All Things Chev

[poindexter]

Edging ever closer to doing a 6.5 conversion.
Will probably make a call within a week or 2.
If this goes ahead, you all know what this means right?

cheers

[PeeBee]

which motor/drivetrain have you decided to go with Ralph? Are you doing the installation yourself or someone else?

[matfew]

Phil it would be best to get the new alternator then the pipe sizes and go to pirtek (or similar) with a list. What we done with marks was a back and forth till we found right fitting. The only issue was the oil drain which was a custom made jobby by the local pirtek in wodonga but it is something that could be made at home if your handy with a Oxy or something.

I'd be happy to help you with it but I am a little bit away from you for a quick sunday arvo help lol. I'm out near gisborne.

[PeeBee]

Phil it would be best to get the new alternator then the pipe sizes and go to pirtek (or similar) with a list. What we done with marks was a back and forth till we found right fitting. The only issue was the oil drain which was a custom made jobby by the local pirtek in wodonga but it is something that could be made at home if your handy with a Oxy or something.

I'd be happy to help you with it but I am a little bit away from you for a quick sunday arvo help lol. I'm out near gisborne.

Thanks Mat, currently in Stanhope during the week. No flat out hurry as it still gets enough charge to keep things going. I need to do a quick check to ensure there is nothing wrong with the battery also, but the alternator was charging at circa 14.2- 14.3 when first put in, now 13.8 seems the limit.

[poindexter]

Will be the P400 with the uprated injector pump : DB2833-6284, and 6L90 as the transmission.
Just spoke to the VASS engineer, and it is all good for emissions compliance, much to my surprise.
The conversion will be done by "my guy", not Brunswick Diesel.

[PeeBee]

Will be the P400 with the uprated injector pump : DB2833-6284, and 6L90 as the transmission.
Just spoke to the VASS engineer, and it is all good for emissions compliance, much to my surprise.
The conversion will be done by "my guy", not Brunswick Diesel.

Excellent, look forward to hearing how the journey progresses!

[poindexter]

SWIMBO says, go and do it.....

[poindexter]

to all you 6.5 owners out there, is 1800rpm at 100kph ok? or should the rpm be lower or higher?

[MB]

Will be the P400 with the uprated injector pump : DB2833-6284, and 6L90 as the transmission. Just spoke to the VASS engineer, and it is all good for emissions compliance, much to my surprise. The conversion will be done by "my guy", not Brunswick Diesel.
Shit hot Ralph mate, can't wait to see you blokes work your magic on this :-) Reckon you might be the first P400 Patrol beast in the country with a super custom sump as discussed at AB's donk party mate.
For others benefit here, the P400 was the bulletproofed 6.5 having an entire additional cast girdle between the block and sump strengthening the hell out of em but obviously making them quite a deep donk potentially hitting diffs at full travel PeeBee GQ :-(

[MB]

to all you 6.5 owners out there, is 1800rpm at 100kph ok? or should the rpm be lower or higher?
Hey Ralph, according to the US military manual a stock rocket 6.5 achieves maximum torque @ 2,000rpm. I believe I have heard and read that around 1,800rpm or slightly lower is their most efficient highway speed. Mine being a 6.5NA manual and originally 3.9 diffs on 33's found that below 2,000rpm would suffer on 100kmph highway hills. I believe you're looking at a centre mount turbo and auto so would imagine you'll blast over the big hills.
FWIW, now running 35's through 4.3 diffs and still the manual box finds around 2,250rpm ish for me at 100kmph. If I bring it up to 2,500rpm @110kmph I loose 50km per 80L tank. Great for the mountain roads and tracks though:-)

[MB]

.....the alternator was charging at circa 14.2- 14.3 when first put in, now 13.8 seems the limit.
That and worse was exactly what I experienced Phil. In fairness the Mitsubishi alternator on mine was in for a few years with me and unsure of for how long before.
Very happy so far with your kindly advised GQ 170amp Ebay weapon. I foolishly drained my Aux Optima down to 10.5V with an electric blanket in the mountains recently and without proper documented tests seemed to be back up within an hour or two after departure next morning.

[nissannewby]

Edging ever closer to doing a 6.5 conversion.
Will probably make a call within a week or 2.
If this goes ahead, you all know what this means right?

cheers

Why has a duramax been ruled out? Have you looked at the allison transmission?

[MB]

SWIMBO may have set the coin limit @ a 6.5 poindexter :-) ? Ralph did have some serious knowledge on his preferred auto Matty, all well and truly over my manual stock gearbox head :-) !

[poindexter]

yes duramax was looked at and allison as well, both did not make the cut

[nissannewby]

yes duramax was looked at and allison as well, both did not make the cut

Obviously hence the question I asked which you didnt answer.
Was it a cost vs benefit, parts sourcing or something like that? Or purely a simplicity thing using something you know in the 6l90 with a basic engine?

[nissannewby]

SWIMBO may have set the coin limit @ a 6.5 poindexter :-) ? Ralph did have some serious knowledge on his preferred auto Matty, all well and truly over my manual stock gearbox head :-) !

Yes I would imagine so. He has some info on the other forum in regards to the transmission he has chosen. I think it was to be mounted to a different engine though.

[MB]

There is another Forum?? WTF @AB, how many do you have mate? Stop sheltering me :-) !

[poindexter]

coin was not the limiting factor with this swap, my years working at GM Powertrain has given me the knowledge to make an informed decision which I have made, that is all.....

[nissannewby]

Well thanks for the informative responses.

Did you ever get the zd30/6l90 conversion finished? If so what are your thoughts.

[poindexter]

finished as in driving the truck, no.
got all the parts made and booked the truck in for the work to be done, but then changed my mind regarding the engine at the last minute.
went to MB's donk party to see other 6.5s just to see the way the engine fits.
been following Rainsey's thread, and the thought of spending coin on the zd30 and still not getting acceptable performance was a consideration.

[the evil twin]

to all you 6.5 owners out there, is 1800rpm at 100kph ok? or should the rpm be lower or higher?

That is about what mine tonks along at (1850 ish is 100 ish but I sit a tad under) and it seems to be the sweet spot (33 inch tyres 3.9 diffs and 4L85 tranny).
When I put the 35's on it is def not as happy on the bitumen (runs a tad hotter and uses more fuel esp if the Van is attached).

But... mine is not a P400 and those Cobras' are pretty much a different critter entirely to the older 6.5's.

[PeeBee]

Peninsula Engineering in USA recently advised me the 'sweet spot was 1900rpm for best economy. This was also mentioned by the fuel injection guys in Bunbury who set the Standyne pumps up. Mine runs at 2000rpm with 3.9 gears and 32" tyres, so should be close to perfect when i upgrade to 33"

[poindexter]

my next question is : who is competent to tune and dyno the DB2 IP in the Melbourne area?
I have "viewed" the usual youtube stuff, but I'm guessing there is more to than that eh?

[MB]

Sorry Ralph mate, no idea personally :-(

Quick update on increasing oil volume to our undersized sumps IMHO and cooling folks. New bar has cleared the path for best to date radiator airflow. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/07/142.jpg
Oil coolers sourced/mentioned earlier are quite the tight squeeze but doable :-) http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/07/143.jpg GU headlights and a near comp bar/80mm chassis shorten make it a little trickier but again still doable :-) http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/07/144.jpg


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[PeeBee]

Sorry Ralph mate, no idea personally :-(

Quick update on increasing oil volume to our undersized sumps IMHO and cooling folks. New bar has cleared the path for best to date radiator airflow. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/07/142.jpg
Oil coolers sourced/mentioned earlier are quite the tight squeeze but doable :-) http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/07/143.jpg GU headlights and a near comp bar/80mm chassis shorten make it a little trickier but again still doable :-) http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/07/144.jpg


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Have you installed these coolers MB

[PeeBee]

SWIMBO says, go and do it.....

Ralph, has the journey started? Got any bits yet?

[MB]

Have you installed these coolers MB

Nah sorry mate, just been flat out lately. The passengers side still needs the PS cooler lines relocated first which is a pain but I'll get there eventually:-)
72530

[PeeBee]

Nah sorry mate, just been flat out lately. The passengers side still needs the PS cooler lines relocated first which is a pain but I'll get there eventually:-)
72530

I know, work is such an inconvenience at time! One thing for sure is you wont have oil over heating issues this weekend.

[poindexter]

Sorry for the delay, just got back from NT.
Journey has started, no bits yet.
I'll keep you posted

[MB]

Welcome back Ralph, safe n sound, great news :-) ! Didn't know you'd even crossed da border, for work or touring mate?

[poindexter]

Holidays, did the Ghan from Darwin to Adelaide, and other stuff as well.
Now primed to get on with "other" things.

[MB]

https://www.heathdiesel.com/?SID=b5f23b8288146a48492a4e83ce66e1ca

https://www.heathdiesel.com/65-turbo-diesel-performance-parts.html

https://youtu.be/XGwiqufycEk

https://youtu.be/aspymdlZBME

[PeeBee]

Swapped the two in-line Ryco filters today, replaced them with a single CAV glass bowl type. had to make a bracket to mount it, plus also a stone shield as it sits close to the floor but in front of the rear axle. Total install took about 4 hrs, but pre prime the filter first as the lift pump cannot pull thru two filters and neither will the booster pump suck fuel either. Frustrating next 3 hrs to resolve this 'little issue', but all good now, fitted with the 100W heater band as well, ready for the next snow trip!!! Oh plus the 1 hr to clean up all the diesel I dropped on the driveway. Mrs PeeBee not happy as she wanted a driver today to go - yep - cushion shopping - something really wrong with that woman I reckon.

[MB]

Good stuff Phil, will surely work a treat up there mate!
I reckon I'll need to go back to a leafy ute or somehow GVM upgrade the coily if you keep inspiring me with cracka idea add ons :-)

[PeeBee]

Good stuff Phil, will surely work a treat up there mate!
I reckon I'll need to go back to a leafy ute or somehow GVM upgrade the coily if you keep inspiring me with cracka idea add ons :-)

Just crank up the air pressure in those airbags, heaps of capacity for future 'essentials'

[PeeBee]

Good stuff Phil, will surely work a treat up there mate!
I reckon I'll need to go back to a leafy ute or somehow GVM upgrade the coily if you keep inspiring me with cracka idea add ons :-)

Just crank up the air pressure in those airbags, heaps of capacity for future 'essentials'

[MB]

I'm thinking you should kindly when time permits mate create a thread for snow proofing cars etc.. I'm sure our Northern Hemisphere members can also add true valuable life saving tips etc... I actually felt very lucky that my truck kept running on that weekend but will surely come undone oneday soon! My concerns were so much that as you know I packed up basecamp daily and carried everything needed even on the supposedly 2-3 hr sight seeing trips out just in case :-)

[PeeBee]

Ok will give that some thought. Our conditions are probably a lot milder than our northern hemisphere buddies, so think they will value add the most. For me the trick is keeping the fuel temp above the parra fin drop out temp. As mentioned in another post I will be adding a fuel tank heater pad or two. They are so cheap and crazy not to take the precaution especially when you see how much time can be lost getting going. I dropped the manufacturer of the fuel additiv a line and explained our difficulties, but still waiting on a response.

[MB]

There is a slim possibility that my softy bedroom heater may double up and warm the tank below, lol :-) : http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/08/279.jpghttp://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/08/280.jpgSerious concerns though for midway mounted steel lift pump though :-(


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[MB]

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/08/281.jpg Zero snow on the whole tray canopy warmish area maybe?


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[PeeBee]

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/08/281.jpg Zero snow on the whole tray canopy warmish area maybe?


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For sure, incredible. I am not so concerned about the lift pump right now, and have looked at the options for heat tracing the lines but not that easy as they duck and weave along the chassis, plus change materials from steel to rubber. I think if the tank is warm, the rear filter is warm, front filter warm, then the fuel should flow. What's interesting is the other guys didn't have any problems and didn't do much more than the Powerplus product from what I understand, so that's a bit baffling. Anyway I reckon my setup will suffice, and unless I get the chance soon, will have wait until next year to find out.

[Rossco]

Ok will give that some thought. Our conditions are probably a lot milder than our northern hemisphere buddies, so think they will value add the most. For me the trick is keeping the fuel temp above the parra fin drop out temp. As mentioned in another post I will be adding a fuel tank heater pad or two. They are so cheap and crazy not to take the precaution especially when you see how much time can be lost getting going. I dropped the manufacturer of the fuel additiv a line and explained our difficulties, but still waiting on a response.Yeah sounds like a good idea I recon, a dedicated artic proof thread. It was cold but pretty mild in comparison to some conditions people have to deal with.

Pain in the butt having to deal with fuel issues seeing as diesels are usually so reliable, will be keen to see what the response from the additive manufacturer is and wonder if anyone out there has had different experiences with different brands etc or there's some thing else you can use, kero I heard maybe ? . . .

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[poindexter]

So.....

After weeks of nothing, there has been movement of sorts.
The "engine" is due to be shipped "next week", was held up due to Greg wanting to put a 300hp injector pump on it.
Apparently I need to look at putting a "big" exhaust on it and an "upgraded" airbox.
Hopefully, things will be moving come spring.....oh crap, that's friday.
On a positive note, the intake manifold has arrived.

[poindexter]

Just got the email from TNT, engine arrives Tuesday.
I'll post some pics next weekend.....it begins.

[MB]

Great news Ralph mate, can't wait for the pics!
Did you end up buying a P400 beast?

[poindexter]

yep, it's a P400

[poindexter]

Believe it or not, this is a P400
And I specifically said, no vac pump too......

73195
73196

[poindexter]

Here are some more pics. the last one shows the bed plate of the P400.

731977319873199

[PeeBee]

OK, filled up truck and went for a spin to gauge the new brake pads and also get some fuel use figures from the fuel computer.

Consumption figures in LPHR

Idle - 500rpm - 1.4

80km/hr, 4th gear - 11.6

100km/hr 5th gear 2000rpm freeway (cruise control on)- 14.3

Max instantaneous flowrate under hard acceleration was 58LPHR, which aligns with the guys in WA who set the pumps up - they said 60LPHR WOT, but I am only revving to 3K, not 3500.

Idle EGT - 70 deg C, max egt under acceleration to 100KMHR 525 Deg C

Ambient temps 15 Deg C, Radiator temp 'ON' 72Deg C, OFF 60 DEG C, Oil temps similar On and OFF temps.

The 'devices' are supplied by Topargee. The actual PLC is identical to the unit used by Scintex. The flowmeters are a lower range than the Scintex units - mine are 0.1LPHR - 100LPHR range. The Scintex flowmeters are 5-600LPHR in their kit and were out of range for my flow rates. There are 2 flowmeters required, one after the filter and before the injector pump and one on the return line back to the tank. System runs on 12VDC.

The unit displays flow rate to the engine, return flowrate to the tank, calculates the consumed flow volume,(these are totalised volumes and can be zero'd by a couple of keystrokes) and also deducts the used fuel from the nominated tank volume. Flicking to another screen gives you the instantaneous figures for flow IN and OUT and consumed volume. These instantaneous values zero each time the vehicle starts up also.

New brake pads pull the beast up a lot quicker, guess maybe 15%- 20%, and feel is heaps better with the softer pads. Life of the pads is not an issue as the truck probably does 5K max a year, some years none.

[the evil twin]

Some of those P400 pics are screaming "supercharger bolts on here" to me...

[PeeBee]

Some of those P400 pics are screaming "supercharger bolts on here" to me...

I think he is going turbo

[the evil twin]

I think he is going turbo

Fair 'nuf... mines turbo'd (not a P400 tho) but I'd supercharge it in a heart beat and put twin exhausts at the rear wheels.

[poindexter]

Hmmmm supercharge, hmmmmm turbo.....

[MB]

Not sure how much truths in this clip but if I had a P400 Ralph :-) https://youtu.be/-hoZZpxYfXE
http://www.bulletcars.com/superchargers/chevrolet/chev-6.5-litre-diesel-supercharger-system.html

[poindexter]

much prefer this one with built in intercooler.
73312

[MB]

Nice mate, what is that a Whipple?

[the evil twin]

Nice mate, what is that a Whipple?

No MB, its a Supercharger... like a Turbocharger only better

(Damn I'm a funny guy... you blokes should pay me to be here... $'s or rooftop bags either will do)

[Touses]

No MB, its a Supercharger... like a Turbocharger only better

(Damn I'm a funny guy... you blokes should pay me to be here... $'s or rooftop bags either will do)

Incorrect as usual. MB a whipple is a noise a person with a hare lip makes when they're trying to attract your attention.

(Jeez, Jerry Lewis has shuffled 'n' ET thinks he's gettin' the gig)

[the evil twin]

Incorrect as usual. MB a whipple is a noise a person with a hare lip makes when they're trying to attract your attention.

(Jeez, Jerry Lewis has shuffled 'n' ET thinks he's gettin' the gig)

So kinda like a Pharp but a Whipple doesn't smell as bad and is higher pitched?

[Touses]

So kinda like a Pharp but a Whipple doesn't smell as bad and is higher pitched?

That's it! In extreme cases can be as wet as a pharp but unlikely to become as messy or rancid. So glad we've cleared that up!

[MB]

You blokes are terrible:-)
Art Whipple wouldn't approve!

[Touses]

You blokes are terrible:-)
FArt Whipple wouldn't approve!

Fixed it for ya

[the evil twin]

You blokes are terrible:-)
Pharp Whipple wouldn't approve!

You give us the ammo... we'll keep shooting

[PeeBee]

Guys, further compilation of fuel use on a 300k trio, used 48 liters. 200k of that was at 100km/hr freeway and the remainder a mix of windy gear swapping roads and perhaps 5k of 4wd'ing. So average consumption works out at 6.25kilometer/litre, or 16l/100klm.

Vehicle sits at 100klm/hr and 2000rpm and hovers around 15.5 l/100klm. I am happy with this as currently sitting at 3600kgs vehicle weight and aerodynamics of a barn. This is a heap improvement on the 2.8TD I had in before the engine swap, it would deliver numbers around the 28-30/100klm.

EGT's sit around the 250-ish mark cruising along

[poindexter]

Good info that.
Just curious , where is your EGT probe positioned?, near the head, or further away?

[PeeBee]

Good info that.
Just curious , where is your EGT probe positioned?, near the head, or further away?

I have a probe installed on each header, or actually as close to the header as I could get it which is say 100mm downstream of the 'factory' header, where it joins the exhaust pipe. Any closer and it would have been a nightmare to get in. I use SAAS gauges and had the thermocouples tested by an instrument tech in his 'hot box' and confirmed the readings are correct for what is displayed. There are two probes and 2 gauges for total clarity. Response is very quick and more than adequate for what I wanted, which was actively managing the EGT's via driving style.

[MB]

Kindly received some pics today from http://www.blitsbodykits.com.au/ for the GU Supercharger bonnets if anyone needs raised rainsey Cheers mate!
I believe this one below is for GU4 and onwards: http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/10/21.jpg I believe this one below is for earlier: http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/10/22.jpg
Wendy there was very helpful so give em a call if you GU blokes need.


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[MB]

Whoops forgot, they are ADR approved apparently with test certificates and each has its own specific registration number for your engineers needs was told.

[PeeBee]

I am considering swapping over to the Evans Waterless Coolant. I rang BD yesterday to find out the system volume and the number is 18 litres. Almost fell over. So the 20l of flush will be $379 and then 20L of coolant another $379

[MB]

And another 20L for $379 to carry as spare for when we accidentally stab a bottom end hose up in the hills mate :-)

[PeeBee]

Funny enough you can top it up with water, which i dont understand how that works if you have to purge the water from the system to begin with. I suspect the risk would be minimal anyway as never had an issue with hoses so far. Anyway its on the backburner for now.

[MB]

That is weird wow, just water top up for emergencies maybe? We could always carry 5L each on a 4 car convoy too mate!

[the evil twin]

Funny enough you can top it up with water, which i dont understand how that works if you have to purge the water from the system to begin with. I suspect the risk would be minimal anyway as never had an issue with hoses so far. Anyway its on the backburner for now.

Which then costs another 397 for a purge and a further 397 for new coolant as you have to dump the old stuff as it is contaminated...

[PeeBee]

Which then costs another 397 for a purge and a further 397 for new coolant as you have to dump the old stuff as it is contaminated...

I know, its sounds daft to me. I am going to ring one of their agents and ask the question.

[PeeBee]

MIXING COOLANTS
Waterless and water-based coolants should not be mixed. In the event that significant
waterless coolant is lost from the system during operation and no waterless coolant is
available to fill the system and reach a repair facility, water-based coolant or water may be
used. However, repairs should be made as soon as possible, and the system should be
drained, purged and re-filled with new waterless coolant

This is from their website, so yes a leak can be expensive or you carry a bottle of the stuff. There is another 'synthetic water free coolant avail but no specs on their website regards boiling points at all.

[mudnut]

I did read that the waterless stuff is able to work with a certain % of water as its very hard to remove all of the water in the system, even with a flush. I also wonder how good this stuff is for the environment?

[PeeBee]

Who cares - you shouldn't be running it with a leaking system unless you are Richard Branson, so really it doesn't come into the equation in my view. If you look at all the other lubricants in your vehicle none of them will aid the expansion of a remote platypus population, so toxic or not, simply another fluid which is treated with respect.

I agree with your comment about the efficiency as its nigh on impossible to remove all the water unless you go to a heap of trouble like draining, blowing thru with high volume/low pressure air and then maybe heating the block or blowing hot air thru to dry it out. There is no indication of the cooling efficiency drop per % of water either - doubt they even know. I am going to have a look at the other 'product' with 'nano particles etc etc blah b;ah blah' and see if I can find a product that is cheaper to swap with better cooling properties than the glycol mixes.

[mudnut]

Who cares.

I do, to an extent. I have built a solar evaporator out of old solar water heaters, to process any used coolant from my vehicles (who's a good boy?)

I was thinking more of contamination around the home and the like.

I discounted using the waterless coolant, because I have to change out the timing belt every 100000 ks.

[PeeBee]

I do, to an extent. I have built a solar evaporator out of old solar water heaters, to process any used coolant from my vehicles (who's a good boy?)

I was thinking more of contamination around the home and the like.

I discounted using the waterless coolant, because I have to change out the timing belt every 100000 ks. Not a problem for your machine , though.

Craig, I take your point. I am pretty careful with leaking fluid here as well. When you evaporate the coolant, whats the residue and what do you do with it? The coolant is ideally collected and recycled for use as its life is stated as 'for the life of the vehicle. i recognise its difficult to catch everything, plus when it is removed it needs to be kept in an airtight vessel as its hydroscopic.

[nissannewby]

Waterless coolant wont make it run cooler.

Keep in mind the other aspects of a cooling system. No point in raising the boiling temperature to levels that you engine is already damaged at. Also keep in mind increasing boiling point or any temperature will increase system pressure so you are still at factory limits unless a high psi cap is used.

For the most part the glycol or coolant is mostly for corrosion protection. While it does help with temperature properties so does a pressurised system so they work hand in hand. The coolant, water or even the "waterless" coolant is only a median to carry the heat to the heat exchanger. At best you might get 12 degrees differential across a radiator. So if any other part of the system is not coping it is not really the coolant at fault.

[mudnut]

It usually leaves a very minimal crust of rusty powder. I've just kept adding to it. After 5 years I maybe have 1/2 a litre of residue.

And yes. Collecting all the coolant is almost impossible for an RB30.

[PeeBee]

Waterless coolant wont make it run cooler.

Keep in mind the other aspects of a cooling system. No point in raising the boiling temperature to levels that you engine is already damaged at. Also keep in mind increasing boiling point or any temperature will increase system pressure so you are still at factory limits unless a high psi cap is used.

For the most part the glycol or coolant is mostly for corrosion protection. While it does help with temperature properties so does a pressurised system so they work hand in hand. The coolant, water or even the "waterless" coolant is only a median to carry the heat to the heat exchanger. At best you might get 12 degrees differential across a radiator. So if any other part of the system is not coping it is not really the coolant at fault.

Agree with what you say matt, the focus is elimination of the vapour which causes both erosion and also inhibits the thermal transfer. I get around the 10 - 12 deg across the radiator as you suggest. i don't for a minute expect it to make the vehicle run cooler, more have a liquid that remains stable at the elevated temperatures. I have not checked what pressure the supplied radiator cap is as its not a nissan unit, but fair point. Whats stopping this right now is the double dip cost of conditioning the engine to remove the water, then filling with the high temp coolant. Its a big cost with a marginal gain, however I think its worth chasing to be honest.

[MB]

poindexter Ralph mate, any updates/progress. Super keen to please see a Vic-P400 out here pioneer good man ;-)


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[poindexter]

The situation thus far is, truck goes in after I come back from a week away during November.
I have spoken to said conversion dude, and all ducks have been lined up.
Just waiting for the end of November to come around.
I've inspected the exhaust manifolds, they are very restrictive, Brunswick Diesel recommends extractors and a 4" exhaust for the P400, we'll see what can fit.

[MB]

Looking forward to it mate, can hardly wait for sure! 4” exhausts and a deep P400 super tough girdle down there squeezed in will be awesome:-) Safe Travels !!


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[MB]

Possibly the slowest modification ever I’ve undertaken, quick update though. Finally found/purchased a suitably sized ‘Davies Craig-Hydro Cool’ http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/11/29.jpg Made for autos but hoping this will suffice on the old 1999 power steering coolers and hard lines removal to make way for the twin Serco oil coolers install thereafter.


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[PeeBee]

Mark, check your system pressure on both sides of the pump. These fittings are hose clamp style by the looks of it, and I think the ones you have now are crimped. I think the supply pressure is around 1300psi from memory - from my earlier investigations on nissan Patrol PS pumps and drivers for the MileMarker winch. I think these things are designed for a very moderate low side pressure - others may know more of course but worth it to check before blowing a hose especially when loaded up against a rock ledge.

[MB]

Thanks mate :-) ! The current hard lines (stock GU believed) are sectioned in places along by factory flared to rubber with only worse than hose clamps, (those crappy steel plier compress release jobbies) :-(


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[matfew]

Coolers are all on the low pressue side from what I have seem in most cars Phil. Never seen any finned heat transfer unit in a car capable of holding much more then 20psi haha.

[PeeBee]

Coolers are all on the low pressue side from what I have seem in most cars Phil. Never seen any finned heat transfer unit in a car capable of holding much more then 20psi haha.

Yes agree, but you never know!!!

[MB]

Have removed now the stock PS coolers and stock lines that were in my way for new oil coolers. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/11/36.jpg The new Davies Craig Hydro Cool for PS cooler replace/relocate has fitted in behind the winch beautifully. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/11/37.jpg Best part has being able to use both of the original PS cooler brackets with only a bit of bending work needed. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/11/38.jpg Did have to make a quick third bracket to support the underside though. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/11/39.jpg All clear on both sides of the truck now to get back onto the 6.5L twin oil cooler project before summer hits! http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/11/40.jpg http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/11/41.jpg


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[MB]

In the spirit of Christmas spending have today sent to QLD my VIN & Rego & M/C details for certified registered production start on a ‘Blitz’ new GU bonnet. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/11/243.jpghttp://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/11/244.jpghttp://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/11/245.jpg They are kindly including in delivery the front scoop cut out piece so I can play around with hinging and a decent choke type cable for deeper river crossings in theory :-) !


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[PeeBee]

Why do they need your rego number? Can understand vin.

[MB]

Unsure old mate, can only imagine it gets listed on their paperwork handover for me to carry I believe said?


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[nissannewby]

So they can supply you with a recordable certificate.

[PeeBee]

Is this for mod registration in the various states or is the bonnet design 'approved' ? I will ask them tomorrow when I call about one for mine if you don't have the answer

[PeeBee]

poindexter might be interested it this also as it looks like you get a bit more engine clearance also?

[MB]

Again unsure good blokes, now starting to worry a little:-(
Wendy there has been fantastic over the last few months and kindly refused multiple times my reshaping custom requests. If not kept standard mould design they were breaking their current structural integrity design as ADR tested/certified I do believe?


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[PeeBee]

It will be fine, you just not be able to drive on the road with it!!! Only jokin'

[MB]

At least it is made of Fibreglass-ish, let’s see who pops the Mansfield Candy Cars scales first old mate ;-) Only jokin’ :-) !!!


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[PeeBee]

Do those clowns put vehicles on the scales as well? If so I definitely will be steering clear

[PeeBee]

OK, rang supplier and bonnets are ADR approved in all states and territories of Australia. VIN and reg required for certificate as Nissannewby stated last night, no bonnet avail for GQ but can be done. A single mould would cost 4k but if an order is placed for 5 bonnets cost reduces to circ 1k plus shipping. They need a GQ bonnet for a mould. This new bonnet would also be fully adr compliant. I might go this way, will appraise on the effect MB gets out of his. Mu bonnet gills are yet to be really proven as the vehicle overheated last weekend due to a faulty viscous coupling and shroud design deficiency due to the change in fan blade installed after my exploding fan blade on trip previous to this.

[Hodge]

The bonnet scoop from Cross country also arrived with a certificate . Which is now laminated and sitting in the car .


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[MB]

I was quite impressed with the shipping charge being only $136 QLD <> VIC , $0.08pkm is pretty fair I reckon for a big awkward bonnet!


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[Winnie]

Sorry MB I haven't been keeping up, but what are you hoping to gain from this flash looking bonnet?

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[MB]

Bigger under bonnet air space mate for the Chev’s summer heat and looking to direct some flow onto multiple alternators. The 170amp pimped up GQ single alt spasmodically let me down in the hills last weekend. Looking to go say 2x 120amp jobbies squeezed under there is the theory:-)


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[PeeBee]

Hey @MB, was stuffing around under the bonnet again today after resurrecting the difflock compressor assy and started into the endless air project to fit the pump. Anyway, after a bit of heartache, decided to go the path of running a jack shaft and driving the compressor similar to how you are thinking of doing your alternators. Couple of differen739267392773928739267392773928t versions later believe I have a winner and brackets are all on top of the engine instead of under it, so a bonus. Photos show concept. Bonnet shuts without a problem. Sure its tight but it will work well.

[MB]

Ripper mate!! Will have to get back to you bro, weather hatches need battening down here :-)


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[PeeBee]

Ripper mate!! Will have to get back to you bro, weather hatches need battening down here :-)


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Sunny and 26 over here!

[MB]

Back on deck for now mate, apologies!
I’ve always been worried about bearing mods added, how does us do for longevity?



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[PeeBee]

Not a problem, keep them lubricated and make sure they are set up 'aligned' and won't have an issue. The units i am looking at at are 'brown dog' PA204 housings and 3/4" self aligning bearings. Bearing cost $6 each, so you an carry a couple of spares as well. You want bearings, not bushes as the speeds will be too high. The UC204 bearing is a ball race and fitted with seals will be fine. My assy will have a belt that slips on and off as the endless air does not need to be used all the time. I still have the ARB difflock compressor for the difflocks, and endless air for tyres and tools.

[MB]

Happy Days Mate :-) !


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[matfew]

What happened to the alternator @MB


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[MB]

My current setup demanded too much of it mate :-( The Thursday night coming down Dingo Hill it decided to stop pushing out any more than 12.1/2ish volts. Shut everything off and tip toed down to camp on low beam lights only. Magically it came back to life Sunday morning after idling for a few minutes. Phil had kindly topped up all my batteries to 100% all day Saturday jumped off his truck and monster solar panels.


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[PeeBee]

My current setup demanded too much of it mate :-( The Thursday night coming down Dingo Hill it decided to stop pushing out any more than 12.1/2ish volts. Shut everything off and tip toed down to camp on low beam lights only. Magically it came back to life Sunday morning after idling for a few minutes. Phil had kindly topped up all my batteries to 100% all day Saturday jumped off his truck and monster solar panels.


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Have you totalled all your current loads with everything going? Bear in mind most automotive alternators are rated at a 5% duty cycle, that is max nameplate current for 5% - primarily aimed at fast input after starting into the start battery. Your 170amp unit is likely the same. I suspect you may be looking at an entirely different beast to the run of the mill units.

Check out this link to Unipower. The Jumbo is interesting and these are 100% duty cycle rated. I had one for a while then sold it as was not using it.

http://www.unipower.co.za/spec-sheets/unipower-products-download.pdf

They are dear, but if you dont want the 240V or the welded capacity I am sure you could buy just the alternator. Take note though of the HP required to run it. Mine had double 'A' section and they needed to be tight as when the alternator is generating the 200amps + the belts know it.

[MB]

Thanks Phil, looks like a beast of an alternator mate, will have to check it out at work one day soon on the bigger screen, Cheers!


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[PeeBee]

More or less sorted out the config for the endless air compressor. Mounted the baseplate across the inlet manifold valley, then configured the bearings, shaft and finally the pivot mount for the compressor itself. Off to Total Tools for belts early next week then weld it up, and start the config of the air receiver tank739637396473965 assy - no idea where that is going to fit!

[PeeBee]

OK, finished the endless air compressor instal today - what a journey. I will work on fine-tuning the front belt alignment, but its all in and pumping air out the discharge port. I have the air receiver and manifold block, so all thats needed is to sort out where the tank will go - probably going to sort out the Brown Davis belly tank first, then see what space is left - getting a bit crowde7404674045d under the vehicle. With bonnet closed the pulley just touches the bonnet vent, so a couple of mm taken off locally with the dremel and happy days. Very tight installation, mount bracket is made in hell and took approx 20 hrs of design then I reckon 40 hrs to manufacture as everything had to be put in place then measured, taken off, trial fitted, changed where needed x 50, frustrating but a good result.

[PeeBee]

@MB, what did you end up running for your 'high temp hose' between the air compressor and tank? Also how long was the hose approx - I am reading 2m minimun/

[MB]

Original installation had the ARB standard flexy braided rubber hose (approximately 0.5m) connected to the little locker tank and not the compressor as they were too far apart. All I ended up doing was swapping the braided rubber back to compressor side where the heat is and upgraded all other plastic lines to a chunkier PP I think it is. The two blowouts I experienced before were both within 100-150mm from compressor and on the thinner harder plastic Airbag Man lines installed. All seems fine now after last trips running compressor flat out, fingers crossed!


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[the evil twin]

Yeah, I've had one blowout so far... about 3 inches from the Compressor.
Mine has a joiner about 2 feet from the Compressor and since that blowout I carry a spare hose (that thin hard placcy shit) made up.
I suspect the joiner is there 'cause the prev owner had blowout issues but he used the Air heaps more than me as it was a true work ute for him.
If it blows on a regular basis I'll change to better hose as well, just too lazy at the moment

[PeeBee]

Thanks Guys, I will mount the tank then decide which way I go. Air on Board sell 750mm and 1500mm braided outer high temp rubber hoses but they are dear, $50 - 80 each, plus they also sell a non return valve kit with the hose as this is required to limit back pressure on the compressor. Anyway, just somethiong else to think about on the never ending journey of getting the truck set up.

[MB]

FWIW just scribbled out a mud map of my current air system reworks still underway. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/12/127.jpg
The water separator/filter you kindly assisted with Phil is essential IMHO. All points on the map coloured ‘red’ are still needing upgrades. Previously running air without filtration has caused corrosion on both the inside of the crappy ARB locker tank and my silly purchase of a ‘steel’ under tray chassis tank. Rust proof tanks will be required one day and further line upgrades needed too in ‘red’ also. Thinking about adding in some isolation taps around the truck too just in case. Tyre valves are needed too near each air bag in case I may need to manually pump up off another convoy member if the system ever goes down completely.


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[PeeBee]

Ah, looks like about as complicated as you can make it - excellent stuff!!!! Heaps of functionality and versatility though. Like the idea of the redundancy point regards emergency pump up by others.

[PeeBee]

Ah, looks like about as complicated as you can make it - excellent stuff!!!! Heaps of functionality and versatility though. Like the idea of the redundancy point regards emergency pump up by others. Anything downstream of the reservoir can be 'cheapish' as long as it handles the pressure. temp in not a factor after the receiver. On your spare port marked 'external air port' I would look at a dump valve, so at the end of the day you can get rid of any moisture that has accumulated in the tank downstream of the water seperator and clear the lines totally for extreme cold weather stuff.Air On Board have a cheap dump valve circa $15 from memory that would do the trick, see here

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Drain-valve-tank-004-ARB-Endless-Air-TJM-on-board-air/302364764689?hash=item4666582a11:g:zbYAAOSwrfVZUxz 5

[MB]

Sweet thanks mate! Yeah the 20L tank does already have a drain/dump valve in the lowest part. Have been meaning to add a full dump lever type valve on the spare external side port for tyre bead blasting. Currently it’s just an ARB push in jobbie that still restricts air dump somewhat and also sh1ts me that only ARB air hose can be used! So...my idea is for a lever ball type valve prior to a larger Nitto type fitting.


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[PeeBee]

Tyre bead seating, think this would need a big port? I have always fitted a tube after getting a puncture, never tried a fully tubeless refit.

[MB]

https://youtu.be/FZGvAqqlm7U
Much safer than using explosive aerosols! Key seems to be removing the tyres valve also.
To be honest I doubt I’ll ever need it as most of us carry the same size/brand spares up there :-)


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[the evil twin]

You pair have me thinking (and drinking) which makes my head hurt...

"TPC" is used by the millions of metres in industry pneumatics so maybe the blowouts are due to a combo of really hot ambient air from the engine bay getting drawn thru the compressor and superheated.
The place it blows out seems to be right near the Comp.

Water traps in mine are the usual water condensate drain valve in the bottom of the 20 litre tank and a low press air reg when I get around to fitting it.
Was thinking of putting one in the Tank supply line now I've seen MBs sketch but curious regards efficiency as the air will be hot as #@$%.
Dump valve won't work for water on the air supply port as it is centred but would def be an idea for the drain port

Rear air bag setup is overly complicated IMHO and will maybe cause heartache.
Maybe better to 'tee' the inflation/deflation lines close to the bags as you want the same pressure in them anyway
Indeed, I don't quite see the point of being able to adjust either side individually from the cab but pressure gauge in cab is a good idea.
Air bags (ride levelling not full air suspension) are recommended to be inflated prior to loading by some manuf.
Mine run two lines about a metre long to the check valves which are right beside my Charge Air point on the side of the tray.
My Supply is a standard line about a metre long (if that) from the Tank Supply Port to the Charge Air Valve.
I carry a little placcy box of M to F and F to M charge air fitting adapters so I can use ARB, Ryco, Qwikfit etc

Why don't you run the lockers and 240 Volt Air from/to the 20 litre tank?
That would give you a 15 metre airline for tyre inflation off 240 or Onboard supply.

Run a standard size air line and Tyre bead reseating shouldn't be a problem off the 20 litre tank.
You should always pull the valve out.
A bit of detergent or somesuch on the loose bead always helps as well.
Ratchet strap, rope, whatever will makes a 'tourniquet effect' all but make 100% certain the tyre will seat.
I can vaguely remember the old man doing tractor tyres on the farm with a bit of chain and a chain dog thingy.

Right... back to the Beer

[MB]

Top stuff ET !
Yeah I’m not too stressed about the remaining ‘TPC’ as it is well away from the heat source now.
It was originally connected directly into the compressor where it blew out twice.
My recently installed water filter thingy is about 1.5m along the line on the rear inside wall of the extra cab which is quite easy to see what’s occurring in its little glass bowl.
Rear air bags being separated/adjustable L/R are truly awesome for scary off angle mountain tracks and make levelling my ute bedroom a piece of cake at camp each night :-)
I do definitely need a little box of fitting adapters like your top idea!
Lockers and Tyre air do actually come from the 20L tank just my crappy drawing shows them connecting closer to the filter :-(
In regards engine bay heat, all my setup is inside the extra cab but is still amazing the temps that come out of the ARB twin, finger burning stuff!
Detergent sounds like a great idea for blasting assistance! I do remember TD kindly posting once also that his tyre bloke used something like a big rubber ring band that pops off once the seat is made.
Nearly home from work, will join you for a brew soon too ;-)


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[the evil twin]

Detergent is what a lot of old school tyre fitters use... don't need much.
Most 'camping patrols' usually have some around IE hand wash, dish wash, shampoo, swedish backpackerrrrr.... uuummmm... better leave it there

'Big Rubber Ring' I have heard of but not personally seen in action https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SebAXOA76Gc
Still needs some lube anyway and IIRC they are goddam expensive for a bushy once in a blue moon back of the Trol use.
Which is why I have heard of people using bike inner tubes for the same purpose I spose

[MB]

PMSL :-)
Bike inner tube is a great idea, would pack away heaps easier too!


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[MB]

FWIW pics below are far from a perfect setup but quite happy for now.
L/R on air rear controls and gauges on pillar pod, easily reached standing outside in the paddock too. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/12/130.jpg
Rear extra cab wall mounted gadgets with compressor and third battery below false floor. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/12/131.jpg


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[the evil twin]

PMSL :-)
Bike inner tube is a great idea, would pack away heaps easier too!


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Hehehehe...

I reckon I have that exact same pressure reg as you going by the piccies

I haven't bothered with a bike tube as I know the ratchet strap works (been there done that) but a mate at work said he has seen it done and reckons it worked a treat (can't puncture a ratchet strap tho).
We do a LOT of beach stuff for work and have often discussed what to have on board in case we roll a couple of beads on the same day as we only carry one spare.

[MB]

PeeBee Phil mate, ET does make a good very possible point about our Chev/Trol engine bay ambient heat intake possibly setting off a super heated outgoing situation. FWIW if it were me I’d go the 1.5m braided rubber tough line out for the extra $30 for peace of mind! Maybe even look at having the intake plumbed into say the cab/dash area? It does ‘suck’ when airlines ‘blow’ out there on relax time :-(


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[the evil twin]

FWIW my air compressor and inlet is, like, 30 cms from the Turbo

A while back I was looking at running it from the Air Box to get cooler air but laziness won out
High temp hose for the win I reckon :-)

[PeeBee]

Thanks Guys,

I am going to take the air from the clean side of the air filter, and run the airline from the compressor in the high temp braid. I want to mount and configure the receiver first to ensure the high temp line is long enough. I ran the compressor this morning and for the first 5 minutes, with basically no back pressure on the compressor, the air was cool. but after it ran for another 16 minutes the temps rose to warm, so even not working, the compressor internals are transferring heat quite easily.

I found the scrapping of pulleys was actually the nose pulley and the hit point was the bonnet, so I swapped the 3" driven pulley to a 2" driven and all good, actually improves the compressor drive speed.

[MB]

Sounds good Cheers Philstar!
Being that you great blokes are running tops Endless-Air Chev donk driven rippers would plumbing into the engine intake side of your NA Donaldson cause any flow/pressure issues mate? I can’t imagine so but unsure of ‘Endless Airs’ intake needs if any mate?


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[MB]

Hold my beer, let’s all plumb their air intakes into our in-cab vent system to take up crisp aircon flow ;-)


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[PeeBee]

Sounds good Cheers Philstar!
Being that you great blokes are running tops Endless-Air Chev donk driven rippers would plumbing into the engine intake side of your NA Donaldson cause any flow/pressure issues mate? I can’t imagine so but unsure of ‘Endless Airs’ intake needs if any mate?


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No problems. It is the preferred way by the manufacturer. Won't affect airflow in any way. I have no idea what your following post means - you win again Mark.

[MB]

Apologies mate, only meant that we should all think about having compressor air intake lines dragging from the coolest/driest known locations in our Trol/Hybrid old faithful combos:-)


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[PeeBee]

OK, finished the additional oil cooler installation today. I specifically went for this extruded aluminium format as its robust, easy to clean and has great heat transfer characteristics. The unit also holds another 2L of oil, so helps with the overall sump capacity that is tiny on the Chev. All up cost was circa $150 for the cooler and $120 for the hose and fittings from Pirtek. I will be installing an open area perf sheet guard to protect from the burn hazard. Can't say how it works yet as typical Melb, went from 28 Deg and sultry to 17 deg and thunderstorms in 4 hrs, so will have to wait. I used a hose and fitting combination that does not require hose clamps, rated at circa 450psi from memory for this application.7408674085

The clearance is approx 100mm above the winch rope and with the UV cover folded back, its easy to monitor the rope spool pattern as well. Lastly, the unit is 450mm long x 130mm wide x 75mm high, all aluminium extrusion, single pass flow. Total cooling length is 900mm.

[MB]

PeeBee mate, they are a very cool looking extrusion, pardon the pun! Any chance you could kindly sketch out a side view of what its guts would look like so I can wrap my head around this great looking new system! Having troubles in my little noggin imagining its internal workings, Cheers mate!


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[the evil twin]

Same but different http://www.partzfinder.com/22_Extruded_Aluminum_Transmission_Oil_Cooler_p/pce-3405.htm

[PeeBee]

Here you go. I was chasing a similar unit advertised in the US that was 700mm long, would have been a perfect fit between the ARB bullbar rails, but it is no longer made, distributors in both Aust and USA refused to allow me to make direct contact, which is a shane, but thats business i guess. The extrusion is very neat and the internal fins are a critical part of the system. I have seen others without the fins and am sure they would not be as efficient.74088

[MB]

Awesome gents, double Cheers!!


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[PeeBee]

OK, took the beast out to see what impact the oil coolers have. Its a mild day, circa 22 degC. Temps are into and out-of the cooling loop. Cruising around in 80kmhr traffic in the suburbs.

Water radiator - 76 degC in, 60 degC out

Oil cooler - 74 degC in, 40 degC out

Having full airflow onto the oil cooler fins without obstruction works well, very happy with outcome.

[the evil twin]

OK, took the beast out to see what impact the oil coolers have. Its a mild day, circa 22 degC. Temps are into and out-of the cooling loop. Cruising around in 80kmhr traffic in the suburbs.

Water radiator - 76 degC in, 60 degC out

Oil cooler - 74 degC in, 40 degC out

Having full airflow onto the oil cooler fins without obstruction works well, very happy with outcome.

Niiiiice... good result cobber.

I've been thinking of doubling the cooler on mine but might rrsehole to old rad style and put in one similar to yours.

Where did you source the Cooler from?

[PeeBee]

Ebay, link below. Its the longest unit I could find. Could not locate the manufacturers either. It is 100% possible to run a pair of these as the inlets are 1/4" bspp threads and improve on this result perhaps. I run this unit in series with the existing unit. I don't like the existing unit as the air does not go thru it, more it sheds heat by air flowing over th front surface and radiates heat onto the a/c coil in front of the new BD radiator.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/172470320667?ssPageName=STRK:MESINDXX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1436.l2649

[MB]

Damn you Phil, looks like a ripper outcome! Nearly halving the oil temps on a single pass must be a cracker design mate, truly well done :-) !! With such awesome efficiency found today do you think installing oil thermostats for next years snow trips might be back on the cards? My Serco radiator style jobbies and yanky Derale oil TS are all still staring at me on the shed shelf and now I’m totally lost as how to move forward or restart :-(


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[PeeBee]

I will have to defer to Brunswick Diesel on that one as they have told me not to go that route as they have had 3 vehicles return to them with problems, attributed to the temp flow modules. I know we are talking about the exact opposite circumstances, however, if the oil is designed to lubricate at these temps, and you are only doing this duty of service once or twice a year, I am not convinced you have a need for them. From last years snow dump trip I found the vehicle was up to operating temp in around 5 minutes of fast idle. Remember you have a 160kw combustion process generating heat and the oil will get hot. Temp gauges are notoriously inaccurate and certainly in those sorts of conditions we all warm the engine up before putting it under load. Regards your additional radiators, for me, in the spot you are going to mount them, you may have problems with keeping them mud and water/dust free on the summer trips, not to mention winter trips when they could ball up completely. I find the wings of my bullbar accumulates mud with a vengeance from the front tyres. I went this extrusion profile as they can be cleaned with a stick, and located mine out in the open for great access and airflow. If you proceed with the core and fin style, I would install a couple of spray nozzles to give them a flush when they clog up.

[MB]

Cheers Phil, all perfect points for me to seriously consider as you have already well thought out thoroughly as always mate!
FOR SALE: 2 x Serco oil coolers & 1 x Derale mechanical oil TS still in boxes, come with free cobwebs :-)
Are still keen though to see what BD reckon about the Derale unit as one of its reasons for my original purchase was for fast warm up times to get out in the paddock next door or down to our factory only 5 minutes away.
Maybe I should look at a remote keyless start for the beast like the big awesome yanky tanks do out their kitchen windows whilst having their morning cuppa :-)



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[MB]

PeeBee Philstar, 1 x copy cat purchase on same $125 Ebay bargain order now :-) !
Was totally sold once seeing that cooler on the weekend mate, very smicko, even AB’s impressed too possibly for his TD42Ti beast as well :-)


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[PeeBee]

You will be happy with the result.

[PeeBee]

Thermo valve update. BD story has changed - how surprising! Seems they have only seen one vehicle with this modification and the symptoms suggest the internal thermostat or pressure relief mechanism (unsure how this device works) is faulty as the engine oil gets hot but the additional cooler stays cold. This diagnosis happened before Xmas and the customer has gone away and not reported back if he has gotten to the root cause of the issue. So, in theory the device should be fine to install - would pay to check on the temperature threshold it is supposed to work at or pressure it should release at so you can validate the range is correct for your vehicle. I understand you are ideally looking for an oil temp around the 190F/89 degC mark as max into the cooler. You could simply run the cooler like I do, without a control, or install the valve and see how it goes. The valve could always be added later if you are unhappy. The valve may be your 'flux capacitor' device to give you the added HP you are looking for!!!!!

[PeeBee]

PeeBee Philstar, 1 x copy cat purchase on same $125 Ebay bargain order now :-) !
Was totally sold once seeing that cooler on the weekend mate, very smicko, even AB’s impressed too possibly for his TD42Ti beast as well :-)


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@MB, Don't forget to add the extra oil to the sump when you fit the cooler up. When the engine is stopped the oil will drain back to the sump, hence it will appear to be over full. As soon as the engine starts, the oil pump will distribute this into the cooling circuit and your sump level will return to normal. Thinking about the thermo valve then, if it does not let the oil travel to the new extended cooler circuit, then the sump is going to have approx 2L of oil higher than full in it - might be a problem with over filling that much - don't really know. Of course if the oil cooler circuit with the thermo valve is fitted with check valves of some description to hold the 'cold oil' in place within the aux oil cooler circuit, then you are back at the normal parameters for the sump level - make sense?

[the evil twin]

FWIW I always overfill my sump for the same reason IE the oil cooler and lines "uses" some of the sump capacity.

I would not fit a thermo valve here in Oz for the reasons already discussed, if the vehicle spent its winter in Alaska/Canada/Russia etc then maybe different story

[PeeBee]

FWIW I always overfill my sump for the same reason IE the oil cooler and lines "uses" some of the sump capacity.

I would not fit a thermo valve here in Oz for the reasons already discussed, if the vehicle spent its winter in Alaska/Canada/Russia etc then maybe different story

I agree, and funny thing was, i was on the phone to MB discussing this and your point - so I think he is going to leave it out.

[MB]

Cheers blokes!
All makes very good sense above, thankyou:-)
Even in our deepest winter up here lowest paddock temp is around -3D so no snow just frost.
FWIW here is the unit collecting cobwebs in the shed still: https://derale.com/products/fluid-coolers/thermostats-1/fluid-control-thermostats/15-heavy-duty-stainless-steel-standard-rotation-flex-fan-chrome-detail
Phil mate I cannot seem to find the 10% bypass always information on it I thought so maybe it is a fail shut situation waiting to happen?
Good save blokes, Double Cheers!!


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[PeeBee]

Cheers blokes!
All makes very good sense above, thankyou:-)
Even in our deepest winter up here lowest paddock temp is around -3D so no snow just frost.
FWIW here is the unit collecting cobwebs in the shed still: https://derale.com/products/fluid-coolers/thermostats-1/fluid-control-thermostats/15-heavy-duty-stainless-steel-standard-rotation-flex-fan-chrome-detail
Phil mate I cannot seem to find the 10% bypass always information on it I thought so maybe it is a fail shut situation waiting to happen?
Good save blokes, Double Cheers!!


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The 10% is mentioned in the video. The 10% ensures you always have a flow thru the cooler so there is no hammer effect as the valve lifts off its seat to send the remaining 90% of flow thru it. You were not dreaming!

[MB]

Maybe just drinking then ME mate, thank you ;-)
Does seem to take us all into, “how to” , stop oil cooler/line flow back into our sumps? Personally do love your idea/proven of mounting up higher bullbar for awesome efficiency!! Another bonus I do find with your new setup is true oil changes with a little patience added although some crud will stay in all cooler setups from their own lowest drain points?
Can only ‘imagine’ now that a lowest storage/canister pre cooler with a dump/oil change HP valve would further assist oil volume needed and siphon back height pressure/air issues?




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[PeeBee]

Mark, the retained volume of oil in both new oil cooler tubes is just on 0.4L. being that left in the the crescent below the connection fitting. If you wanted to, you could simply unbolt the cooler and tip it up on its end, still connected to the hoses and pull out 99% of that, pretty simple, 4 small bolts. Couple of lemons with this still, I think the other thing you need to confirm is if your oil lines enter the top or bottom of the BD oil cooler; should be the bottom, otherwise there is no way of draining the oil from the cooler, PLUS, you may still need to crack a line on the BD oil cooler as your circuit is heading 'uphill' - follow it thru on the truck and you will see what i mean - mine runs into a small 'u' bend loop and this small quantity of oil will just have to stay there and get diluted by the new oil - maybe half a cup at most - not important in the scheme of things.

[PeeBee]

Coolers are all on the low pressue side from what I have seem in most cars Phil. Never seen any finned heat transfer unit in a car capable of holding much more then 20psi haha.

Matty, the oil coolers on the chev are fully pressurised, rated at 300psi and hoses at 500psi, screwed fittings - just found this out with my oil cooler addition. The new coolers are pressure rated at 500psi also.

[PeeBee]

Kindly received some pics today from http://www.blitsbodykits.com.au/ for the GU Supercharger bonnets if anyone needs raised rainsey Cheers mate!
I believe this one below is for GU4 and onwards: http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/10/21.jpg I believe this one below is for earlier: http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/10/22.jpg
Wendy there was very helpful so give em a call if you GU blokes need.


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@MB, have you checked yet about the missing side vents? Funny enough the picture of the bonnet fitted to the GU does not have them - maybe needed to specifically ask for them?

[MB]

Not as yet mate, have been flat out myself and figure they’d still be on holidays. The picture we had discussed fitment over email was this one below they sent me so I guess I just assumed they came with it :-( http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/20.jpg


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[the evil twin]

Pfft, why do you want vents in the Bonnet?

Aesthetics?
IMHO it looks a bit daggy and the Patrol in the pic looks shmicko

[PeeBee]

Pfft, why do you want vents in the Bonnet?

Aesthetics?
IMHO it looks a bit daggy and the Patrol in the pic looks shmicko

I think they are working on the flow of air into the front and some small amount going out of the side vent.

[the evil twin]

I think they are working on the flow of air into the front and some small amount going out of the side vent.

Yeah, I spose...

IMHO vents that small will do bugger all.
There is a wacking great fan/s shoving a gazillion cubes a minute of air out the 2 square metre hole in the bottom of the engine bay so a couple of dinky little vents won't do much.

I have seen posts advocating and/or claiming raising the rear of the bonnet off the seal gets good results.
Personally, I remain sceptical of those claims as well.

I do agree cooler ambient air will enter thru the scoop at reasonable vehicle speeds which will help rather than the hotter air post Rad

All just my opinion tho...

[PeeBee]

I think the primary reason for this bonnet modification by the manufacturer was to provide additional engine clearance when motor swaps take place, plus a desire to get a bit of air into the engine bay. I think at low speed where the vac effect does not take place, there might be some improvement; certainly adding a side exhaust path would help to induce flow, but to your point, the mass escape path is downwards. I have installed actual bonnet gills above my motor and cannot notice any tangible change in reduced temps at highway speeds. Unfortunately I had the faulty fan coupling come into play on the first 4wd outing, so they didn't help much there either. Time will tell, but there certainly is a high temp flow of air venting from the bonnet out the gills when the vehicle is stopped and engine off, and a positive but not high flow when stopped and the engine is running.

[MB]

G’evening good Blokes!!
I guess my latest wacky theory again of the side vents expected upon arrival was in relation to a multiple alternator rack install in replacement of the now removed massive Donaldson NA keg sized air filter behind the center of manifold intake. The 4” Millweld custom system a while ago now seems to be working very well on noticeable say 10% ish cooler power & fuel up the short highways. All that great space left back there now has been an area of “what to do with” for my way of thinking:-(
Last trip on ‘Dingo Hill Track’ (at best 2kmph) I did overheat by foolish total truck design my 170amp pimped GQ alt.
As always, is very possibly a knee-jerk reaction on my behalf again!


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[MB]

Happy Days blokes, truly thank you both! Mrs MB has finally collected our PO Box :-)
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/67.jpg PeeBee mate bargain price and I really can now see their internal fin efficiency design exactly like your sketch thanks mate! http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/68.jpg


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[PeeBee]

Yep, they work alright! Now get it installed unlike the originals that sat on the shelf staring at you.

[MB]

Will do my best mate although winter coming again soon will buy me another 9 months, lol :-)
As a quick fix for the high mount cooler drain back to sump issue do you blokes believe simply plumbing the lines from engine up highest on the firewall could in theory work? Picture below of some ‘orange airline’ scraps placed to help explain the line path/trap I’m theorising about?
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/76.jpg Does appear from a side view on the GU that this firewall height is above the new Philstar wicked cooler bullbar mount height!


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[MB]

Best modification yet PeeBee mate!
(Very productive night here, lol :-) )
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/77.jpg Double Dozen Goggie’s back there now baking in all this leftover space :-) !


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[PeeBee]

Will do my best mate although winter coming again soon will buy me another 9 months, lol :-)
As a quick fix for the high mount cooler drain back to sump issue do you blokes believe simply plumbing the lines from engine up highest on the firewall could in theory work? Picture below of some ‘orange airline’ scraps placed to help explain the line path/trap I’m theorising about?
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/76.jpg Does appear from a side view on the GU that this firewall height is above the new Philstar wicked cooler bullbar mount height!


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Mark, putting a u bend in the supply line and return line will work. Alternately you could put a pair of simple check valves in the line facing the same way, being the same flow direction. They are closed when no flow/pressure.Talk to Pirtek about that as they offered it to me, however I have simply gone with the 2L overfill situation after confirming with BD that it would be fine.

[MB]

PeeBee mate, which way again?
Sideways?
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/89.jpg
Longways?
http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/90.jpg
Time to get busy :-) !


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[PeeBee]

Mark, I don't know if the air is thin up there in Xmas Hills, but I will explain it again, S L o W L y.

The Light bar comes off and is sent express post to me. The oil cooler is mounted where the light bar sits now. You will need a herbaceous planter box in front of the cooler to disguise it from the Vicroads inspectors. The herbs will improve the heat transfer when you are stationary as they will shade the cooler - let me know if you need assistance selecting the varieties. The herbs will allow you to provide fresh garnishes with your camp roasts.

I can only assume you have been misled by those other two Xmas Hills gremlins as i thought this was explained very clearly.

[the evil twin]

Sideways... but cut a hole in the Bonnet and put an ARE Scoop in with the Cooler on top and screw a Light Bar to the Cooler... with a Mack Bulldog on top of that again

[the evil twin]

... and if you hook up a herbaceous planter box to your coolant tank you could even have a Grow Operation happening
Light, Heat and Nutrients... Tick, Tick and Tick!

[MB]

Cheers blokes, got it sorted now I think ;-) http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/91.jpg


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[the evil twin]

... on the Bonnet looked better... more air flow.

and if you mix the Herb with the Eggs you could have a really awesome Omlette

[Winnie]

Cheers blokes, got it sorted now I think ;-) http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/91.jpg


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkIs this the newer ARB light bar? I reckon that would solve the issue I have with limited space to mount lights.

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[the evil twin]

I'm worried about the dump he took on his bonnet... bit too much fibre to be healthy IMHO

[PeeBee]

Idjitts, simply Idjitts - sort it out yourself

[MB]

Sideways... but cut a hole in the Bonnet and put an ARE Scoop in with the Cooler on top and screw a Light Bar to the Cooler... with a Mack Bulldog on top of that again
Sweet as ET mate, like it alot ;-)
Buff’s are heaps tougher than Bullwog’s though :-) http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/92.jpg



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[MB]

FWIW top blokes ! 35mm hole centres on the new ripper PeeBee oil cooler! http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/93.jpg 40NB/48.3OD bar as most. Approximately a 7mm bolt hole with a minimum 60mm distance/length. Have ratted through every shed shelf tonight to no avail :-( ! Thinking this needs a Bunnings run tomorrow for say a ‘drill out’ 8mm SS ‘U’ bolt thingy x 50mm x 75mm long & a bit of bending/styling thereafter:-) ?


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[MB]

........http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/94.jpg


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[PeeBee]

I would use the existing tabs you have on the bar instead of trying to find a clamp, which won't fit well anyway unless its one of those light bar clamps.

[MB]

Now that’s a better idea mate, thanks! Seem to remember ‘Bushranger’ brand had a very possible light bar clamp thingys that could mount on backwards. Cheers!


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[PeeBee]

Now that’s a better idea mate, thanks! Seem to remember ‘Bushranger’ brand had a very possible light bar clamp thingys that could mount on backwards. Cheers!


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I reckon something like this would work Mark. Sorry, running out of things to do on mine so have to dream up jobs for you now!!74200

[MB]

Cheers Phil, was playing around with that earlier and found using the existing bullbar tabs sets the cooler back too far and I can’t open the bonnet. It’s because the Millweld bar is set so far back for entry angle. These tabs aren’t being used so considering cutting them off to bring the cooler almost hard up against the ARB light bar brackets and on a 20 degree angle. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/105.jpghttp://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/106.jpg Do appreciate any and all ideas before I hack away and butcher it :-(


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[PeeBee]

Can you reverse the feet and point them inwards, them mount the cooler horizontal instead of vertical? Or mount it horizontal and modify the angle foot - chop a corner off and re-drill on hole to make it fit neat with the back of the lightbar - which won't be there after you send it over to me!!!74201

[MB]

Just flipped the coolers brackets, (please do check yours Phill mine were only finger tight outa the box) http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/107.jpg Noticed there is a drain bung on them which is cool ! http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/108.jpg It really does seem to be screaming out for U bolt thingys or light bar clamps as the brackets are now back inside the welded line of the straight part of the bar. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/109.jpg


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[PeeBee]

You might have to insert the bolts first into the feet and mount the bracket os put the nut on top - looks heaps of room
Will it fit between bullbar and bonnet in any fashion when horizontal is perhaps the question and if so what are the advantages of vertical, horizontal or angled and can you make it work? -- Of course you CAN.

[MB]

Just worried if I run it horizontally under the bar it will be blocking some airflow to the grill which I’ve always kept as clear as possible nowadays. Judging by the drain/bung on these they look meant to be mounted vertically so the bung is at lowest point.


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[PeeBee]

You don't need the bung, what are you draining? Sit it up on top of a plate mounted off the bottom of the existing BB tab.74202

[PeeBee]

OK, another day in the garage, finally converted my 'heath robinson' dodgy bracket assy into a more satisfactory unit to allow tensioning of the two belts whilst keeping the jackshaft stationary. Couple of pics of the finished bracket all welded up and then in the engine bay. Still requires a final shim under the front bearing block, then fitment and alignment of the endless air compressor - requires the rear to be tilted upwards for best results. I have taken the supply air directly from the top of the inlet plenum as the only other point was on the 'dirty air side' of the filter. I am pretty sure this will work - if not I can always plug the tapped hole and run a seperate filter. 742237422474225

[PeeBee]

@MB, here is a shot of the oil cooler hose i used. this one does not require clamps if you use the correct barb fitting. Apparently the only way to get them off the barb once fitted is to cut them off. mine don't leak and thats after 200klm, so i reckon they are fine for the extra cooler. I got this from Pirtek.7422674227

[poindexter]

PeeBee, you have a calling......

[PeeBee]

Whats happening with your build - are you on the road yet?

[the evil twin]

Ok... Ok... ya's talked me inta it... mines on its way to sunny WA

[PeeBee]

Ok... Ok... ya's talked me inta it... mines on its way to sunny WA

For what? 6.5 upgrade - P400 upgrade?

[poindexter]

I'm waiting (the bane of my life) for the dude to come back from Christmas, hopefully truck goes in this week or next

[the evil twin]

Hehehehe, Jeez mate... P400??? ... twasn't me what won the 50 Mill Lotto.

All I can afford is one of them nifty Oil Coolers you found.

[PeeBee]

Boy this has been a drawn out activity. I hope it goes swiftly for you and you get your hands on the beast smoothly from there. Who are you using for the VASS engineering?

[poindexter]

PeeBee, If your question is for me, the yes, it has been drawn out.
Reason is: I know the dude, he does good work, and I trust him.
He can be a little hard to "pin down" to start work, because he is particular about getting it right.
He did put in a 4 post hoist just for the truck, he has normally 2 poster hoists.
The VASS guy is in Bayswater, he only does the 6.5s, recommended by Brunswick Diesel, had a chat to him, seems to know his stuff, though his input is minimal.

[PeeBee]

@MB, I purchased two of these air locker dump valves from ARB - not avail in Aussie, had to buy from England. They are fitted down near the diff end of the line and its a simple task of pushing a button to expel the air and any mo7422874229isture. i know you have your water separator in line, and that should be enough, however for those without that gear, this might be a solution for cold weather trips and lockers. The part number is 170110. Cost is around $75/valve then freight. They were despatched via DHL, pretty expensive at $65 but I had the items in 4 days. I am still waiting for gear to arrive from QLD and thats 2 weeks by good old Aust post.

[MB]

Grrrr......Just gave the old 6.5 an absolute flogging test up our hill with boat on tow to see if any faults would appear. The pimped GQ 170amp alt issue is back! No spotties or fridges running this time only rad fans and stock aircon fan, (Total max say 60amps). Cruised along the dirt road to home and she’s back again. Bonnet up and the alt can vaporise a drop of water atop instantly:-(


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[the evil twin]

Qwik piks of the air install on mine.
Runs off the A/C pulley (obviously)
Only issue is that it is goddam hot down there under the A/C
Soooo... I'm thinking of sourcing cooler air somehow

[MB]

Whereabouts ET on the turbo serpy beasts do BD position the alternator mate? Our NA’s have em on top but still friggin hot up here. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/138.jpg Really do have to pull my finger out and get the new bonnet painted up and fit it to catch some fresh air :-(


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[the evil twin]

My Alt is on the Drivers side... where whatever is being driven off the middle belt in your 3 belt setup lives I reckon.

I also believe you have to be wary of the DOR of between the triple belt and serpy belt setups... water pump in particular

[MB]

Cheers ET! Our PS pumps live up there on these jiggers.
DOR I believe it was one of your very early posts years back that kindly educated me on the serpy/V belt issue with water pumps etc...
I’ll ring AB and Rossco again now to confirm the GQ alt DOR just in case :-(


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[MB]

AB has just kindly confirmed again for me that his standard GQ alt’s rotation is “Clockwise” when standing in front of his beast. The plot may be thickening though as a picture also received shows his GQ alt with a cooling fan/blade between pulleys and alternator. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/141.jpg The ‘stretched’ pimped up 170amp jobbie I’ve installed on the Chev does not :-( http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/142.jpg


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[AB]

Winnie

Above pic of my alternator chop too, sorry I forgot to send you that!

[poindexter]

the external fan alternator in the pic, needs to rotate in an anti-clockwise direction

[MB]

AB mate above, can you pretty please confirm 100% for me again, sorry mate :-(


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[the evil twin]

MB, most Alts don't have the "fan" on the belt pulley these days.
None of my vehicles do incl my 6.5 IE the Fords and my Trol Alts all look exactly like yours.
IE all internal fans as Poindexter mentions

[the evil twin]

the external fan alternator in the pic, needs to rotate in an anti-clockwise direction

You sure... IIRC those Alt setups actually draw air thru the Alt and throw it out (clockwise)... not draw ambient and force it into the Alt (counterclockwise)

Same principle as Rad Fans on Vehicles, Outboard Internal Water Pump and Inboard External Water Pump impellors on boats.

[MB]

Thank you ET mate! Remembering now also that the original Mitsubishi on there that died was fanless too. What am I doing wrong here :-( ?


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[poindexter]

All alternators have fans, older style are external, later style are internal.
From my days at Bosch, I thought the air flow runs front to back. I could be wrong, it was quite some years ago.
Easy way to check is see an ,80s engine running.

[MB]

Cheers Ralph mate! Any idea why this jobbie is cooking and dropping off when it does? It will come back to life tomorrow morning I believe:-(


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[the evil twin]

Cheers ET! Our PS pumps live up there on these jiggers.
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OooooKaaaay...
My ALT lives where your PS pump lives
My A/C lives where your Alt lives
My P/S pump lives down below my A/C (maybe where your A/C lives?)
All driven off the Serpy
My Endless Air Comp lives between and outboard of the A/C and the P/S pump and is driven by that dinky 2nd belt off the A/C
My Serpy belt tensioner lives between the Alt and the Water Pump

[poindexter]

2 things, air flow or pulley speed.
Alternators generally need to spin at a certain speed to generate current, if it is too slow, you may be overloading it.
6.5 don't rev that high, so maybe it's revs?
Have a look at the Alternators stateside and see what pulleys they run on their 6.5s.

[Winnie]

the external fan alternator in the pic, needs to rotate in an anti-clockwise direction100% spins clockwise on a TD

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[MB]

I can now see tiny little fan blades inside its front cover, seriously small blades though, much like a few 2cm x 1cm paddles and say 10 of them at best.


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[the evil twin]

snip...
From my days at Bosch, I thought the air flow runs front to back. I could be wrong, it was quite some years ago.


ROFL, I thought it twas the other way, just as likely I'm wrong :-)

[the evil twin]

I can now see tiny little fan blades inside its front cover, seriously small blades though, much like a few 2cm x 1cm paddles and say 10 of them at best.


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Yep... sure will be... as prev posted by PD all Alts have fans BUT might will pay to make sure your DOR is correct as stated by the Manuf otherwise the Alt will overheat internal or external fan regardless

[the evil twin]

2 things, air flow or pulley speed.
Alternators generally need to spin at a certain speed to generate current, if it is too slow, you may be overloading it.
6.5 don't rev that high, so maybe it's revs?
Have a look at the Alternators stateside and see what pulleys they run on their 6.5s.

Agree... ALTs are normally geared up as much as 2 on Pettys to 3 times on Diesels relative to engine RPM.

If the RPM of the Alt is low or the DOR wrong they will get hotter than they should.
Dunno if that is your prob but def where I would start looking

[MB]

AB’s a little busy, just kindly had matfew also confirm his GQ alt is clockwise from front viewing.
It was an older Ebay purchase advertised as for GQ so unsure of how I can check by myself its DOR design now :-( ?


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[the evil twin]

AB’s a little busy, just kindly had matfew also confirm his GQ alt is clockwise from front viewing.
It was an older Ebay purchase advertised as for GQ so unsure of how I can check by myself its DOR design now :-( ?


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Is your Alt rotating clockwise like a GQ? If so you would think the Alt is set correctly if it was supposed to be for a standard Q
Otherwise, if you can eyeball the internal blades set to pull air from the rings, over the stator and expel at the front when rotated the way your setup.

It should be OK as the only way to reverse the DOR is like with a Serpy IE where you can run a belt 'under' a driven pulley (gives CCW DOR) as as opposed to 'over' (gives CW DOR)

[MB]

For sure thanks mate, the 6.5NA’s Alts rotate clockwise from front view same as the boys GQ’s. Just checked the internal tiny fans and yes they appear to be set for expelling air forward.


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[the evil twin]

For sure thanks mate, the 6.5NA’s Alts rotate clockwise from front view same as the boys GQ’s. Just checked the internal tiny fans and yes they appear to be set for expelling air forward.


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Right... IMHO the next thing to check is the driven pulley dia (as suggested by poindexter)
The 6.5s are slower revving again than the TD42's.

FWIW I'll go check mine

[MB]

Cheers ET, I did make sure of that too before I purchased and the new pulleys OD was say only a few mm’s smaller than the BD I guess original Mitsubishi one on there when bought complete already.


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[PeeBee]

Mark, from what I have read the alternator will run hot at anytime. The issue is how the heat affects the rectifier /diodes in the rectifier. I am thinking our under bonnet temps exceed the operating temps of the alternator electronics and hence they crap out - heat equals resistance. Not having a big arse fan to cool the alternator will not be helping. I run a 3" marine blower to cool my alternators when it gets hot. At the end of the day you want your electronic controls as cool as possible - remember the diode expansion module i told you about?
If you send the current across 18 diodes instead of 6 they are individually doing less 'unit work' hence they heat up less from the electrical load. this does not have anything to do with the actual under bonnet load from the temps, but it gives your alternator more capability to generate at max current if the individual units are cooler - does this make sense?

[MB]

A poofteenth under 80mm OD checked here thanks mate. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/143.jpg V belts obviously slightly smaller ID measurement.


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[MB]

The 6.5s are slower revving again than the TD42's.

FWIW I'll go check mine
Hmmmm, I don’t believe I checked that part thanks mate! From memory TD42s are around 750rpm idle and my Chev’s happy at 500-550rpm twactor styling. I never push it too much past say 3,000rpm flogging it :-)



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[the evil twin]

Mine is 60mm at the flange, approx 55mm at the drive face as the flanges are approx 2mm high.

Sooo... FWIW... my ALT will be spinning much faster the yours.
Is your pulley the same dia pulley it was supplied with for a TD42 or did you reduce it for the 6.5?

The other variable would be the dia of the crank pulley which is what determines belt speed but IMHO as there are other accessories all driven by the belt like A/C, P/S etc you would think the belt speed should be similar between 3 belt and serpy

[MB]

.......does this make sense?
Thank you Phil mate, it kind of does although you know too well I am an electrical nuffy! Keen here to just make 100% sure first that the mechanics of it all are all correct brother:-)



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[MB]

Mine is 60mm at the flange, approx 55mm at the drive face as the flanges are approx 2mm high.

Sooo... FWIW... my ALT will be spinning much faster the yours.
Is your pulley the same dia pulley it was supplied with for a TD42 or did you reduce it for the 6.5?

The other variable would be the dia of the crank pulley which is what determines belt speed but IMHO as there are other accessories all driven by the belt like A/C, P/S etc you would think the belt speed should be similar between 3 belt and serpy
Cheers mate, huge Alt pulley size difference there :-(
Yep, it is the same pulley supplied and near identical size to the failed Mitsubishi that was already on there. Going to go check the crank pulley size now :-) PeeBee mate, your NA Mitsubishi Alt from factory failed pretty quick too maybe?


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[MB]

Ok, crank pulley OD on the 6.5NA V belt jobbie here is 195mm ish. So.... 195mm to 80mm at 1:1 drive = ? @ PeeBee please mate :-) ! http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/145.jpg


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[AB]

A poofteenth under 80mm OD checked here thanks mate. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2018/01/143.jpg V belts obviously slightly smaller ID measurement.


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GQ TD42 ute same size mate...

[poindexter]

the ZD30s have a cutout in the radiator shroud to allow air to flow to the Alt for cooling, maybe look at doing something similar.

[PeeBee]

Mark, my 100amp alternator failed after 1500klm. It overheated to the extent the insulation on the windings charred and blew out the back. I am betting your alternator has been beefed up to generate the 170amps peak and the rectifiers have been left the same, as they can only be so big to fit inside the alternator. To that end the recifiers are doing more unit work at 170amp rating than they are at say 90. Regards the 60amp draw, I would say this is well above the duty factor for that alternator, probably above most alternators to be honest. I am going to fit the external diode pack as previously discussed to get past the heat resistance issue.

If in doubt, seek professional help!!!

[MB]

Cheers blokes, for sure PD I do have a fancy bonnet close to ready for this although it really shouldn’t be needed for this experience underway :-(


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[PeeBee]

2.43 to 1.

[the evil twin]

Hmmm... if thats the size for the TD then thats a tad slow to me for a Chev

It varies a bit from manf to manuf but below from Prestolite is common to most


A pulley with the desired ratio will drive the alternator fast enough at engine idle to charge the electrical system slightly, yet will not drive the alternator too fast (over speed) at the upper end of the engine speed range. In general, pulley ratios of about 2:1 to 3:1 provide good charging system performance and assure longer service life of the alternator bearings.

For passenger cars, approximateley a 2:1 pulley ratio is typical. This pulley ratio provides about 5 to 10 amperes output at idle while limiting alternator RPM at the upper end of the engine speed range. The top speed of the 5" frame alternator should not exceed approximately 8000 maximum continuous RPM.

For heavy-duty diesel engines, a 3:1 pulley ratio can be used since these engines are governed so as not to exceed 2100 RPM. The top speed of the 6 1/2" frame alternators should be limited to approximately 5000 to 6000 maximum continuous RPM.

[the evil twin]

the ZD30s have a cutout in the radiator shroud to allow air to flow to the Alt for cooling, maybe look at doing something similar.

Hmmm... I always thought that "cutout" is for airflow from the A/C thermoelectric fan.
If it was solid the shroud/engine fan would partially block the flow esp in traffic

[the evil twin]

As a point of interest I'd be a tad suprised if you get max output from that Alt with only one drive belt as well.

Anything over about 110/120 will usually have two belts.
That Alt of yours will pull something towards 2 horsepower at max output

[poindexter]

which is why poly vee belts are better ie serpentine.

[PeeBee]

I can pull 200amps out of my aux alt. on 1 'a' section vee belt, but for longevity you don't want to do this. I tong tested this with a DC meter so know it is possible.