problem starting in park with Auto transmission

[ckh]

problem starting in park with Auto transmission its becomming more and more frequesnt, hop in turn the key all lights light up etc except engine wont crank, got to move it out and back into park then all is good, is this something to be really concerened about?

[04OFF]

if you put it in neutral will it start first time ?

[ckh]

if you put it in neutral will it start first time ?

yes every time

[04OFF]

Im gonna suggest, that you have a problem with the gearbox neutral switch, this is the electric switch on the gearbox that tells the ECU that you are in Park or Neutral, and that it is OK to start engine because you are not in gear, it should be pretty easy to confirm by using a multimeter on the switch output when in neutral, as compared to when in park.

[ckh]

Im gonna suggest, that you have a problem with the gearbox neutral switch, this is the electric switch on the gearbox that tells the ECU that you are in Park or Neutral, and that it is OK to start engine because you are not in gear, it should be pretty easy to confirm by using a multimeter on the switch output when in neutral, as compared to when in park.

I dont think my gq has a an ecu its an old 89 carby model..

Any other ideas

[BearGUST]

It will still have an inhibitor switch, they can be either on the T-bar, on the side of the box or inside the box. I'm not sure where they are on yours though...
They are normally able to be adjusted by simply loosening them and realigning them. If the switch is stuffed you can just bridge the two wires together to fix it on the cheap-just means it will start in gear, if you're silly enough to do so.

[Clunk]

I dont think my gq has a an ecu its an old 89 carby model..

Any other ideas

If it does have an ecu it'll be in the passenger side kick panel ......... I think

Don't stroke it, TAP it!!!!.....

[04OFF]

I dont think my gq has a an ecu its an old 89 carby model..

Any other ideas

Does not matter, as mentioned above, no matter what engine or car, if its "auto", it will have a safety switch to prevent the starting motor activaiting with the transmisson in gear !

Only bypass the switch for testing, a permanent bypass will eventually end in tears, or death.




Reminds me of a mate who fitted a remote "auto start" car alarm to his car, this system allows you to start your car from inside the house with the alarm key remote, and is only allowed to be used on auto cars as they wont ever start in gear.

My mate wanted one but had a manual car, he never let anyone else drive his car and he always left it in neutral so no problem, until...... one night he was out ,and his brother had to move his car, he put the car back in the same spot, and you guessed it, left it in gear.

Well the next morning under remote start function, the car drove itself through the garage door and into another car, and he was lucky no people got injured, could have been a very different outcome.




So yeh, dont booby trap your own car for someone to get caught out in the future, at the very least you could use a momentary switch to bypass the function, at least that way you have to press switch and turn key at the same time, personally id go to a auto sparky or try a switch from the wreckers

[BearGUST]

If you've ever started an auto in gear you'll realise it's not that dramatic.

[oilpond]

Neutral switch, and it cant break anything but can get worse and is embarrasing and annoying:(

[04OFF]

If you've ever started an auto in gear you'll realise it's not that dramatic.

It was a few years ago, a old WB statesman V8, had to move it, not my car, battery was flat.

Jump started it with a car battery i had on a trolly, as it was a V8 carby engine car, i was giving it a fair bit of throttle to get it to start, the shifter said it was in neutral, but little did i know, the car was in drive, after quite a few lazy turns, it fired up and just took off ,bonnet still up, and one leg outside the door, dragging the battery jumper cables pulling over the trolly shorting out on the battery, creating sparks and spilling acid.

About 1M in front of the WB was a parked car that copped the impact, bendng the boot lid and smashing a tail light, plus a little damage to the statesman.






I found it quite dramatic at the time !

[NissanGQ4.2]

It was a few years ago, a old WB statesman V8, had to move it, not my car, battery was flat.

Jump started it with a car battery i had on a trolly, as it was a V8 carby engine car, i was giving it a fair bit of throttle to get it to start, the shifter said it was in neutral, but little did i know, the car was in drive, after quite a few lazy turns, it fired up and just took off ,bonnet still up, and one leg outside the door, dragging the battery jumper cables pulling over the trolly shorting out on the battery, creating sparks and spilling acid.

About 1M in front of the WB was a parked car that copped the impact, bendng the boot lid and smashing a tail light, plus a little damage to the statesman.






I found it quite dramatic at the time !

Any photo's?????????????????????????

hahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

Very lucky no one was standing between the 2 cars, that would of ended in tragedy.

[BearGUST]

I used to work for a guy that would sack you if you started a car like that, sounds more irresponsible than bridging an inhibitor switch.

[ckh]

The problem starting in park hasnt happened this week, but was consistant near every day last week, concern I have now is when I start off from being stopped the is a bump changing from first to second, all the other gear changes seem fine... is this something to be overly concerned about?

[04OFF]

I used to work for a guy that would sack you if you started a car like that, sounds more irresponsible than bridging an inhibitor switch.

LOL serious, please explain ? :p

Why would he say jump strarting a car like that irresponsible ? and id love to know whats the "responsible" procedure in such a case ?

The irresponsible person is the D%*K head who knew the car would start in gear and did not tell anyone !

[Alitis007]

LOL serious, please explain ? :p

Why would he say jump strarting a car like that irresponsible ? and id love to know whats the "responsible" procedure in such a case ?

The irresponsible person is the D%*K head who knew the car would start in gear and did not tell anyone !

Normally you would have 1 foot on the break and the hand break up and if the neutral park switch was buggered you would select P and click back R then N. We had a Bronco at work once with sloppy selector linkages that slipped out of neutral and into drive and took off into the bench, luck it had a bull bar and the bench was very solid and there was no damage or any1 got hurt!!

[BearGUST]

Manual transmission vehicles have started in gear since day 1, not disastrous.
My old boss would sack anyone who started a car without it being in park and having a foot on the brake, sounds like he was right. One foot dangling outside the car makes it very easy to slip on to the accelerator with your left foot, which is your non preferred foot.

Anyway, back on topic. I wonder what's effected the car this week, what's been different this week? Has it been hotter where you are?
I wouldn't think the bump on 1-2 shift is related to this problem?

[04OFF]

Altise...The handbrake was actually ON, the V8 obviously pushed through it no problem so i guess it didnt hold the car so good :(

Remember, i had no way of knowing the switch/shifter was buggerd, a auto car with a flat battery or bad starter, will generally turn over a little easier if you put it in neutral.

Bear...I had many failed attempts to start the engine, i dont know of anyone who for each try, would close the bonnet so you can see in front, sit in the drivers seat, close the drivers door, put your seat belt on, foot on brake, all just to see if the engine turns over when you hit the key, perhaps your old boss new he had some "booby trapped" vehicles waiting to catch someone out ?




The problem starting in park hasnt happened this week, but was consistant near every day last week, concern I have now is when I start off from being stopped the is a bump changing from first to second, all the other gear changes seem fine... is this something to be overly concerned about?

As Bear suggested, this problem sounds like something unrelated, but i think its time to visit a auto lec or transmission specialist before it gets worse ?

[ckh]

Manual transmission vehicles have started in gear since day 1, not disastrous.
My old boss would sack anyone who started a car without it being in park and having a foot on the brake, sounds like he was right. One foot dangling outside the car makes it very easy to slip on to the accelerator with your left foot, which is your non preferred foot.

Anyway, back on topic. I wonder what's effected the car this week, what's been different this week? Has it been hotter where you are?
I wouldn't think the bump on 1-2 shift is related to this problem?

Was exceptionally hot here last week, high 30's+ and higher

The bump between first and second, is not were near as dramatic as when you have the car running and put it into drive and get the usual bump on any auto transmission. Just being paranoid.. How much does a service cost for an auto transmission? Anyone know?

[Alitis007]

Was exceptionally hot here last week, high 30's+ and higher

The bump between first and second, is not were near as dramatic as when you have the car running and put it into drive and get the usual bump on any auto transmission. Just being paranoid.. How much does a service cost for an auto transmission? Anyone know?

Hard shift between 1 and 2 could be shift solenoid or your tps is out of adjustment, before you go spending $$$ on a service try a nulon auto transmission treatment to try and soften the seals to ease the shift.

[Alitis007]

Altise...The handbrake was actually ON, the V8 obviously pushed through it no problem so i guess it didnt hold the car so good :(

At the end of the day shite happens!! And you know for next time

[04OFF]

yes it does !


try a nulon auto transmission treatment to try and soften the seals to ease the shift.


Lucas make a good auto treatment as well :)

[lhurley]

Im a fan of Castrol Transmax Z. An auto shop will be able to have a look and fix it up.

Just my 2 cents here, dont just live with any "problems" or quirks your auto has, get it checked. I learnt that the hard way, mine had rough gear changes and dirty oil, changed the oil no real difference, so i just monitored it. Monitored it until when i was driving on the highway and the torque converter bearing collapsed and cause a butt load of damage to my auto. its in the shop now, last quote was $4500!!! The place thats doing my repairs has services for around $250, i would highly recommend getting it looked by a pro as soon as you can before you get stung.

[nissannewby]

Im sure your mates could help you on this one surely they would know someone or somewhere to get it done cheap. But as others have stated its far cheaper and a better option to repair small niggles as they happen otherwise like lhurley has stated you could end up with a catastrphic failure.

[ckh]

Hard shift between 1 and 2 could be shift solenoid or your tps is out of adjustment, before you go spending $$$ on a service try a nulon auto transmission treatment to try and soften the seals to ease the shift.
What is " tps"?

[BearGUST]

TPS is a Throttle Position Sensor, I think you mentioned yours is carby so it won't have one.

[Alitis007]

Just re read the thread and just realized it was carby so sorry bout that and yeh disregard the TPS. On the carby check the adjustment of the kick down cable unless its electric cant remember 100% havnt worked on a gq in a while.

[ckh]

Just re read the thread and just realized it was carby so sorry bout that and yeh disregard the TPS. On the carby check the adjustment of the kick down cable unless its electric cant remember 100% havnt worked on a gq in a while.

Going to drain tranny fluid tomorrow and put good stuff in along with the nulon additive, see if that makes a difference...

[ckh]

Going to drain tranny fluid tomorrow and put good stuff in along with the nulon additive, see if that makes a difference...

never having had removed a tranny sump before was an experience, there was 1 bolt which didnt want to let go.. any ways cheaned the usual off the magnet, no big chunks of mental or belt, filled it up with dex III and added the nulon tranny additive, havent diven it any distance yet to alow it to work its way around the tranny, but a couple of laps around the block and can notice a difference... not knowing what an 89 auto tranny is supposed to feel like when its running fine, I suppose it would be unrealistic to compare it my my mates 1 week old FJ cruiser, you cant even feel the gear changes.. Did some googling and found how to put tranny into its self diagnostic mode, got 10 quick flashes of the power like to all test passed... Might look at getting a proper service done in the next few months, as I couldnt see or find any "filter" when I had the sump off, plus engraved in the sump was the name of an auto place and the date of 27-11-97, so might have been a while since its had a service and needs belts tensioned and adjusted etc....

[93patrol]

i had an VK dunnydore and every time i put it in for an auto service they adjusted the clutch bands around the auto because they were loose and cause to tranny to pause then shift which gave it a clunk, that was about the time to put it in to get it serviced and in the end i learnt how to do it myself. maybe this is one of the things wrong would definately get a autotrans service by a pro done though they will also adjust or fix your park switch as well.

[lhurley]

Might look at getting a proper service done in the next few months, as I couldnt see or find any "filter" when I had the sump off, plus engraved in the sump was the name of an auto place and the date of 27-11-97, so might have been a while since its had a service and needs belts tensioned and adjusted etc....

Im not sure on what the older gq's tranny looks like, but the auto in mine gu (i think they are very similar) the filter is a flat metal filter, right in the middle. it has 4 or 5 bolts holding it in from memory.

Keep in mind that when you changed your oil you only changed about 50%. the reason being the majority of the oil is in the torque converter and doesnt get released unless you remove the converter, which requires removing the enitre box. Dont get me wrong, if your oil was cactus the change will be good for it. The auto takes about 12L of oil from dry, and i would assume you took out about 5-6L, better then no change, but still pays to get it done by a pro.

[04OFF]

Some mechcanical workshops have a machine they can hook up to change all the Auto fluid without removing the box/converter, (automatic transmission fluid change machine), you disconnect a cooler line and connect machine to both open ends.

This machine captures the old auto fluid, and replaces it with new fluid while the car is running, so refreshes whats in the converter as well as whats in the pan , you still need to pull the pan off to replace the strainer/filter tho.

[ckh]

Hard shift between 1 and 2 could be shift solenoid or your tps is out of adjustment, before you go spending $$$ on a service try a nulon auto transmission treatment to try and soften the seals to ease the shift.
Did as you said put nulon additive in now torque converter wont lock up, spoke to a traany specialist and he pulled a strange face when i told him I put nulon in, he said its tooooo slippery for a transmission with an auto locking torque converter, at around 85-90 I get a shudder like its trying to lock up, but then it gives up, so now on the highway my engine is 600RMP higher than when it used to lock up at 100, at 100 it would sit on 1800RPM now its sitting on 2400RPM Am going to do a complete flush of the tranny today hoping that will fix it and that in the last 600K's I've done I havent burnt out the clutch type thing in it. Just pulled the dip stick out and not sure if it was a burnt smell but it didnt smell right, just hope I havent gone frpom a slight bump to a stuffed tranny now...

[Alitis007]

Mate that nulon additive wont cause the auto to play up, i have used it in may cars with auto locking and solenoid locking converters and never had a problem. Some people like pentrite and others like the nulon just a personal preference. You could have had a hidden fault and now its starting to show it self.

If you want you can service and flush the auto your self but you will need to buy a 20ltr container of dextron 3. How i flush the auto is,
1. Drain the oil( i think there might be a drain plug on the sump) remove the pan and change the filter. I recommend you buy a kit with a paper gasket coz the cork ones can leak and you can tear the gasket if you over tighten the bolts.
2. Clean the pan and remember were the magnet sits, wipe it clean with thinners or acetone and tap the bolt holes down so they are flat again. Wipe the surface where the gasket sits again.
3. Buy some Permatex 3 aviation sealant to coat the surface of the pan where the gasket sits with a light film so it doesn't spill into the pan fit the gasket and coat the other side of that.
4. Wipe the auto were the gasket will sit with thinners or acetone and quickly fit the pan coz oil will run onto the surface it you take too long.
5. Fill the auto to the FULL HOT mark.
6. Find yourself another empty 20ltr container and remove a trans cooler hose.
7. Now you will need two people for the rest of this procedure, start the car and turn it off and see which way the auto pumps the fluid. You want the oil to flow thru the cooler/ coolers.
8. Once you have found the flow hold the hose into the empty container and start the car and put into Drive so the auto pumps the oil out, the oil at first will come out in a thick stream after 5 or 10 seconds it should start to become less so turn off the car. MAKE SURE YOU TURN THE CAR OFF AS SOON AS THE OIL STREAM IS NOT THICK OR YOU WILL BURN THE AUTO OUT.
9. Repeat step 8 until the oils clean a redish pink color and refit the cooler hose and refill the auto to full hot start the car get your helper to start the car and hold it in Drive check you oil level so its on the LOW HOT mark then take it for a 5 min drive and re check your oil level.

Take it on the free way and see how it locks up, in economy it should lock up at around 75 80 in power around 90 100, hope this helps

[ckh]

Mate that nulon additive wont cause the auto to play up, i have used it in may cars with auto locking and solenoid locking converters and never had a problem. Some people like pentrite and others like the nulon just a personal preference. You could have had a hidden fault and now its starting to show it self.

If you want you can service and flush the auto your self but you will need to buy a 20ltr container of dextron 3. How i flush the auto is,
1. Drain the oil( i think there might be a drain plug on the sump) remove the pan and change the filter. I recommend you buy a kit with a paper gasket coz the cork ones can leak and you can tear the gasket if you over tighten the bolts.
2. Clean the pan and remember were the magnet sits, wipe it clean with thinners or acetone and tap the bolt holes down so they are flat again. Wipe the surface where the gasket sits again.
3. Buy some Permatex 3 aviation sealant to coat the surface of the pan where the gasket sits with a light film so it doesn't spill into the pan fit the gasket and coat the other side of that.
4. Wipe the auto were the gasket will sit with thinners or acetone and quickly fit the pan coz oil will run onto the surface it you take too long.
5. Fill the auto to the FULL HOT mark.
6. Find yourself another empty 20ltr container and remove a trans cooler hose.
7. Now you will need two people for the rest of this procedure, start the car and turn it off and see which way the auto pumps the fluid. You want the oil to flow thru the cooler/ coolers.
8. Once you have found the flow hold the hose into the empty container and start the car and put into Drive so the auto pumps the oil out, the oil at first will come out in a thick stream after 5 or 10 seconds it should start to become less so turn off the car. MAKE SURE YOU TURN THE CAR OFF AS SOON AS THE OIL STREAM IS NOT THICK OR YOU WILL BURN THE AUTO OUT.
9. Repeat step 8 until the oils clean a redish pink color and refit the cooler hose and refill the auto to full hot start the car get your helper to start the car and hold it in Drive check you oil level so its on the LOW HOT mark then take it for a 5 min drive and re check your oil level.

Take it on the free way and see how it locks up, in economy it should lock up at around 75 80 in power around 90 100, hope this helps

Although the auto specialist said i would be pissing in the wind doing a flush, I did, exactly as you said above 20ltr container from repco, cost me 145, just took it for a drive and doing exactly same thing, first time i take it up to around 90 felt a shudder like it was trying to lock up lasted about 5-10 seconds then stopped, the tranny guy said the damage is already done, he is going to test it on the 9th which is the earliest i can get it booked in, and testing will be around 100, its just a killer at the moment not locing up on the highway as it used to sit on 1800 doing 100 now its around 2400 doing a hunred, and I can tell the fuel economy is nearly halved...

A mate is trying to talk me into converting it to a manual, but thats going to cost 2K+ the tranny guy said he cant give me a fixed price on a rebuild if necessary until he takes the box off and see whats what and in what condition inside, he said the highest he ever charged anyone for a full rebuild was 3600. Do I grin and bear it and if needed get it fixed somehow, if I have to take out a loan or whatever, or should I look at start selling the truck, I’m confused and depressed, as if I sell the truck I could be getting something that’s going to give me even more grief, if I get it fixed, basically it’s got a new motor and gearbox in it and I’d be right for the major stuff for the next 20 years + if I looked after it. Driving around town the torque locker doesn’t kick in until ya get to 80-85-90ish, so around town won’t be any different now compared to if it was working perfectly, its only on the highway it’s going to kill me in fuel more so and do possible more damage to the gear box…

[Alitis007]

[QUOTE=ckh;308276]Although the auto specialist said i would be pissing in the wind doing a flush, I did, exactly as you said above 20ltr container from repco, cost me 145, just took it for a drive and doing exactly same thing, first time i take it up to around 90 felt a shudder like it was trying to lock up lasted about 5-10 seconds then stopped, the tranny guy said the damage is already done, he is going to test it on the 9th which is the earliest i can get it booked in, and testing will be around 100, its just a killer at the moment not locing up on the highway as it used to sit on 1800 doing 100 now its around 2400 doing a hunred, and I can tell the fuel economy is nearly halved...

A mate is trying to talk me into converting it to a manual, but thats going to cost 2K+ the tranny guy said he cant give me a fixed price on a rebuild if necessary until he takes the box off and see whats what and in what condition inside, he said the highest he ever charged anyone for a full rebuild was 3600. Do I grin and bear it and if needed get it fixed somehow, if I have to take out a loan or whatever, or should I look at start selling the truck, I

[ckh]

example of difference in highway running at 2400 rpm instead of 1800rpm, only got 350 out of last tank instead of usual 450+

[Alitis007]

If ur hard set on a manual buy a wreck of a truck with a blown motor so you have all the gear but this time of year you will pay thru the nose for everything but your best bet is to get a second hand auto, it will be the cheaper option.

[ckh]

If ur hard set on a manual buy a wreck of a truck with a blown motor so you have all the gear but this time of year you will pay thru the nose for everything but your best bet is to get a second hand auto, it will be the cheaper option.

I prefer auto, I just commented that a mate was trying to talk me into converting to manual...

[ckh]

Mate that nulon additive wont cause the auto to play up, i have used it in may cars with auto locking and solenoid locking converters and never had a problem. Some people like pentrite and others like the nulon just a personal preference. You could have had a hidden fault and now its starting to show it self.

If you want you can service and flush the auto your self but you will need to buy a 20ltr container of dextron 3. How i flush the auto is,
1. Drain the oil( i think there might be a drain plug on the sump) remove the pan and change the filter. I recommend you buy a kit with a paper gasket coz the cork ones can leak and you can tear the gasket if you over tighten the bolts.
2. Clean the pan and remember were the magnet sits, wipe it clean with thinners or acetone and tap the bolt holes down so they are flat again. Wipe the surface where the gasket sits again.
3. Buy some Permatex 3 aviation sealant to coat the surface of the pan where the gasket sits with a light film so it doesn't spill into the pan fit the gasket and coat the other side of that.
4. Wipe the auto were the gasket will sit with thinners or acetone and quickly fit the pan coz oil will run onto the surface it you take too long.
5. Fill the auto to the FULL HOT mark.
6. Find yourself another empty 20ltr container and remove a trans cooler hose.
7. Now you will need two people for the rest of this procedure, start the car and turn it off and see which way the auto pumps the fluid. You want the oil to flow thru the cooler/ coolers.
8. Once you have found the flow hold the hose into the empty container and start the car and put into Drive so the auto pumps the oil out, the oil at first will come out in a thick stream after 5 or 10 seconds it should start to become less so turn off the car. MAKE SURE YOU TURN THE CAR OFF AS SOON AS THE OIL STREAM IS NOT THICK OR YOU WILL BURN THE AUTO OUT.
9. Repeat step 8 until the oils clean a redish pink color and refit the cooler hose and refill the auto to full hot start the car get your helper to start the car and hold it in Drive check you oil level so its on the LOW HOT mark then take it for a 5 min drive and re check your oil level.

Take it on the free way and see how it locks up, in economy it should lock up at around 75 80 in power around 90 100, hope this helps

ok changed the filter today although look at the old one, it didnt look clogged and could run fluid through it with no restriction. nothing on magnet since last time i had it off a fortnight ago,put pan back on and filled it up. took it fdor a test drive and still wont lock up. when i had the pan off check and double checked for any loose or disconntect wires. might try running a wire as suggested to manually engage the lock up and see how that goes.

am leaning towards the converter it self is stuffed, but the tranny guy on the 9th should be able to tell me ya or nah when he does his diagnostics.
has any one else got any other ideas?

[ckh]

TPS is a Throttle Position Sensor, I think you mentioned yours is carby so it won't have one.

can you post a pic of the Throttle Position Sensor so i can check if mine is the problem,

[taslucas]

TPS is a Throttle Position Sensor, I think you mentioned yours is carby so it won't have one.

The carby models DO have a throttle position sensor.
A black box on the side of the carby that the main butterfly shaft goes into. It also has wires coming out. You can adjust it by loosening two screws and rotating left or right. This makes the auto change gears at slightly different times.

Tap, crackle, pop

[ckh]

can some one post me a pic please...

[NissanGQ4.2]

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/showthread.php?11693-GQ-Over-Reving

Look at Post # 8

Mine is an EFI and looks like the second pic

Cheers

Todd

[ckh]

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/showthread.php?11693-GQ-Over-Reving

Look at Post # 8

Mine is an EFI and looks like the second pic

Cheers

Todd
reading tnhat thread the guy states that i need a new carby !!!!!!! I hope not!!!!!!!!!!!

[Alitis007]

reading tnhat thread the guy states that i need a new carby !!!!!!! I hope not!!!!!!!!!!!

His fault was the carby but there was a pic of the TPS for petrol and diesel.