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Thread: Engine Conversion Certification

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    Engine Conversion Certification

    My patrol is on its way back from WA after getting a Chev Engine transplant. Its currently running 32" tyres. Can I get it certified for 33" or 35" as part of the process of the Victorian Eng certification process or are 35" tyres universally unroadworthy in Vic? I am going to move to a larger diameter once the 32" wear out. I understand there is a 3" rule, being 2" on tyre diameter from standard, or 1" radius, then 2" lift on springs. If 35" tyres are unroadworthy in Vic, how can they be sold also - curious.

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    Just because you can buy something doesn't make it legal.
    You can buy a car that does more than the speed limit, but it illegal to speed. You can also buy super low springs, but that is also illegal to fit.
    I'll let @mudski get into the lift and height requirements as he has just got he's engineered or there is a thread on that very topic.

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    You can get anything engineered. 6inch lift and 37's if you want. But. A VASS approved engineer will only engineer a vehicle using the VSB14 rules. Which the the Vehicles Standard Bulletin. Within these rules the maximum tyre allowance is 33inch. a 285 or a 305, as these have the same rolling diameter. A 315 is classed as a 35 so they are a no go. As for lift, 2inch is as big as you can go is suspension with 285's or 305's without an engineers, equate to 3inch in total. VASS engineers will only approve lifts of up to 4inch for suspension and 285's or 305's for tyres.
    From my findings the only way to get 35's approved the right way, is to spend about 15k on Portal axles.
    So to my first part, you can technically get any engineer to do the check over your car and approve it, if it passes. But you then need to hand over the certificate to Vic Roads. They will know if the engineer is approved or not and can refuse the certificate on the spot, and make you tow the vehicle home. Even if they do let it through, the boys in blue can't refuse the certificate given by your engineer, but they can contact Vic Roads and make them aware of this and Vic Roads can make your new certificate nul and void when it suits them. With a VASS approved engineers certificate, both parties cannot refuse the validity of your certificate as it has been approved according to VSB14.

    Rules and regs do change from state to state.

    Read this link regarding different laws.
    http://www.outbacktravelaustralia.co...dated-jan-2014

    Also see this link for our discussion thread....
    http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...lowed-what-not

    Hope this helps.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mudski View Post
    You can get anything engineered. 6inch lift and 37's if you want. But. A VASS approved engineer will only engineer a vehicle using the VSB14 rules. Which the the Vehicles Standard Bulletin. Within these rules the maximum tyre allowance is 33inch. a 285 or a 305, as these have the same rolling diameter. A 315 is classed as a 35 so they are a no go. As for lift, 2inch is as big as you can go is suspension with 285's or 305's without an engineers, equate to 3inch in total. VASS engineers will only approve lifts of up to 4inch for suspension and 285's or 305's for tyres.
    From my findings the only way to get 35's approved the right way, is to spend about 15k on Portal axles.
    So to my first part, you can technically get any engineer to do the check over your car and approve it, if it passes. But you then need to hand over the certificate to Vic Roads. They will know if the engineer is approved or not and can refuse the certificate on the spot, and make you tow the vehicle home. Even if they do let it through, the boys in blue can't refuse the certificate given by your engineer, but they can contact Vic Roads and make them aware of this and Vic Roads can make your new certificate nul and void when it suits them. With a VASS approved engineers certificate, both parties cannot refuse the validity of your certificate as it has been approved according to VSB14.

    Rules and regs do change from state to state.

    Read this link regarding different laws.
    http://www.outbacktravelaustralia.co...dated-jan-2014

    Also see this link for our discussion thread....
    http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...lowed-what-not

    Hope this helps.
    Mudski,

    thanks for the clarification. I am pretty sure that 33" is my limit anyway and when my 32" tyres run down thats what I will live with. I like the 'look' of the portals but have no real need them, and certainly no desire right now after forking out for the Brunswick conversion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PBBIZ2 View Post
    Mudski,

    thanks for the clarification. I am pretty sure that 33" is my limit anyway and when my 32" tyres run down thats what I will live with. I like the 'look' of the portals but have no real need them, and certainly no desire right now after forking out for the Brunswick conversion.
    No worries. 33inch is your limit. No questions on that. In hindsight, I the amount of coin I spent on a TD rebuild and conversion I could have just about done a Brunswick Diesel. I love my TD, but a V8 Diesel is just next level shizz. In my next life....

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    Vehicle went to the VASS engineer today and whilst the end result was the engineering certificate, it wasn't without challenge. The conversion paperwork did not list a number of items he required and he outright refused to add the GVM upgrade due to insufficient documentation.

    The GVM upgrade has turned out a complete cluster from my perspective. BD did a typo on the certificate and i ended up with a GVM 500kg less than original nameplate. So name plate original is 2800kg, plus 500kg upgrade = 3300kg, BD had the original at 1750 plus 500 = 2250kg. I didn't pay any attention until I put it over the weighbridge and it came in at 2940kg. Bit of a freak out moment. Number of calls back and forth to BD and they will re-issue the GVM upgrade docs, which being a national certification sail thru Vicroads - who knows. The VASS engineer wanted axle strengths and spring rates and brake tests etc etc - I just said pls do the engine and barwork and I will sort out the GVM later. He agreed, so ended up with from and rear bars and dual winches, side rails roof rack, fuel tanks, transmission, engine and something else - escapes me.
    Had to remove the original GVM upgrade plate and send it together with the original GVM paperwork back to BD - it was a typo issue it seems but what a PIA.
    I used a guy in Hallam ECAD P/L - listed on Vicroads website. He is laid back but attentive, lots of questions, if you can't supply a receipt he grills down into the details, such as the rear spring tower stiffeners and bridge plate - who made them, who installed, when etc. As long as you have the answers and he believes its plausible he is satisfied. He prefers CASH as well, just a heads up. Total process took about 20 minutes and 5 minutes under bonnet and under car on the ground - nothing else - didn't even start or drive it. So, just waiting on revised MOD plate from BD and then off to Vicroads for the next joust.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PBBIZ2 View Post
    Vehicle went to the VASS engineer today and whilst the end result was the engineering certificate, it wasn't without challenge. The conversion paperwork did not list a number of items he required and he outright refused to add the GVM upgrade due to insufficient documentation.

    The GVM upgrade has turned out a complete cluster from my perspective. BD did a typo on the certificate and i ended up with a GVM 500kg less than original nameplate. So name plate original is 2800kg, plus 500kg upgrade = 3300kg, BD had the original at 1750 plus 500 = 2250kg. I didn't pay any attention until I put it over the weighbridge and it came in at 2940kg. Bit of a freak out moment. Number of calls back and forth to BD and they will re-issue the GVM upgrade docs, which being a national certification sail thru Vicroads - who knows. The VASS engineer wanted axle strengths and spring rates and brake tests etc etc - I just said pls do the engine and barwork and I will sort out the GVM later. He agreed, so ended up with from and rear bars and dual winches, side rails roof rack, fuel tanks, transmission, engine and something else - escapes me.
    Had to remove the original GVM upgrade plate and send it together with the original GVM paperwork back to BD - it was a typo issue it seems but what a PIA.
    I used a guy in Hallam ECAD P/L - listed on Vicroads website. He is laid back but attentive, lots of questions, if you can't supply a receipt he grills down into the details, such as the rear spring tower stiffeners and bridge plate - who made them, who installed, when etc. As long as you have the answers and he believes its plausible he is satisfied. He prefers CASH as well, just a heads up. Total process took about 20 minutes and 5 minutes under bonnet and under car on the ground - nothing else - didn't even start or drive it. So, just waiting on revised MOD plate from BD and then off to Vicroads for the next joust.
    I spoke to him when i started looking into the turbo upgrade for my TB, he was pretty good to deal with on the phone. I'm nearing completion on mine, so I'll be getting the emissions test done then it's off to him for certification.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PBBIZ2 View Post
    Vehicle went to the VASS engineer today....
    snip/
    I used a guy in Hallam ECAD P/L - listed on Vicroads website. He is laid back but attentive, lots of questions, if you can't supply a receipt he grills down into the details, such as the rear spring tower stiffeners and bridge plate - who made them, who installed, when etc. As long as you have the answers and he believes its plausible he is satisfied. He prefers CASH as well, just a heads up. Total process took about 20 minutes and 5 minutes under bonnet and under car on the ground - nothing else - didn't even start or drive it. So, just waiting on revised MOD plate from BD and then off to Vicroads for the next joust.
    He wants cash. Sounds a bit dodgy. Seen a few discussions floating around on FB about cash jobs for mod plates. Its his nuts that are on the line if he gets caught. So he signed off on the conversion without doing a brake test and checking spring rates? Again, Its his nuts that are on the line if he gets caught. Unless he's allowed to do this, which I doubt. But atleast you got it done. I thought Brunswick would have done the engineers report when doing the conversion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mudski View Post
    He wants cash. Sounds a bit dodgy. Seen a few discussions floating around on FB about cash jobs for mod plates. Its his nuts that are on the line if he gets caught. So he signed off on the conversion without doing a brake test and checking spring rates? Again, Its his nuts that are on the line if he gets caught. Unless he's allowed to do this, which I doubt. But atleast you got it done. I thought Brunswick would have done the engineers report when doing the conversion.
    The cash is an easy payment option with all that goes with it, so I suspect its perhaps not as 'dark' as perhaps you are saying, simply because the eng certificate is registered and any blow back if it were to occur has little to do with the payment method. He also takes credit card, but it wasn't working, so direct deposit was the final option, again, same numbers for each method.
    Regards what he has to do and not do, I have no idea. The brake test was required for the GVM upgrade, not the engine swap, however his issue was the lack of detail in the BD docs to validate the GVM upgrade had gone thru the same process or rigour as the Vicroads requirement. Since the GVM upgrade is a NATIONAL certification, I could not understand the challenge to be honest. The issue with spring rates were related to the engine swap for sure - he wanted documentation for front and rear springs. I gave hime the fronts as these were upgraded by BD and he simply did a web search on the part number, however the rears were accepted based on what I told him was the complete upgrade, being 400kg Dobinson coils and firestone air bags and then Superior spring tower strengthening and then tying the spring towers together and bolting thru the floor with backing plates - this he accepted instead of a receipt or validated engineering comps.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PBBIZ2 View Post
    The cash is an easy payment option with all that goes with it, so I suspect its perhaps not as 'dark' as perhaps you are saying, simply because the eng certificate is registered and any blow back if it were to occur has little to do with the payment method. He also takes credit card, but it wasn't working, so direct deposit was the final option, again, same numbers for each method.
    Regards what he has to do and not do, I have no idea. The brake test was required for the GVM upgrade, not the engine swap, however his issue was the lack of detail in the BD docs to validate the GVM upgrade had gone thru the same process or rigour as the Vicroads requirement. Since the GVM upgrade is a NATIONAL certification, I could not understand the challenge to be honest. The issue with spring rates were related to the engine swap for sure - he wanted documentation for front and rear springs. I gave hime the fronts as these were upgraded by BD and he simply did a web search on the part number, however the rears were accepted based on what I told him was the complete upgrade, being 400kg Dobinson coils and firestone air bags and then Superior spring tower strengthening and then tying the spring towers together and bolting thru the floor with backing plates - this he accepted instead of a receipt or validated engineering comps.
    Yeah cool. Might have been just how you worded it that he prefers cash. alarm bells rings when i see that. But as you explained, its all good. One thing i was told when i got mine done is its best to get everything done as it looks better on the plate with more codes to keep mr. plod happy, or happyer if thats possible. As they can see you can gone to efforts to get it done. Rather than just argue with them when they pull you up and pull their book out.

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