Why use a hook when winching??

I'm only new to 4 wheeling so bare with me if it's really obvious but my questions is; why do people use a hook on the end of their winch rope? From my understanding, you normally attach the ends of the tree trunk protector to a shackle and you attach the winch hook to that shackle. Now, we're always trying to minimise the potential for metal things to go flying so why not just go from shackle to the eye of the winch rope and skip the hook all together??? I'm also thinking about going with soft shackles to get rid of metal bits all together but that's a whole other story! :D

G’day mate! In a past life I’ve performed some horrible uneducated self & others recoveries. Thanks to this great forum and its top members my current setup for localised needs is working safe & well I believe? http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...017/12/158.jpg Still re-learning techniques every day and of course every new sticky situation we manage to get ourselves into requires paused thought and physics assessment. Stay safe, let’s keep learning together brother, Cheers Mark.


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We don't always hook onto a tree sometimes we hook onto other fourbys etc so the hook is the way to go ,most winches if not all on the Aussie market have a pretty good hook from new and from what I've seen there are more mishaps from something breaking other than the hook .
Probably one of the most dangerous things we do is using a winch so we should always be mindful of how we go about it .

Only in regards directly ‘open’ hooks onto a strap/trunk protector or soft winch extensions Rob mate I do too fear for a traction vehicle assistance jolt/slack line. Has always worried me that the ‘hook tip’ could catch/pierce anywhere on soft material once hauling momentarily commences again. I am a big believer now for us all these days of slow and steady thought out connections somewhat like Riggers & Dogman do safely skilled daily would love to learn!


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Soft shackles have been discussed on the forum. http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...=soft+shackles

For sure Craig mate! ET at it again previously giving top advice :-) Still meaning to purchase anti-recoil snatch kit kindly suggested although most time these days is spent winch hauling moderators out of the seasonal snow drifts via double block back to track:-)


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Originally Posted by jp4294

I'm only new to 4 wheeling so bare with me if it's really obvious but my questions is; why do people use a hook on the end of their winch rope? From my understanding, you normally attach the ends of the tree trunk protector to a shackle and you attach the winch hook to that shackle. Now, we're always trying to minimise the potential for metal things to go flying so why not just go from shackle to the eye of the winch rope and skip the hook all together??? I'm also thinking about going with soft shackles to get rid of metal bits all together but that's a whole other story! :D

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If you have a moused hook then don't use a shackle just put the strap loops into the hook.
If you have a hook that is attached by a clevis pin or otherwise to the winch line then take the hook off, stow it somewhere and use the eye, you will find you will use the eye more often than the hook anyway.

If you use the hook beware you don't tip load it IE make sure the load is inline with the winch cable pull.
If you use shackles then use D for Chain and Bow for Straps
If you attach your winch line to the shackle pin then you may want to pack the shackle pin so the line is centred esp if it is a metal thimble

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MB

For sure Craig mate! ET at it again previously giving top advice :-) Still meaning to purchase anti-recoil snatch kit kindly suggested although most time these days is spent winch hauling moderators out of the seasonal snow drifts via double block back to track:-)


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What is this 'anti recoil snatch kit' you are talking about MB? What I don't see anyone using, including me, is a back-up line when winching, in case the winch rope snaps. This is a standard 'rig' i believe in the Vic police 4wd training. tricky for you to do I reckon as it would need to be constantly adjusted so the actual break load or kinetic energy is kept to a minimum. I raise this specifically with the wide use of synthetic ropes. I have found the wire cable less damaged from abrasion whilst running across rocks and thru dirt, however understanding this is only a snap-shot visual assessment, not after constant use. What I also note is the UV affected ropes on vehicles that sit in the sun and winch rope leeches out and weakens. Bit of a divergence I know from the topic but related. I have my rope covered with a piece of 2ply conveyor belt, held in place with a couple of loose fitting cable ties - works well and easily flipped up when the winch is in use. I will take a couple of photos over the weekend and post.

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Originally Posted by PeeBee

What is this 'anti recoil snatch kit' you are talking about MB? .

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ET kindly posted a link a while back to a WA kit manufacturer mate. The snatch strap had additional teathers each end stitched in that were shackeld to secondary chassis points. If the snatches bow shackles or points failed for whatever reason these teathers caught everything and saved the day!


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Piccy of a Bridle and a Snatchie with anti-recoil straps all set up

NB I use soft shackles unless one of the parties is unhappy and wants to use rated forged suckers

Attachment 74082

My recovery doodads, the 50 ton strap is in case I have to recover a Road Train or Mine Haulpak ;)

Attachment 74084

Thanks ET, I think I will have to set one of these up to really understand the failsafe. Is there a purple strap doubled on itself thru the eye of the two straps to the vehicle and then thru the ey of the tow strap? How are the thin blue tethers secured to the straps - simply tied?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by PeeBee

Thanks ET, I think I will have to set one of these up to really understand the failsafe. Is there a purple strap doubled on itself thru the eye of the two straps to the vehicle and then thru the ey of the tow strap? How are the thin blue tethers secured to the straps - simply tied?

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Hiya Cobber,

There aren't two straps to the vehicle, it is a standard equaliser bridle setup

The anti-recoil tethers are sewn onto the respective bridle or snatch strap approx 1 metre back from the rolled eye.

The 'purple' on the equaliser bridle is a protective sleeve that you can slide to the appropriate point.

Setup is simple, you just attach the anti-recoil strap eyes to a separate point from the 'snatch' anchor point/s.
I use soft shackles preferably.
If the anti-recoil strap isn't long enough for some reason you can use rope or a sling or whatever to lengthen

Takes all of 30 seconds and no need to rrse around with dampers

Quote:

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Originally Posted by the evil twin

Hiya Cobber,

There aren't two straps to the vehicle, it is a standard equaliser bridle setup

The anti-recoil tethers are sewn onto the respective bridle or snatch strap approx 1 metre back from the rolled eye.

The 'purple' on the equaliser bridle is a protective sleeve that you can slide to the appropriate point.

Setup is simple, you just attach the anti-recoil strap eyes to a separate point from the 'snatch' anchor point/s.
I use soft shackles preferably.
If the anti-recoil strap isn't long enough for some reason you can use rope or a sling or whatever to lengthen

Takes all of 30 seconds and no need to rrse around with dampers

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Thanks for that, where do I buy one or search for bridle strap?

Here’s ET’s advice to all from a keyword search here mate: http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum...017/12/163.jpg The link doesn’t appear to be working in the old thread anymore but Google has found it again, Cheers ET! http://www.comsew.com.au/products/4x4-recover-kit/


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Thanks Mark, found them on ebay a moment ago.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by the evil twin

If you have a moused hook then don't use a shackle just put the strap loops into the hook.
If you have a hook that is attached by a clevis pin or otherwise to the winch line then take the hook off, stow it somewhere and use the eye, you will find you will use the eye more often than the hook anyway.
If you use the hook beware you don't tip load it IE make sure the load is inline with the winch cable pull.
If you use shackles then use D for Chain and Bow for Straps
If you attach your winch line to the shackle pin then you may want to pack the shackle pin so the line is centered esp if it is a metal thimble

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A lot of unknown vocabulary here for me. Can someone help me understand these?

"If you have a moused hook..." What type of hook is that?

"If you have a hook that is attached by a clevis pin..." I kind of think I know this one, but I'd rather confirm... Is this that pin that is locked by an aluminium wire similar to castle nuts locking pin?

"If you use shackles then use D for Chain and Bow for Straps" This one I am completely lost.

"If you attach your winch line to the shackle pin then you may want to pack the shackle pin so the line is centered esp if it is a metal thimble" What does he means with pack the shackle pin?

Thanks!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BrazilianY60

A lot of unknown vocabulary here for me. Can someone help me understand these?


Thanks!

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Your lucky that @MB ; didn’t try to explain it then. Lol. We’d all be confused. Haha!


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by mudski

Your lucky that MB didn’t try to explain it then. Lol. We’d all be confused. Haha!

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Lol.
There is still time for that. @MB please translate the above for the fella. Thanks.

Interesting

I recall seeing somewhere (can't recall where) a test of these 're-coil' tether thingies. They provided little or no help when required in anger. They just snapped without slowing the projectile portion significantly.
It seems logical that they would not provide much advantage as they are much weaker than the original protected part which just snapped for some reason, and they would be hit with a huge sudden impact. And the secondary anchor points to which they are attached would probably be somewhat poorer than the main recovery points.
Has anyone actually seem these deployed in a real life situation? Did they work?

5 Years Later Posting …..Personally haven’t seen a destruction test BB Mate [emoji22]
I would imagine that quality straps and strategic stitching would be key to structural integrity?
BZ Mate, in regards to Mouses/Mice, simply means in this scenario I believe a locking mechanism on your winch hook, and or any tow hook to stop your say strap connection jumping out. FWIW: Personally don’t trust soft/tin mice to keep my connections on anymore [emoji2959]
In regards ‘Shackles’ BZ Mate, the best I can nuffy describe it late here is that ‘chain’ looks like two letter ‘C’s conjoined to make an elongated flat edge oval.
The best way to join chain is to Mimic it with a D shackle.
Bow Shackles I believe were designed for connections requiring wider/round sling/strap type rigging connections.
ET (Evil Twins [emoji120][emoji120] ) Safety Advice:
I have learnt the hard way with little trailer machines breaking ‘bow shackle’ chain connection points due to incorrect pressure alignment.

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum.../2022/06/6.jpg


http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forum.../2022/06/7.jpg


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