NissanPatrol.com.au club?

[Ben81C]

Has there been any thought given to turning this site into a club? You could run a national club with state by state chapters i suppose you could say, we could even have some sort of annual comp or something? Just a thought.

[Bigrig]

Personally, outside of the inevitable insurance etc discussions, I love the idea mate!!!! (Applause).

Not sure on other states, but "build it and they will come" (to quote one of the worst movies ever made - anything with Kevin Costner for that matter!! lmao) and in QLD I have 38 members contact numbers alone (24 patrols at the last full meet) and whilst I can't, nor would ever, speak on their behalf I personally would love to see it ... no offence to others as they are all awesome in their own right, but there's a club I'd join!

[NissanGQ4.2]

I would join 2, but an annual comp......mmmmmmmmm TANK ( Bigrig's Rig ) against my un named un loved Rig............mmmmm .....TANK would be at the finish line before mine started!!!!!

[Ben81C]

All good we could orginise some bikini clad girls to distract the serious competition and romp home to glory and silverware LOL

[AB]

I would love to have a club but with insurances these days I just never gave it much thought. Kind of put it in the too hard basket with legal issues, etc.

Would love to hear from any club owners or more information and costs involved in running a club and covering the club too????

[Ben81C]

Does getting stickers made and available for sale on this website constitute a legitimate club in terms of insurance??? Or create a levy for "site maintenance"n on joining or posting x number of times could earn you a windscreen or some sort of "club" id. At least then i would know who to throw mud at when leaving car parks! I don't mean over complicate the whole thing its already doing all it needs to. Just be good to see who else is on board on the road. If you asked nicely i reckon Nissan themselves may help with it. Great advertising for them, and you already do that.

[Ben81C]

windscreen sticker i meant

[AB]

Yeah mate It's a great idea..... I'm trying to land a deal with helping someone completely revamp their signage companies site in exchange for a lot of barn door stickers. If I can land this deal I can probably get a bucket load of vinyl cut and carry paper to then hand out to members.

It's just a nightmare trying to meet up with this bloke as we are both too busy....lol

[Bigrig]

Is there precedence of a club 'starting' life initially as an online forum? Suppose the trips and everything we do now constitutes enough of a 'group' mentality that we at least see ourselves as a club without formal recognition and legal/insurance issues.

We have the strikers for the forum to go on windshields etc and many have these already.

Hmmmm ... I think it's more of a discussion around what true benefits comes from being a recognised club as opposed to simply a 'group of mates' who venture out together etc ...

Food for thought no doubt ... the club concept would definitely promote more of a monthly meet process etc for members as opposed to random meet ups ...

I'd be willing to throw up my hand to organise a centralised monthly meeting location in Brisbane to at least test the waters and see what comes ... semi-formal agenda with a sausage sizzle etc just to get people together and do what manly men do ...

[Silver]

What follows are just my musings, and I do not intend to get up anyone's nose :-)

Unincorporated associations have joint and several liability, although commonly people looking to sue go for office bearers/committee members, and presumably anyone who looks like they have a few bucks.

The minute this forum looks like an unincorporated association, I am out of here. As it is the trips and get togethers make me slightly nervous.

If you are looking at going down the incorporated club process, then there are fees and constitutions and compulsory insurance and all that stuff. If that happens, can we please give the constitutional issues to a sub committee who really care about fighting about that stuff, and leave the fun stuff for the rest? I saw a major club in NSW in the '70s nearly fall over because meetings got bogged down in constitutional issues that only a small, but exceptionally dedicated group gave a fig about.

Speaking only for myself, if I wanted to join a club, I'd join one of the excellent ones that are already up and running.

[rottodiver]

i really like the idea.... only downfull i can see is there are quite a few people on here that are already committed to a certain 4wd club, would that start to strain a few loyalties???
i cant wait to be out on a track and run into someone else with a nissan patrol sticker..... i am always looking!!!

Scotty

[Bigrig]

What follows are just my musings, and I do not intend to get up anyone's nose :-)

Unincorporated associations have joint and several liability, although commonly people looking to sue go for office bearers/committee members, and presumably anyone who looks like they have a few bucks.

The minute this forum looks like an unincorporated association, I am out of here. As it is the trips and get togethers make me slightly nervous.

If you are looking at going down the incorporated club process, then there are fees and constitutions and compulsory insurance and all that stuff. If that happens, can we please give the constitutional issues to a sub committee who really care about fighting about that stuff, and leave the fun stuff for the rest? I saw a major club in NSW in the '70s nearly fall over because meetings got bogged down in constitutional issues that only a small, but exceptionally dedicated group gave a fig about.

Speaking only for myself, if I wanted to join a club, I'd join one of the excellent ones that are already up and running.

Top post mate mate and not getting up anyone's nose I'd reckon - like the thought and knowing your history, the subtle promotion of thought for things other than simple "that'd be great".

Have to ask though - why the concern over current trips etc? The forum is simply a form of communication media no different to texting or the telephone itself (at this stage) and subsequently, any participation in a trip is voluntary, unsolicited, and without arbitrary requisites that would constitute liability on any individual other than the owner (so long as we're travelling to "legal" locations), so enlighten myself, and others I'm sure, on the risk??

Genuine question as you know I love this sort of stuff, and quite frankly, always wanting to hear the 'other side' of any discussion.

[the evil twin]

snip...
Is there precedence of a club 'starting' life initially as an online forum?



Substitue "from" for "as" and that is almost exactly how the Western Patrol Club formed.

Couple of people with Patrols having a chat at a popular spot... post on Patrol 4X4 Forum seeking EOI and advertising an informal meet up to appoint a mob to get it happening and... voila... our 4th Birthday was 2 months ago.

Having a lot of years experience in the world of Incorporated Associations if I may offer a word or three of advice.
Do NOT even go ANY further than EOI without incorporating.
Public Liability Insurance can be suprisingly affordable (expect a number around $20 to $40 per member depending) but is only a small part of the heartaches in setting up a Club.

A few IMHO's if I may...
I agree with Silver in that joining an existing 'local' Club is prob preferable.
I'd let the Forum be the Forum, proudly wack up a sticker or whatever if you wish.
Running a national club with state chapters will be a huge administrative task to comply with legislation etc so unless some very dedicated and knowledgeable people step up it will be tough.
I guarantee there will inevitably be a poo fight at some point between Forumites who don't want to be Clubbies and Clubbies who develop a sense of "ownership" of the Forum... sure the Mods can stamp it out but nobody wins if it happens.
It will be almost impossible to get a Club Conny that has the same objectives as the Forum, one is an association of equals and the other is a vision of an owner administered by appointed Mods.

Bottom Line (again IMHO)
If one was to try and do it I would advocate the best way is set up a Club as a totally seperate legal entity but with a memo of understanding between the Forum owner and the Club regards use of Letterhead, Logos, Forum Content etc etc. IE try and make the two as seamless as possible.

Me, I like it the way it is but no biggee and I have enough on my plate as a member of one Club :thumbup:

[AB]

the best way is set up a Club as a totally seperate legal entity but with a memo of understanding between the Forum owner and the Club

I like this sentence the best ET.....100% agree with your post and especially this bit!!!....lol

[Bigrig]

Substitue "from" for "as" and that is almost exactly how the Western Patrol Club formed.

Couple of people with Patrols having a chat at a popular spot... post on Patrol 4X4 Forum seeking EOI and advertising an informal meet up to appoint a mob to get it happening and... voila... our 4th Birthday was 2 months ago.

Having a lot of years experience in the world of Incorporated Associations if I may offer a word or three of advice.
Do NOT even go ANY further than EOI without incorporating.
Public Liability Insurance can be suprisingly affordable (expect a number around $20 to $40 per member depending) but is only a small part of the heartaches in setting up a Club.

A few IMHO's if I may...
I agree with Silver in that joining an existing 'local' Club is prob preferable.
I'd let the Forum be the Forum, proudly wack up a sticker or whatever if you wish.
Running a national club with state chapters will be a huge administrative task to comply with legislation etc so unless some very dedicated and knowledgeable people step up it will be tough.
I guarantee there will inevitably be a poo fight at some point between Forumites who don't want to be Clubbies and Clubbies who develop a sense of "ownership" of the Forum... sure the Mods can stamp it out but nobody wins if it happens.
It will be almost impossible to get a Club Conny that has the same objectives as the Forum, one is an association of equals and the other is a vision of an owner administered by appointed Mods.

Bottom Line (again IMHO)
If one was to try and do it I would advocate the best way is set up a Club as a totally seperate legal entity but with a memo of understanding between the Forum owner and the Club regards use of Letterhead, Logos, Forum Content etc etc. IE try and make the two as seamless as possible.

Me, I like it the way it is but no biggee and I have enough on my plate as a member of one Club :thumbup:

Full kudos to you old mate! Great post, and great food for thought.

[Ben81C]

Points well made. Its sad that clubs need to carry the responsibility for members actions, and i guess it already is to an extent, just without the legal ramifications and insurance burden on the group as a whole. Provides a platform for networking and all that.
Great work as is i say, stickers for on road id would be pretty cool though.
Ben

[the evil twin]

snip...
Have to ask though - why the concern over current trips etc? The forum is simply a form of communication media no different to texting or the telephone itself (at this stage) and subsequently, any participation in a trip is voluntary, unsolicited, and without arbitrary requisites that would constitute liability on any individual other than the owner (so long as we're travelling to "legal" locations), so enlighten myself, and others I'm sure, on the risk??

Genuine question as you know I love this sort of stuff, and quite frankly, always wanting to hear the 'other side' of any discussion.

Hiya Cobber,

I wasn't going to post about trips and liabilities etc but as the subject is out I gotta say I agree with Silver. There is a need to be a tad careful. There is an arguable difference between texts or phone calls between individuals known to each other and open invitations.
Uuuummmm I'll try and explain it like this... you are going fishing.
You ring your mates who you know and ask them to come along
or
You can pop an ad in the local paper which has published several letters (posts) from you in the fishing section and has even asked for your opinions on tackle tests (anyone running 34 inch Gobbledock ATZ's, what are they like?) so many readers have already formed opinions on your experience and ability to catch 10 kilo flathead.

The deal is that 999 times out of a 1000 a friendly outing will end the way it started with a heap of gratitude from the invitees. It is the 1 in 1000 that you need to have covered your ass (and donkey and mule)
Clubs do that by Insurance and Rules.
Individuals have to do it by using good judgement and a taddy bit of luck.

[the evil twin]

I like this sentence the best ET.....100% agree with your post and especially this bit!!!....lol

ROFL... thought you might.

If it helps anyone thinking about forming a Club... my Club is a Patrols Only club for better or worse and it works for us. Indeed we are the only single marque Club in the WA4WDA. All other Clubs have dropped particular ownership requirements but our common ground is Patrols sama sama this Forum. In our Club no Patrol means no can join.

I also believe but could be wrong that the Nissan Patrol Clubs that exist in other states are no longer single marque either. This leads me to say that if anyone wants to set up a Patrol Club, especially if you want it aligned with the Forum then I say go for it but you'll have to duke it out with AB over the fine print.

[Ben81C]

All fair and good, i was just asking, seem to have opened a bit of a can of worms.
A shame its so complex i guess, on the other hand the forum clearly functions well as is so why push the envelope.
From the responses it seems to me a fair bit of thought has gone into it already, perhaps in front of a fire somewhere down a track. Sounds like that's the Best place for it.
Safe and uncomplicated.

[Finly Owner]

Well as much as I would be happy to have those I have met in a club withme, I think I prefer the meet ups and outings(although i haven't been on any tracks with BigRig & Duck leadingthe way) with flexible boundaries, unity in no's, and acceptance of all skill levels,models of rigs, and body shapes of humans. As we gather as friends, almost family waving the banner for this Great Forum. Which by the way supports Clubs bt allowing their word of type advertising here.



Tim

[Silver]

All fair and good, i was just asking, seem to have opened a bit of a can of worms.
A shame its so complex i guess, on the other hand the forum clearly functions well as is so why push the envelope.
From the responses it seems to me a fair bit of thought has gone into it already, perhaps in front of a fire somewhere down a track. Sounds like that's the Best place for it.
Safe and uncomplicated.

Not at all, Ben, really pleased you raised it - clearly there is some support for it, too.

Rick

[Bigrig]

Well as much as I would be happy to have those I have met in a club withme, I think I prefer the meet ups and outings(although i haven't been on any tracks with BigRig & Duck leadingthe way) with flexible boundaries, unity in no's, and acceptance of all skill levels,models of rigs, and body shapes of humans. As we gather as friends, almost family waving the banner for this Great Forum. Which by the way supports Clubs bt allowing their word of type advertising here.



Tim

Yep, like ET stated, have to be unlucky, but it does happen. That said, I'm with you. I like our outings and generally attended by people I refer to as mates - not strangers. So the first time someone comes out (as those of you who've been with me know anyway), it's "softly, softly" with a whole lot of "only you know you mate" when discussing a certain obstacle, hill, etc.

I know we live in a world of litigation, and having read this, its all probably to be thrown in the 'too hard basket', but I love our trips, I relish the time with my 'mates', and I have a bloody ball ... that is enough for me and I'll continue to play it safe, never coerce others, ensure safety is paramount, but most importantly, enjoy what it is we do ... shame to think that could turn pear shaped to the point of being sued, but the reward is worth the risk ... my opinion ONLY, and I place full responsibility on the one person absolutely, unequivocally responsible for the safety of myself and my rig ... me!!

I think most feel the same way, but I guess it's not until the worst of situations where this can (and does) go to poo that some people would go down a different path seeking someone else to take accountability for their decisions ... shame, shame, shame (in the fine words of Derryn Hinch!!! lol).

[Woof]

Having held various roles, including Vice President of the Western Patrol Club and seen what it takes to run a club at a committee level, it is not as easy as some think.
There are legal, financial issues to deal with, as well as trying to cater to all members interests.....if we decided to go down that track then I personally would be out of here in a flash.
Please lets just keep it the way it is, members with a common interest, the NISSAN PATROL.

[Maxhead]

I hate politics...that is all :)

[Sir Roofy]

One reason this forum is so popular is because it is a forum
no hassels no politics or religon,its free its family its open
to every one,why would you want to spoil that

[belzi82]

All good we could orginise some bikini clad girls to distract the serious competition and romp home to glory and silverware LOL

So What do the female members get to look at??? hehhehee

[NissanGQ4.2]

So What do the female members get to look at??? hehhehee

ME of course.............................you can look just not touch *LMAO*

[belzi82]

A few ex-friends and I started up a club, so know about the financial costs, etc and it is hard work.

I prefer the forum to a club because it is minus the politics and we don't have to get pre-approval for trips and then run a pre-trip before the the actual trip!

[Clunk]

For me, personally I'd say keep it as a forum only.... I'm a member of one club already and that's enough, I find it difficult enough as it is to make it to their trips. It's great to meet up withe members on here from WA but let's not have politics and what not get in the way of the friendships we have on here. I think it would spoil it.

[Silver]

So What do the female members get to look at??? hehhehee

Hello belzi82,

I typed 'male members'............ but it doesn't read right :-) .

So, instead, I say the discerning females can look at the rest of us.

Take me for instance, 110 kgs of superbly relaxed muscle :-), and I imagine things only improve once you start looking elsewhere from there!! :-). In my case, looking only, no touching as I'm happily married :-))))))

[growler2058]

Hello belzi82,

I typed 'male members'............ but it doesn't read right :-) .

So, instead, I say the discerning females can look at the rest of us.

Take me for instance, 110 kgs of superbly relaxed muscle :-), and I imagine things only improve once you start looking elsewhere from there!! :-). In my case, looking only, no touching as I'm happily married :-))))))

Better chuck some funny foters up Silver, maybe in a Borat stlye mankini hahahahahhahahahaha

[Ben81C]

Sorry, make that bikini clad people.