No Auto electrician will touch it.....

[snicko]

We have a setup in our camper that has 240V and 12V and with all the vibration of corrugated roads the box " thingy" has stoped working and an auto electrician wont touch it because it has 240V.

We went to a sparky and he wasn't interested either.

Originally "a mate" did it and he is long gone (thank goodness as everything he did for us now doesn't work!!)

At the moment the only way we can charge the battery is with a battery charger at home.
(The Anderson plug from the car dosen't work either.)

Is there something off the shelf that can be fitted that when it sh!ts it's self we can just replace it??


http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m481/snicko1/Camer%20trailer/P1030692Sizedx3.jpg

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m481/snicko1/Camer%20trailer/P1030691Sizedx3.jpg

LOOKING DIRECTLY DOWN

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m481/snicko1/Camer%20trailer/P1030690Sizedx3.jpg

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m481/snicko1/Camer%20trailer/P1030689Sizedx3.jpg

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m481/snicko1/Camer%20trailer/P1030688sixedx3.jpg

[big_fletch]

Auto-Sparkys are not allowed to touch anything 240v as we are not qualified to work with it.. Do you know what the system was originally designed to do? Charge the bat from the car and 240v ect?

[patch697]

My god...... What a bloody mess.

If you feel like towing it out here I'd re-do it all for ya with a damn site more care than the last one did.

I build custom stuff for 4x4's & farm equipment all the time & my work sticks.

Out side of that, get in touch with a camper builder & as they would more than likely have it all bolt in & therefor replaceable

[snicko]

Auto-Sparkys are not allowed to touch anything 240v as we are not qualified to work with it.. Do you know what the system was originally designed to do? Charge the bat from the car and 240v ect?

The system was suppose to run the 12v lights (which it still does) and if we wanted to go into a caravan park with a powered site hook up to 240v to charge the battery.
The Anderson plug from the car is suppose to charge the battery as well.

NOW all that works it 12v lights if we charge the battey at home!!

[snicko]

My god...... What a bloody mess.

If you feel like towing it out here I'd re-do it all for ya with a damn site more care than the last one did.

I build custom stuff for 4x4's & farm equipment all the time & my work sticks.

Out side of that, get in touch with a camper builder & as they would more than likely have it all bolt in & therefor replaceable

Thanks Patch
I had thought of a camper builder but there is no one local that I can ask and as you can see I need someone to work through the spagetti and no one wants to put their hand up.

[Sir Roofy]

A nite mare in that needs unravelling

sorry for ya snicko

[big_fletch]

The system was suppose to run the 12v lights (which it still does) and if we wanted to go into a caravan park with a powered site hook up to 240v to charge the battery.
The Anderson plug from the car is suppose to charge the battery as well.

NOW all that works it 12v lights if we charge the battey at home!!

Oh ok then, so all the 240 did was charge the battery? There are a few ways around it, at work i would rewire the 12v side completly from lights to Anderson plugs.. With the 240v, you could just mount a 240v Charger and plug an Extension lead in from your powered site.. I have done this several times for customers and makes the system very simple.. This also keeps the 240 and 12v system seperate so if the 240 fails the 12v will still work through the anderson Plug and off the battery.. We install the Ctek chargers normally as have never had a problem with them and they will charge any type of battery
http://www.ctekbatterychargers.com.au/ctek-multi-xs-15000.html
X2 with Patch, If your ever around my way i would also be happy to have a look and work something out for you

Fletcha

[timbar]

Looks like a lot of fun. S N I C K O not wishbi could put my hand up but ur a bit far away sorry

[Yendor]

It looks like the 240 volt circuit breaker (shown in your photo "looking directly down" ) may have tripped.

Also the 240 volt charging unit should have a fuse in it, you could try checking this.

My father had to change his (240 volt charger), in his motor home about 2 years ago. He was told by the company that he bought it from, that it was fairly common for the cheaper units to fail due to power surges in caravan parks.

With the 12 volt side if your anderson plug on your vehicle is working, then it can only be a bad connection in the 12 volt wiring in the trailer or a blown fuse.

I would start by checking all fuses, I can see two inline fuse holder in your second photo and what looks like a 12 volt circuit breaker

Good luck with it.

[snicko]

It looks like the 240 volt circuit breaker (shown in your photo "looking directly down" ) may have tripped.

Also the 240 volt charging unit should have a fuse in it, you could try checking this.

My father had to change his, in his motor home about 2 years ago. He was told by the company that he bought it from, that it was fairly common for the cheaper units to fail due to power surges in caravan parks.

With the 12 volt side if your anderson plug on your vehicle is working, then it can only be a bad connection in the 12 volt wiring in the trailer or a blown fuse.

I would start by checking all fuses, I can see two inline fuse holder in your second photo and what looks like a 12 volt circuit breaker

Good luck with it.

Thanks Yendor

Hubby has checked a few fuses and we had someone check something with guages and he said the " box thingy" was not working.
The anderson plug from the car does not work either.

I will have a go and check what ever comes apart tomorrow as hubby is away for the weekend!!

[the evil twin]

Step 1, rip it all out 'cept the wiring

Step 2, buy a CTEK 7000 Battery Charger/power supply $170 on Ebay or 200 bucks for the 15 amp job.

Step 3, connect the CTEK to the 240 Volt and the 12 Volt output to the existing Camper wiring (it even has interchangeable leads to do so).

Totally do it yourself and totally safe plus the CTEK will work purely as a power supply off 240 Volt without even having the Battery in the Camper if needs be AND you have one of the worlds best Battery Chargers.

[Clunk]

Could it be that the switched mode power supply has failed, I'm pretty sure those things don't like vibration very much, especially the fan cooled ones!!!???

[snicko]

Step 1, rip it all out 'cept the wiring

Step 2, buy a CTEK 7000 Battery Charger/power supply $170 on Ebay or 200 bucks for the 15 amp job.

Step 3, connect the CTEK to the 240 Volt and the 12 Volt output to the existing Camper wiring (it even has interchangeable leads to do so).

Totally do it yourself and totally safe plus the CTEK will work purely as a power supply off 240 Volt without even having the Battery in the Camper if needs be AND you have one of the worlds best Battery Chargers.

Thanks The evil twin.........Thats exactly what we wanted the first time!

[snicko]

Could it be that the switched mode power supply has failed, I'm pretty sure those things don't like vibration very much, especially the fan cooled ones!!!???

When we did the Innamincka trip we did have the car air borne once and the camper air borne twice!!! hahahahahaha

[the evil twin]

Not sure how much power you use... I have a CTEK XS 7000 (or 7 amp jobbie) and that is heaps for me.

If you have a large power drain or are happy with the extra $50 then you may want to consider the 15000 but I am not sure if it comes with the extra leads (I would assume so but please check).

There are some other very good brands about but CTEK is of the highest quality and Patrol Tough IMHO

[snicko]

Not sure how much power you use... I have a CTEK XS 7000 (or 7 amp jobbie) and that is heaps for me.

If you have a large power drain or are happy with the extra $50 then you may want to consider the 15000 but I am not sure if it comes with the extra leads (I would assume so but please check).

There are some other very good brands about but CTEK is of the highest quality and Patrol Tough IMHO

It also needs to be Snicko driving tough!! hahahahaha

Will this set up be able to charge a mobile phone, lap top, camera battery etc?

[the evil twin]

It also needs to be Snicko driving tough!! hahahahaha

Will this set up be able to charge a mobile phone, lap top, camera battery etc?

Essentially, you are simply replacing all the "silver box" that converts 240 to 12 Volts with the CTEK so whatever you did before you should still be able to do now.

I run and recharge all my gear off 12 Volts even when in a Park connected to 240. However I do carry a small Dick Smith Inverter that I can use on 240 but that is more if the 12 Volt power pack for the lappy blows up or I only have a 240 Volt charging option for the item of equipment... so technically, I am still on 12 Volts I spose.

The 7000 has no probs running all our needs IE Engel, Lighting, Water Pump, Lappy and the Camper House batteries (twin 105 AH Full River) are always fully charged. All that happens is if the lights and lappy are on, the frig is running and we hit the water pump (7 amps) then we are momentarily drawing on battery for a few seconds to fill the kettle or maybe 10 seconds for the washing up.

I would consider a 15000 necessary pretty much only if you are bush for a while, your House Battery is heavily discharged and you will only be on 240Volts for a night or so and then heading bush again so you need to recharge the House Battery as quickly as possible.

[snicko]

Essentially, you are simply replacing all the "silver box" that converts 240 to 12 Volts with the CTEK so whatever you did before you should still be able to do now.

I run and recharge all my gear off 12 Volts even when in a Park connected to 240. However I do carry a small Dick Smith Inverter that I can use on 240 but that is more if the 12 Volt power pack for the lappy blows up or I only have a 240 Volt charging option for the item of equipment... so technically, I am still on 12 Volts I spose.

The 7000 has no probs running all our needs IE Engel, Lighting, Water Pump, Lappy and the Camper House batteries (twin 105 AH Full River) are always fully charged. All that happens is if the lights and lappy are on, the frig is running and we hit the water pump (7 amps) then we are momentarily drawing on battery for a few seconds to fill the kettle or maybe 10 seconds for the washing up.

I would consider a 15000 necessary pretty much only if you are bush for a while, your House Battery is heavily discharged and you will only be on 240Volts for a night or so and then heading bush again so you need to recharge the House Battery as quickly as possible.

That sounds great. Tomorrow I will work out what goes where and look into pricing on Fleabay.
Thanks for your help.

[frenzy]

Hey Snicko,
I used to be an autoelec/mechanic many years ago and totally agree with the advice above. I think the guys have nailed it for ya. How good is this forum! LOL!

[snicko]

Hey Snicko,
I used to be an autoelec/mechanic many years ago and totally agree with the advice above. I think the guys have nailed it for ya. How good is this forum! LOL!

I just hope I can live up to the good advice. You can't electrocute yourself on 12v can you?? hahahahahahahahha

[nowoolies]

I just hope I can live up to the good advice. You can electrocute yourself on 12v can you?? hahahahahahahahha

nah but can give you a jolt

hope all go`s well for you`s and get it sorted

[the ferret]

When we did the Innamincka trip we did have the car air borne once and the camper air borne twice!!! hahahahahaha
Needs wings and a prop and some landing gear then eh??

[macca]

Snicko, I'm an electrician and have done a bit of this wiring on my own gear.
The advice is good what is above, please be really carefull of 240volt in your system. I assume you have an inverter 12vdc to 240vac.
And there is an inlet plug, that one is easy - make sure the lead is not plugged in.
As for the inverter
If it has a power point socket on the outside - unplug the lead. Then disconnect all 12vdc from it and make safe.
That 240volt stuff is leathal and you can not see it, so be very carefull when de-wiring components.
Allway check twice!!!
Good luck with it
Macca

[snicko]

Snicko, I'm an electrician and have done a bit of this wiring on my own gear.
The advice is good what is above, please be really carefull of 240volt in your system. I assume you have an inverter 12vdc to 240vac.
And there is an inlet plug, that one is easy - make sure the lead is not plugged in.
As for the inverter
If it has a power point socket on the outside - unplug the lead. Then disconnect all 12vdc from it and make safe.
That 240volt stuff is leathal and you can not see it, so be very carefull when de-wiring components.
Allway check twice!!!
Good luck with it
Macca

Thanks Macca
Thats the problem I have. I'm not sure really what I have and have not yet found someone (other than forum members who live a long way away) who will put their hand up to help.

A road trip to Vic might be on the cards if it gets beyond me.

[MudRunnerTD]

Hi Snicko,

There is some great advice above mate. Wiring is all about tracing what is there, it will get a little messy while you trace it all but you will sort it out. Hopefully he has used appropriate colours for the wiring.

There will not be that much there really though and once the conduit is ripped off it will start to become clearer.

Just remember, your probably never going to plug into that external socket again for your 240v. if that is not plugged in and you disconnect your battery in the system then your as safe as houses to do whet needs to be done. It sounds like your committed to making that system obsolete so just rip it out. The CTek will replace most of it so rip it out and start again with a product designed to do the job you are looking for (CTek)

It should be really easy to separate the 240v wiring system from the 12v wiring system once it is stripped of the conduit and you will be fine mate.

If in doubt, take more photos of it once the conduit covers are off at the points that you are not clear about and guys here will steer you straight, They have so far ;)

Good luck mate.

[snicko]

Hi Snicko,

There is some great advice above mate. Wiring is all about tracing what is there, it will get a little messy while you trace it all but you will sort it out. Hopefully he has used appropriate colours for the wiring.

There will not be that much there really though and once the conduit is ripped off it will start to become clearer.

Just remember, your probably never going to plug into that external socket again for your 240v. if that is not plugged in and you disconnect your battery in the system then your as safe as houses to do whet needs to be done. It sounds like your committed to making that system obsolete so just rip it out. The CTek will replace most of it so rip it out and start again with a product designed to do the job you are looking for (CTek)

It should be really easy to separate the 240v wiring system from the 12v wiring system once it is stripped of the conduit and you will be fine mate.

If in doubt, take more photos of it once the conduit covers are off at the points that you are not clear about and guys here will steer you straight, They have so far ;)

Good luck mate.

Thanks MudrunnerTD

I did think of pulling all the conduit off and taking more pics and posting them as people here know what they are talking about.

Now I will do it and report on all the fuses too (if any are blown)

[the evil twin]

Looking at the pic's my guess's are as follows -

Top two Pics -
Silver Jiffy Box with "red charger blue battery" possibly hides a DC Automatic C/B or Circuit Protection in the battery supply cable? (Retain or replace with a new item, they are pretty cheap and connect to CTEK 12 volts if so)
Red cable with the inline fuse holder to the Battery is probably the Anderson Plug Feed is it? (Retain or Replace fuse with DC Auto C/B and connect to Battery + if so)
The black items on the rear wall look like circuit protection for the House 12 Volt outlets but hard to tell (retain and connect to CTEK 12 Volts if so)

Middle piccy (looking down)
Domestic 240 Volt C/B poked in behind (not required with CTEK)
Spaghetti junction of wiring

2nd from Bottom picture -
Switch box with one switch for battery and one for House (not required with CTEK)
240 Volt to 12 Volt DC Power Supply def not ideal for your application (replace with CTEK)

Bottom picture -
Weatherproof Caravan Power In and Outlet 240V points. These are fine to keep even if just to seal the holes.
DC Voltmeter
Fuse or telltale lamp (bit hard to pick)
12 Volt Merit Plug and switch

[the evil twin]

I might add that apart from the messy wiring and poor choice of Power Supply it looks like a well thought out install esp as far as protection etc is concerned.

If you simply trace back the 12 Volt wire for the Voltmeter and Merit Plug stuff on the side I would keep that exactly as is... and connect to Battery +

Ditto for the wiring and Circuit protection for the Camper... connect to battery +

The Anderson feed from the Car should be logical to sort out as well.

Anyway, if absolute worst case and the mob on here can't sort it out then an Auto Sparky should be happy to do the tidy up IF that 240 Volt piece of gear is GONE and all you have or need him to do is 12Volts stuff.
Then all you need to do is connect the CTEK lead to the Battery and plug teh CTEK in if you have 240 Volts available

[snicko]

Took some more pics and left them bigger so the wires can be seen better.



http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m481/snicko1/Camer%20trailer/P1030714sizedx2.jpg

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m481/snicko1/Camer%20trailer/P1030715sizedx2.jpg

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m481/snicko1/Camer%20trailer/P1030716sizedx2.jpg

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m481/snicko1/Camer%20trailer/P1030717sizedx2.jpg

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m481/snicko1/Camer%20trailer/P1030718sizedx2.jpg

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m481/snicko1/Camer%20trailer/P1030719sizedx2.jpg

[Yendor]

If you are going to go down the path of removing the 240 volt wiring, I would start by disconnecting it at the 240 volt in plug first. From there it looks like it runs down to the 240 volt circuit breaker then up to the 240 volt outlet plug and also from the 240 volt circuit breaker it runs across to your 240 volt AC to 12 volt DC unit (conduit with the red, black and yellow/green wires) all this can be removed.

The other 2 wires at the 240 volt AC to 12 volt DC unit (red and black wires) top 2 in photo 1, is where you should be able to connect your new battery charger/power supply to, just make sure they are the 12 volt positive and 12 volt negative (it looks like they are by the photo but it is a bit hard to read).

[snicko]

If you are going to go down the path of removing the 240 volt wiring, I would start by disconnecting it at the 240 volt in plug first. From there it looks like it runs down to the 240 volt circuit breaker then up to the 240 volt outlet plug and also from the 240 volt circuit breaker it runs across to your 240 volt AC to 12 volt DC unit (conduit with the red, black and yellow/green wires) all this can be removed.

The other 2 wires at the 240 volt AC to 12 volt DC unit (red and black wires) top 2 in photo 1, is where you should be able to connect your new battery charger/power supply to, just make sure they are the 12 volt positive and 12 volt negative (it looks like they are by the photo but it is a bit hard to read).


Thanks Yendor

Is this the pic you need?

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m481/snicko1/Camer%20trailer/P1030720sizedx2.jpg

[the evil twin]

Ahhhh yes... mucho better.

I agree with Rodney

Remove the Red and Black at the Power Supply and connect the CTEK and that should be the 12 Volts sorted. Those small black doohickies are autoresetting C/B's I reckon so keep them unless they are faulty.
At the RCD you can either ...
disconnect and remove the 240 V Cable and the Power Supply and retain the use of the weatherproof 240 Volt Inlet and outlet (leave the RCd in if you do that.
OR
remove the 240 volt cables and RCD and leave the sockets to cover the holes or knock up some cover plates or you can purchase dummy wall plates from Bunnings or Eleccy outlets.

[Yendor]

Yes you can connect it to the red and black wires marked as +V and -V (These wires should run to you battery via a fuse).

All the 12 volt wiring I can see in the photo looks fine, so as long as everything in your camper still works I would leave it as is.

I would also recommend that you disconnect the battery first before disconnecting any wires.

[snicko]

Thanks guys. I have ordered the battery charger (can't get one locally) and when it comes I will study what everyone has said and hopefully have success in fitting it!!

I'm sure there will be questions along the way so stay tuned!! hahahaha

[Yendor]

Thanks guys. I have ordered the battery charger (can't get one locally) and when it comes I will study what everyone has said and hopefully have success in fitting it!!

I'm sure there will be questions along the way so stay tuned!! hahahaha

As long as your fuses and circuit breakers are ok I don't think you will have any problems.

[-ET 4wd-]

I agree with big_fletch!
I would junk the lot of it and start again, easy for me to say as im good with electrical but i take my time to get it right.
I would rewire all the 12V accesories to the battery, hook the anderson plug directly to the battery and the wire in a a Ctek like big-fletch said so ya can plug a extension cord into it at home or at a caravan park or to a genny to charge the battery.
Wouldnt be hard but it would take some time to do to make it all look good and make it easy to troubleshoot if ya ever had future probs.

Steve.

[-ET 4wd-]

Is that a 30A fuse in the Powertech?
Im sure it is if its green! thats what my fans use on my LS-1 so im used to lookin at them!!
Where it says V ADJ.....maybe it cooked the inside of it cause the fuse is to big??
Just a thought

Steve.

[albi]

Oh ok then, so all the 240 did was charge the battery? There are a few ways around it, at work i would rewire the 12v side completly from lights to Anderson plugs.. With the 240v, you could just mount a 240v Charger and plug an Extension lead in from your powered site.. I have done this several times for customers and makes the system very simple.. This also keeps the 240 and 12v system seperate so if the 240 fails the 12v will still work through the anderson Plug and off the battery.. We install the Ctek chargers normally as have never had a problem with them and they will charge any type of battery
http://www.ctekbatterychargers.com.au/ctek-multi-xs-15000.html
X2 with Patch, If your ever around my way i would also be happy to have a look and work something out for you

Fletcha

i concure with you mate i have done the same ,wired up trailer for 12 volt and hard wire 240volt charger and inverter"the same type as a home base cb sytem,so that while in camp site that is powered it chargess the 12 volt and / or switch over so inverter can run 12 volt sytem.but ive used a caravan repairer aswell to wire up trailer so 240 can be used aswell for appliances.