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View Full Version : GQ auto problem- ALMOST fixed still need some help/ideas/suggestions to nail it



soulburner2000
10th April 2013, 11:59 PM
On my GQ dual fuel wagon, I had a auto problem I thought may've been related to some long distances I was travelling on consecutive days of 30+ degree heat.

After the final day of this travelling, I noticed that the next time I tried to drive, could not change out of 1st. I'd regularly checked fluid and oil levels for everything during this period of long distance travel, so didn't think problem would be from underfilling. Thought I'd let the engine run to get some heat up to check level anyway. As I was trying to limp in 1st to safer ground, I found it would now change normally, until I realised it wasn't changing into 4th.

Did transmission oil/filter change. Oil had it's colour and did not smell burnt, filter still looked reasonably clean, and nothing but the usual sludge and fine metal filings you'd expect around the magnet.

A few days before, I'd removed the radiator, cleaned and flushed, removed engine block plug and flushed. Put back together, refilled with good coolant. Temp gauge still sat on half or slightly over when up to temp.

Auto was definitely smoother, and after a carby cleanout and some slight adjustments to the idle/mix/accelerator, it's running better than it has in ages. However....

I still have to warm it up for around 10 minutes from a cold start before driving, or auto will not change from 1st. And still no 4th. I've worked out I use about 30% more fuel because of this. Frustrating.

I've gone through the manuals, scoured the forums, and have found so many likely causes/fixes suggested it's hard to know where to start. I'm hoping this description has a familiar ring to it for someone, and that they can narrow the field a bit for me - preferrably with reassuring happy ending.

Xfactor
11th April 2013, 03:52 AM
maybe wrong oil ?, seems like once it warms up it thins abit and allows changing of auto

NissanGQ4.2
11th April 2013, 06:36 AM
Sorry mate its a case of going through the steps in the manual as listed to try and diagnose the problem, could be many issues

soulburner2000
11th April 2013, 01:42 PM
When you start the truck, the switch in the centre console for "Auto, Hold, Power" will flash. Count the flashes and sometimes it may be a known TCU fault code (I had 16 flashes prior to box overhaul as have a couple of other people, and whilst I thought this was normal, it isn't - it was flashing an error code; it is now fixed, TC replaced and only flashes about 4 or 5 times and is running like a bought one).

Other than that, the 4th gear is overdrive, and I believe there is a switch for that (not the lever switch) below the stick in the cover, or on top of the box with the ATP switch. That would be a good place to start also maybe?

Odd about the first gear issue though - like it hasn't got enough oil flow/pressure when cold which could suggest incorrect oil type as stated already - what oil do you run? Fully synthetic?


Scotty (Bigrig)

Yes, fully synthetic, the nissan D equivalent. Problem was occurring before and after recent oil change. Previous oil change was done at a auto trans specialist workshop.

I'll just have to go down the list of 'fixes' and hope it's one of the less expensive one's. And I'm not sure if this is related, but problem arose at the same time as I began having issue's trying to run on petrol- think I've got a leak somewhere or dead fuel pump. I doubt it has any relevance, but I know nothing......

The pic below mentions A.T.P. and a 'lamp' but I have no switches or flashing lights. I've read about them so many times in different posts, and have never had a clue what a is being referred to.....

soulburner2000
11th April 2013, 08:35 PM
Dunno how to delete threads, but I've decided not to waste any more dollars on this vehicle. Not sure if I'll put a 'make an offer' sign on it yet or drive it to the wreckers. There is the exact same model from the same year with the same setup at the wreckers down the road from me (in better condition than mine) - I think I know why it's there now.

It is too expensive to drive mine in this condition, and the problem with getting out of 1st gear when cold will end up being terminal - and I'm not going down the rebuild road again. Nothing but a money pit. Never had problems like this with any auto transmission I've had before, these one's seem needlessly complicated. I'm sure these Patrols go great with a manual box in 'em, but too late for that now.

I wish all Patrol owners well. I'm a big fan of auto's over manual's usually, but I reckon these should be avoided at all costs. That's from my experience anyway.

NissanGQ4.2
11th April 2013, 09:56 PM
I'm a big fan of auto's over manual's usually, but I reckon these should be avoided at all costs. That's from my experience anyway.

Disagree.... they are a great gear box just need to be looked after like any other gearbox,

When you checked your gearbox oil, did you do it warm and run it through the gears before checking????

soulburner2000
11th April 2013, 10:47 PM
Disagree.... they are a great gear box just need to be looked after like any other gearbox,

When you checked your gearbox oil, did you do it warm and run it through the gears before checking????

Must have to get lucky with them I guess....Yes, did the check at temp and after I'd moved through the gears.

Really, I could've lived with having to warm it up for 15 minutes from cold before it would change aout of 1st gear, but with all the highway driving without the overdrive was killing me in fuel costs. The fact that everything was running hotter because of this would also cause alarm.

I've suffered hair loss on 3 seperate occasions over the last 8 years due to stress and anxiety issues (luckily it always grows back). The thing with this frustrating auto was leading to a 4th.

I'm vain, I'd rather have hair than a dodgy auto.....

happygu
11th April 2013, 11:31 PM
There was another poster having similar trouble lately, after putting in Synthetic Oil in their GQ Auto ...... coincidence, or is it just bad luck.

I would re-check the recommendations for the type of fluids compatible with the Auto to be sure....it might be an easy fix.

Mic

soulburner2000
12th April 2013, 01:30 AM
There was another poster having similar trouble lately, after putting in Synthetic Oil in their GQ Auto ...... coincidence, or is it just bad luck.

I would re-check the recommendations for the type of fluids compatible with the Auto to be sure....it might be an easy fix.

Mic

I used the recommended Nissan Matic D equivalent. The problems were occurring before the change also - my main reason for doing it.

To recap, was driving on a hot day, stopped at a traffic light, and could not find a gear when I tried to pull away. Let it cool and topped up with a little fluid, seemed ok again. Next time I drove, problems were present....

soulburner2000
12th April 2013, 01:48 AM
So I went for a drive after making a few adjustments, to test things out and fuel up. Checked the transmission fluid level and this is what it showed. Holy smokes! However.....

I have found in the past that I NEVER get a consistent reading from one day to the next where my oil level is concerned - might show as underfilled when I check it tomorrow. This has been my experience; and yes I check it when hot. I've often thought the dipstick is the wrong type for the vehicle, but only due to the inconsistent readings.

sigh.....

taslucas
12th April 2013, 07:38 AM
Could you have got some kind of air block in the trans cooler or lines when refilling? Are any of your fluid lines kinked or perhaps a bit blocked some how?

FanTapstic!

soulburner2000
12th April 2013, 12:47 PM
There are examples on here when people have bought cars with the wrong length dipstick - there's even a photo (I put up about 18 months or more ago). I'll see if I can find it and copy it over - could well be its overfilled as the dipstick is the wrong length ...

And no, you don't have to be "lucky" old mate to get a good one ... you are unlucky to get a bad one ...

But we're onto it and trying to assist with the hair loss prevention program!! lol


Scotty (Bigrig)

Thanks very much, I really appreciate the efforts.

Regarding my problems with the dipstick, I have seen posts by others mentioning similar difficulties getting an accurate reading, though not sure if they were on this forum. I didn't take much notice of the specific content of these posts at the time, but they gave me the impression that it may be a known common issue. I'm more inclined to believe now though that the wrong length dipstick is more likely, though I appear to have a matching 'set'.

I apologise, I shouldn't have 'dissed' all autos, I'm just frustrated with mine.

soulburner2000
12th April 2013, 01:03 PM
Could you have got some kind of air block in the trans cooler or lines when refilling? Are any of your fluid lines kinked or perhaps a bit blocked some how?

FanTapstic!

They don't appear to be kinked but not sure if they're blocked. I did follow the lines (on my back, underneath the vehicle) to the transmission looking for any splits/leaks/damage and visually things looked ok.

Can you give me an idea of how to test for blockage. Apart from unclamping hoses at various connection points to check the flow I can't think of what more I could do - not here anyway, with my limited equipment and resources.

taslucas
12th April 2013, 02:12 PM
Nah sorry I wouldn't know how to easily check for a blockage. I just thought it weird that you are getting different readings on the stick, that's what made me think maybe an air lock. Even if the stick is the wrong one, it should be the same level all the time?
Your checking it when warmed up and with engine running?

FanTapstic!

soulburner2000
12th April 2013, 11:18 PM
Here's an example of what I was referring to with inconsistant trans fluid readings - under same conditions (after driving around town with my son), got home, car still running, checked the level on dipstick. Here's the result. Still showing as overfull but significantly lower. There are no leaks.

Decided to take a look a both dipsticks next to eachother. I always assumed they were a match, but after closer inspection, I have my doubts. The transmission stick looks older and more 'used' than motor oil one. The motor oil dipstick had a code/number on it, but none present on trans stick.

What's it all mean? It means I'm more confused. But I'm here to learn people, and to benefit from your wisdom and superior knowledge.....

taslucas
13th April 2013, 07:13 AM
perhaps the oil dip stick looks older because it has been more frequently used (checked) than the trans one? Do you have any mates with the same engine to compare the sticks?
I will take a pic of mine when it stops raining here.
I'm just guessing but fluctuating levels would maybe be from inconsistent pressure inside the system???
Is the trans breather line blocked?
Does anyone know how to check if the trans fluid pump is working %100?
I'm really just guessing and throwing ideas out there.

FanTapstic!

soulburner2000
13th April 2013, 01:29 PM
Don't know anyone with a patrol, but there's a gq auto from same year at the wreckers down the road. Might ask then what they want for the TPS on it , and have a look while I'm there.

Maybe a previous owner got distracted while checking oil level and drove off without putting dipstick back in? Thought a replacement out of a 'near enough' model would do. I'm just speculating as well.

It's still raining here as well, but I'll go check out the breather shortly.

Last night I took out the rear seats, centre console, gear selector trim, centre dash section etc, other bits and pieces, to clean and check in case I do get rid of it. Change the CD player over while I'm at it. Cig lighter socket was a bugger to get out. The small, unexpected problems like that seem to hold me up the most.

soulburner2000
13th April 2013, 07:52 PM
This thread seems to have petered out. Thanks for all replies...

soulburner2000
27th April 2013, 11:04 PM
Just posted this on another thread, may as well update here as well.....

Bought a new Bosch GT40r coil and fitted it.
I had my TPS off today, gave it a good soaking in WD40 (sprayed in every gap I could find), and cleaned it with a 'modified' soft bristled toothbrush and dental pik. Let it drain and dry out, and put it back on with a slight adjustment. All the connections got a spray and good clean as well.
Holy crap, what a difference it made! So smooth between gears, and smoother to drive in general. TC still not locking up, but so much better.

Going to book it in with my gas guy for a decent tune-up, and then I'll start pricing reco-ed TC's. Definitely gonna get an oil cooler for the transmission as insurance for the future.

NissanGQ4.2
28th April 2013, 07:09 AM
Hi mate, I have closed your other thread down and re-directed everyone 2 leave comments here, It gets really confusing having two threads going that relate to the same problem.

Cheers

Toddie

soulburner2000
29th April 2013, 08:35 PM
gonna try the 330 ohm resistor fix before I do anything else

pacs
30th April 2013, 03:55 PM
hey mate just a query have you tried adding a manual lockup switch for the TC as taslucas and I have experienced issues with flaring with the TC in the past and I added one to force lockup when this occurred and found the flaring would disappear after I manually locked the TC
there are a few threads around for doing this might be worth checking out as it is an easy job for the DIY

NissanGQ4.2
30th April 2013, 08:12 PM
Hi mate, can you check something for me when you have time

The Gearbox dipstick does it have "HOT" written on one side and "Cold" written on the other side?

The Engine Oil dipstick does it have "FULL and "LOW" written on it

Yes the Engine oil Dipstick has a code/number on it where else the transmission has no code/number on it

I found your photo's of the dipsticks strange as mine have 2 different types of handle

This is my gearbox oil dipstick handle

28947

This is my engine oil dipstick handle

28948

Cheers

Toddie

soulburner2000
1st May 2013, 01:04 AM
Hi mate, can you check something for me when you have time

The Gearbox dipstick does it have "HOT" written on one side and "Cold" written on the other side?

The Engine Oil dipstick does it have "FULL and "LOW" written on it

Yes the Engine oil Dipstick has a code/number on it where else the transmission has no code/number on it

I found your photo's of the dipsticks strange as mine have 2 different types of handle

This is my gearbox oil dipstick handle

28947

This is my engine oil dipstick handle

28948

Cheers

Toddie

My engine oil dipstick has only the letters - F for full (or H - high? only an hour ago I checked & forgot already) and L for low

soulburner2000
1st May 2013, 01:05 AM
hey mate just a query have you tried adding a manual lockup switch for the TC as taslucas and I have experienced issues with flaring with the TC in the past and I added one to force lockup when this occurred and found the flaring would disappear after I manually locked the TC
there are a few threads around for doing this might be worth checking out as it is an easy job for the DIY

have been considering it

NissanGQ4.2
1st May 2013, 05:08 AM
My engine oil dipstick has only the letters - F for full (or H - high? only an hour ago I checked & forgot already) and L for low

What about the gearbox?

soulburner2000
1st May 2013, 08:57 AM
"HOT" written on one side and "Cold" written on the other side - as you describe.

soulburner2000
2nd May 2013, 01:05 PM
hey mate just a query have you tried adding a manual lockup switch for the TC as taslucas and I have experienced issues with flaring with the TC in the past and I added one to force lockup when this occurred and found the flaring would disappear after I manually locked the TC
there are a few threads around for doing this might be worth checking out as it is an easy job for the DIY

Can someone please send me a link for a GQ? Preferably with easy to understand instructions.

Also, beside cost, what is better about the DIY method? Are the switches you can buy online any different?

Thanks...

taslucas
2nd May 2013, 04:10 PM
Hey mate, I can't post a link at the moment as I'm on my phone but if you use the search function on this forum you should find a few threads about these switches including a DIY. There was a very in depth diy done a while ago. Try searching for lockup switch, TC lockup, lockup solenoid bypass etc.....

FanTapstic!

NissanGQ4.2
2nd May 2013, 04:45 PM
Some light reading for you Craig, the only difference I would see between a bought one and a do it yourself is the cost, I don't think there would be any real difference

Hopefully ripper or chaz will see this and comment

Cheers

Todd

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/showthread.php?11037-My-GQ-manual-torque-converter-lock-up-system-(lotts-of-photos)

http://www.chaz.yellowfoot.org/Lockup%20Trans%20Switch.htm

soulburner2000
2nd May 2013, 09:49 PM
Probably too late...lost reverse gear tonight. Looks like it's stuffed. (sigh)

Parksy
2nd May 2013, 09:54 PM
Ah criest. That's just sh#t luck soul burner! Seems like things aren't going right with you. Have you got the ability to source a second hand box?

NissanGQ4.2
2nd May 2013, 09:58 PM
Definitely rebuild time or exchange Craig :(

soulburner2000
2nd May 2013, 10:08 PM
Ah criest. That's just sh#t luck soul burner! Seems like things aren't going right with you. Have you got the ability to source a second hand box?

There's a 1990 GQ with a manual box at the wreckers down the road for $1500, complete and running - might have to check if the box is ok and convert to manual.

NissanGQ4.2
3rd May 2013, 05:36 AM
hahahahaha love your Avatar Craig

I'll reply to your manual conversion thoughts later 2nite

taslucas
3rd May 2013, 06:37 PM
There's a 1990 GQ with a manual box at the wreckers down the road for $1500, complete and running - might have to check if the box is ok and convert to manual.

Are you considering buying the whole thing for $1500? $1500 would go a long way to fixing up the auto box. Once you have the auto sorted youll have a superior 4wd running the gearbox that is superior for 4wding:)

taslucas
3rd May 2013, 06:42 PM
A TB42 Auto in "D" (for drag lol)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mc7gVtsPtus

taslucas
3rd May 2013, 06:42 PM
Another TB42 Auto in "2"


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KrjE1Kgy8pA

Parksy
3rd May 2013, 06:50 PM
Manual conversion is the way to go. Not much goes wrong with those units.

taslucas
3rd May 2013, 07:07 PM
Manual conversion is the way to go. Not much goes wrong with those units.

Not much goes wrong with standard suspension and AT tyres either................... lol

NissanGQ4.2
3rd May 2013, 07:21 PM
Will you be doing the conversion yourself Craig or paying someone to do it???

How long can you afford to have your rig of the road????

Yeh by all means do manual conversion if a manual is what you want you really want, but sit down and work out the pro's and con's of both and the costs involved. Also take into account that there is no guarantee that after ripping the manual out of the donor car and doing the conversion that the gearbox doesn't sh!t it self anyway unless of course you plan on rebuilding the manual before installing it.

We I've been through the same thing and you all know which way I went :)

soulburner2000
3rd May 2013, 07:26 PM
Are you considering buying the whole thing for $1500? $1500 would go a long way to fixing up the auto box. Once you have the auto sorted youll have a superior 4wd running the gearbox that is superior for 4wding:)

well, been having a look online and may just buy a decent GQ that's had the work done. I don't want to spend big bucks, but if it's likely to cost $3000 minimum for a transmission rebuild I may as well put it towards a replacement patrol - keep mine for spares/best bits. Don't know if I'd get another auto...

soulburner2000
3rd May 2013, 07:35 PM
Will you be doing the conversion yourself Craig or paying someone to do it???

How long can you afford to have your rig of the road????

Yeh by all means do manual conversion if a manual is what you want you really want, but sit down and work out the pro's and con's of both and the costs involved. Also take into account that there is no guarantee that after ripping the manual out of the donor car and doing the conversion that the gearbox doesn't sh!t it self anyway unless of course you plan on rebuilding the manual before installing it.

We I've been through the same thing and you all know which way I went :)

No way! I wouldn't/couldn't do it myself. I don't have the patience or the knowledge. I haven't decided what to do yet. Luckily, I have an EK Holden that I can use (although it's on restricted rego, shhh).

The patrol still has the forward gears (I haven't used it since I got home last night) so I can drive it to wherever it needs to go for fixing (if I go down that track). Have spent quite a bit on it recently, and was hoping it would last until tax return time. Never mind, it'll work out in the end.

NissanGQ4.2
3rd May 2013, 07:36 PM
well, been having a look online and may just buy a decent GQ that's had the work done. I don't want to spend big bucks, but if it's likely to cost $3000 minimum for a transmission rebuild I may as well put it towards a replacement patrol - keep mine for spares/best bits. Don't know if I'd get another auto...

I hear what your saying but don't agree........yeh 3g expensive and you can buy a s/h patrol for that or put it towards a dearer Patrol................. and the big but is, how long before your new patrol's gearbox fails ( yes manuals fail 2 ) or something else fails????

Well that's just my way I looked at it when I had to decide.

See my point

soulburner2000
3rd May 2013, 07:42 PM
A TB42 Auto in "D" (for drag lol)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mc7gVtsPtus



I notice you have no bar on the front or side steps. Is removing them a common thing that Patrol owners do, or is it an off-roading thing? I'm a bit of a dunce...

NissanGQ4.2
3rd May 2013, 07:48 PM
I notice you have no bar on the front or side steps. Is removing them a common thing that Patrol owners do, or is it an off-roading thing? I'm a bit of a dunce...

They probable fell off, hey Lucas *LMAO*

No its not common, most run what they call Rock Sliders which are just beefed up side steps and most run Steel bars

soulburner2000
3rd May 2013, 07:57 PM
I do see where you're coming from Toddie, but my GQ auto did last for 6 years after I bought it (although I didn't use it for 5 of those), and I paid less than $3000 for the whole vehicle, so I'm not too shattered with what's happened. As I've mentioned, I've only recently taken an 'interest' in these rigs, and I plan on trying to learn as much as I can about them - I've learned so much already.

I wouldn't NOT buy another auto because this one has crapped out. But may not be worth it getting auto rebuilt, as the motor has 520,000 on it and will likely not be far behind crapping out as well. I'm not sure what to do yet, probably best to do some more research, get a few more opinions I reckon.

But I do understand that people are passionate about the auto/manual debate and I really don't favour either- at the moment I could go either way...

lhurley
3rd May 2013, 07:59 PM
I am still speculating that your torque converter has died or nearly there. In mine the bearing in it failed, destroying the tc and cooking the rest of the box. In mine, due to the postition of reverse (3rd shares a common clutch), i melted all the teeth off reverse, losing reverse and 3rd.
Im not saying thats whats happened to yours, mine was a worst case scenario, but still something to consider.

lhurley
3rd May 2013, 08:02 PM
I do see where you're coming from Toddie, but my GQ auto did last for 6 years after I bought it (although I didn't use it for 5 of those), and I paid less than $3000 for the whole vehicle, so I'm not too shattered with what's happened. As I've mentioned, I've only recently taken an 'interest' in these rigs, and I plan on trying to learn as much as I can about them - I've learned so much already.

I wouldn't NOT buy another auto because this one has crapped out. But may not be worth it getting auto rebuilt, as the motor has 520,000 on it and will likely not be far behind crapping out as well. I'm not sure what to do yet, probably best to do some more research, get a few more opinions I reckon.

But I do understand that people are passionate about the auto/manual debate and I really don't favour either- at the moment I could go either way...

Dont discourage the auto because youve had some bad luck, ive been in the same boat. Im happy with my auto now, dont get me wrong, i love driving a manual, but the auto is still good too.

Clunk
3rd May 2013, 08:34 PM
I know what I'll be doing if my auto craps itself......... fixing it!!!!!!! Love my auto.
But that being said, my gq does have 300k's less than yours, so also see where you're coming from and there's also that risk factor Toddie is on about when buying a new car........ choices, choices mate, I sure don't envy you.

taslucas
3rd May 2013, 08:44 PM
They probable fell off, hey Lucas *LMAO*

No its not common, most run what they call Rock Sliders which are just beefed up side steps and most run Steel bars

lol well i took the factory side steps off before i ripped them off (they are totally soft and weak). The bullbar on the other hand: I had a alloy one and snapped a tree off with it so it was a little bit bunged up after that lol. So then i sourced a nice steel one and got a mate to modify it. Its been painted and ive just picked it up so ill have a big fat steely on it soon. Definately been playing with fire driving at speed through the bush with any front bar.

soulburner2000
4th May 2013, 12:30 AM
I am still speculating that your torque converter has died or nearly there. In mine the bearing in it failed, destroying the tc and cooking the rest of the box. In mine, due to the postition of reverse (3rd shares a common clutch), i melted all the teeth off reverse, losing reverse and 3rd. ime
Im not saying thats whats happened to yours, mine was a worst case scenario, but still something to consider.

Yeah, I give up speculating on what caused it. If it isn't totally stuffed now, it's only a matter of time until it gets there.

I took my trans oil cooler off yesterday (still in really good nick on the outside), but when I tipped the oil out it was black! I think cooler must've been blocked. But I changed the oil/filter in the auto not that long ago, and the oil going into the radiator is still the proper reddish colour. I applied air pressure and flushed it with clean oil and put it back on.

Haven't had a chance to see if it made a difference as I lost reverse later that night, and haven't driven it since.....

soulburner2000
2nd February 2017, 08:56 PM
After however many years of dormancy since my last post, I have decided to dust the thing off, remove all of the stored car parts I have inside of it, and have another go at getting this thing back on the road.