know they may do both, but that would make me laugh.
DT have you had a chance to fit the rubber yet?

[threedogs]

For those thinking of replacing their OE seat with the Strato LTSS suspension seat.
The total cost will be $2368.44, that includes RH arm rest and a lumber pump.
Fitting cost is $150 ,so not a cheap exercise, but well worth it IMO.
Then again Im not paying

[Winnie]

You don't think a suspension seat would throw you around a bit much going through some rough stuff? I imagine you'd hit your head on the roof a fair bit!

[nissannewby]

You don't think a suspension seat would throw you around a bit much going through some rough stuff? I imagine you'd hit your head on the roof a fair bit!

If they are a high quality seat and are set up correctly once installed then they shouldnt bounce you around

[threedogs]

Nah the KAB are useless in a 4x4 with about 6" travel they are dangerous,
The Strato moves back and down a touch which is much better,
the suspension is in the base not the whole seat

[threedogs]

Seems my request for a couple of modifications to my Patrol will be approved,
Is any one here running remote cannister shocks, and can I get some feedback.
The ones I hope to be getting are Nitrogen filled remote cannister shocks by Terrain Tamer
Will more than likely fit 3" flexi coil to go with them.

http://www.superiorengineering.com.au/4x4-suspension/shock-absorbers/amadaxtreme-explorer11-2-3-4-inch-lift-front-strut-9383